Comments and Responses / Chanting produces criminality? / PADA is zero / ISKCON India? / 8/22/13

1) Chanting: Makes People Promote Criminals?
2) PADA is a big fat zero!
3) More comments
4) Is ISKCON Going to be taken over in India?
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1) Chanting: Makes People Promote Criminals?

PADA: Thanks prabhu, yes we have heard this many times over the past 35 years, the followers of the GBC gurus (and people like Prahlad das) have been saying that those of us who are critics of the GBC gurus and their criminal program are "not chanting our rounds." And that has suppressed our complaints, which in turn has enabled the bogus messiahs program to go forward.  

Their idea is, the people who ARE "chanting their rounds" are "the sincere devotees," never mind they tend to be the number one group of co-conspirators with the GBC gurus by -- acquiescing, aiding, abetting, assisting, covering up for, and perhaps even acting as direct servants of -- a criminal enterprise. The "best chanters" are -- the people who are not critical of the GBC's guru program and its criminal outcroppings, and this argument has helped along the criminal's empire all along. 

GBC guru followers and Prahlad types for example now complain we "are not chanting our rounds," and following their GBC gurus like lost sheep (as they are) and instead we bought out the bogus appointment issue, changed books issue, molesting issue, poison issue, and so on, because apparently, they love bogus self-appointed gurus, changed books, molesters posing as gurus, and guru poisoners? Why else would they object to us addressing these issues? They are madly in love with deviants posing as messiahs, plain and simple.   

This also sounds like a really bad advertisement for chanting the names of God? The more one chants the names of God, the more one loses all sense of right and wrong, and the more one becomes a compliant foolish sheep who blindly follows a "criminals as messiahs" program without even asking challenging questions -- because one is "chanting their rounds" -- instead of asking these questions? Yep, this means these GBC types and Prahlad types are insulting the holy names by saying anyone who chants the holy names sincerely, becomes a blind sheep in the hands of criminal messiahs. 

Of course now Prahlad das has shown us even more reasons why he is the only sincere chanter around, since he is currently aiding, abetting and promoting his new program, i.e. his beef eaters and animal hunters speakers on his Illuminati DVDs, these are his new authorities and his de facto gurus. Its merely another deviation. Sulochana dasa also said, anyone who opposes us is supporting the bogus gurus, he was right. 

Its not about who is chanting and who is not, its about who can see which gurus are bona fide and who cannot. That the "sincere chanters" are the people who are promoting the bogus GBC gurus, or Prahlad's beef eating and animal hunters -- speakers, authorities and gurus, this is -- a bad advert for chanting if there ever was any.  

That is what Prahlad now says, because devotees are not joining him in promoting his beef eating and animal hunter's DVDs as his new gurus, these people are "not chanting their rounds." He is advertising against chanting. Even the ordinary karmis we know -- tell us Prahlad's Illuminati DVDs are foolish, speculative and even demoniac, only Prahlad and his group think theses DVDs are divine knowledge, and they are so foolish they think these speakers are divine, apparently -- because, Prahlad's speakers eat beef and promote animal hunting. 

This is the new standard of purity for the Prahlad group, promoting beef eating speakers? In any case, the good news is, hardly anyone is running off to join these folks, they see its not a serious program and moreover, mixing Krishna with beef eating speakers just makes no sense. Even the karmis know this is an offense to Krishna to mix Him with beef eating, since Krishna is always seen as a cowherd etc.

At the same time we wanted to show that we should beware, using the excuse that we have to "chant our rounds," while our Spiritual Master's house is burning down, is not a good way to manage a movement.  

ys pd

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2) PADA is a big fat zero!

All you do is ZERO. you do nothing but repeat the same crap for 30 years. You have done nothing and never will do anything. good going there, PADA way to set an example. Other people including Sulochan do all the work and you think you can take the credit.

Anonymous
on 8/18/13

[PADA: This is getting really strange? We have one group of critics who say:

(A) PADA is a big fat zero, and has had no impact whatever in 35 years;

(B) Then we have another group of critics like some GBC followers, who are totally panicked over the PADA program, saying we have had major influence and consequences over the past 35 years with our program, which they claim has "given ISKCON trouble over the world." 

Obviously, we cannot have had both "zero impact" and at the same time "major impact all over the world," all at the same time. Our critics seem to have no actual idea which of their ideas is correct, zero impact cannot also be major impact at the same time? That's like saying PADA is a both "an insignificant flea," and "an atom bomb," all at the same time? Perhaps these critics need to start taking their medications?  

Some of PADA's friends complain to us recently that they are getting constant messages from people about how PADA has had such a tremendous impact on things over the years, that everyone should take notice of the dangers of PADA. OK, that means this group of critics are saying PADA is a major program of earth shattering proportions, which does not fit into the other critics theory that PADA is a big fat zero. Evidently our critics have never sat down together and decided what to call us, insignificant fleas -- or giant atom bombs?      

Anyway! Assuming we are big fat zeros, then why are some folks always complaining to us we are zeros for years together? We have a few people who keep writing to us every day, PADA you are a zero. So if some critics are writing about people who are zeros, then these critics are less than zeros. If one's life centers around writing about zero, one has become a zero oneself. 

We think the critics who say we have had major impact are correct, otherwise our friends would not be getting five messages a day "watch out for PADA." Hah hah, that means they are also giving us free advertising! "Watch out" means, for the most part, people will read it anyway! As one of our friends says, we are sometimes getting five messages a day from critics of PADA warning them "not to read from PADA," and that means, they are going right away to read PADA, and so is just about everyone else apparently. Then again the GBC folks have told people not to read PADA, well, its not working is it?

ys pd]

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MORE COMMENTS:

I see a rather foreboding 5-pointed star looming menacingly on the world stage. Seated at the respective points on this star are the following:- The Rakshasas, the Illuminati, the CIA, the GBC and the followers of the GBC. If perceived, this star will facilitate the observer to choose his future – dark or light. If not perceived, then I suggest that one is ill-equipped to choose a path that is in any sense related to Gaudiya Vaisnavism. Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur warns us of the dharmadvaji. Do we know what he said in this regard? Can we afford to have a look? After all, the Thakur was not in ISKCON. on Real Problem: GBC Not Accountable (By Mahasringha das)

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In response to I agree with pd! The present ISKCON is no more a safe ship to cross over this miserable ocean of material existence. It was taken over by the drunk pirates immediately after Srila Prabhupada's departure, and sober men don't even think to accompany them in their deadly journey., by

1.SuperMind.

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First of all we have to understand ISKCONite level of consciousness http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QcE5aDTszrY on Rocana's "Moving Ahead" to Where?

Anonymous
on 8/19/13

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Dear PADA, what are the news about Mahanidhi Swami? Why this secrecy? What are your agents saying? on Rasa Lila Dance From India (Brijwani Cassette Video)

Anonymous
on 8/19/13

[PADA: There is secrecy every time one of these gurus falls down, what else is new? We heard that the house in Radha Kunda is empty, he is not there. Who knows? He may have been spirited off to a secret location until all this cools off, then he might re-emerge as if nothing happened, as some of these gurus have done in the past. ys pd]

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*** Srila Prabhupada said, "One should not imitate the rasa lila of Lord Krishna, not even in dreams" so I don't know why you say "One is allowed" ("following the footsteps" of the residents of Vrndavana) and one is forbidden (imitating them). Aren't they, Ramanand Sagar, etc. imitating the rasa lila of Lord Krishna, as banned by Srila Prabhupada?

[PADA: Correct, I said that imitation is not bona fide. Whether play acting in public videos, public plays and performances is imitation, I am not so sure? A play about Krishna by His devotees is not the same as imitation of Him as far as I can see. The gopis would also perform plays about Krishna's pastimes, these are great devotees of Krishna and not imitations of Krishna? I think you are confusing acting on a stage by devotees, with real live sahajiya imitations?]

*** How do we know THEY are in the proper mood, is it because YOU say they SEEM to be?

[PADA: Devotees cannot perform plays of the pastimes of Krishna? I am not sure where that is stated?]

I would like to have a little more authoritative information on the subject matter in question. Did Srila Prabhupada allow devotees to put on rasa lila plays or not? Did he say it was alright when boys used to dress as gopis and portray such things in the past? And what about the video you linked to where it appears to be a group entirely of women even the one playing the part of Lord Krishna? on Rasa Lila Dance From India (Brijwani Cassette Video)

Anonymous
on 8/18/13

[PADA: All I said is, they are not engaging in debauched behaviors as some "rasa lila" folks are doing. I also said these Krishna leela plays are a long standing historical tradition in India. Anyway yes, you should research the quotes on this topic, go ahead. We will publish the quotes if they are bona fide and from Srila Prabhupada. Just do it. 

As for folks like Ramanand Sagar, I hate to have to say this but, his videos of Krishna lila are doing more than almost anyone to promote Krishna's lila at the present time than almost anyone else. Its just not being done that much by others, and his videos are seen by millions of people on TV and theaters all over India and so on. I am not saying his videos are 100 percent accurate, but he is doing way more than anyone else is doing to interest people in Krishna and His lilas. Anyway, here are a few quotes on plays: ys pd]

SRILA PRABHUPADA: So you have got some talent for writing and producing dramas and now Krishna has given you the opportunity for dovetailing your talents in His service. Very good. When I go there I shall be very glad to see these dramas enacted. Yes, I acted the part of Advaita Prabhu in one such drama. I organized that theater performance in my youth hood. 

My friends were trained up and we performed and it was very much appreciated by the highest class of men in Calcutta. We were invited to many places to perform the drama. 

Lord Caitanya inaugurated these Vaisnava dramas, it is true, but where to obtain such copies of these plays I do not know. While performing such dramas, always the actors must be Vaisnavas. Outsiders may help but devotees should have all the major roles. So you may perform such plays conveniently. It is a very nice program, but do not sacrifice other programs on account of it.
- Letter to Vrindaban Candra – Bombay 13 April, 1971

People will appreciate such kirtana without hesitation. Even dramas about the pastimes of Lord Caitanya or Sri Krishna should be played by devotees. Such dramas will immediately interest an audience and be full of potency. The students of the International Society for Krishna Consciousness should note these two points and try to apply these principles in their spreading of the Lord’s glories.
- Madhy Lila 11.95

I am especially pleased to hear that our KC drama program is being developed by you nicely. We have got unlimited stock for such dramas, so go on in this way, improving more and more, and Krishna will give you direction so that one day, very soon, your all dreams will come true and you will be acting our KC dramas on the Broadway.

Everyone enjoys play-acting, only there is at present a dearth of proper material for elevating the general mass of people to the proper standards. Practically, the whole world is going to hell. There is no decency, no gentleman anywhere. So we have to portray to the people of this fallen Age of Kali-yuga what is the right standard for their behavior. When they see that, Oh, here is such nice activity, such nice people, they will automatically become changed, simply we have to engage their senses in the right taste. So this drama-playing is very good presentation for attracting their attention and displaying Krishna Consciousness very beautifully. Make everything very simple, without too much fancy costumes, and the real message will come out very nicely……

…..So in combination with the others you go on thinking how to improve these KC plays and dramas and how to give the public more and more of Krishna Consciousness. That is real preaching work.
- Letter to Nayanabhirama – Bombay, 22 December 1971

So I do not care very much for these plays and dramas unless they are coming directly from the Vedas. If we can recite from Bhagavad gita the first chapter without any need for elaborate scenery or stage-props and gorgeous dresses, that is best. Just like your Shakespeare. Macbeth may be recited by two men, without anything else, and simply by their acting ability and the meaningful words alone, they can very easily capture the entire audience and give them real substance. We have so many stories, like Jagai-Madhai, Krishna departing for Mathura, like that. Satire will not help us. Our message is very grave, and because it is the Absolute Truth, it will work without any artificial presentation.
- Letter to Madhuvisa London, 8 July, 1972

Regarding the dramas, my point is not to deviate from gravity and compromise or distract from the situation. Keep this point in vision and continue. That is a very good proposal to stage one play based upon Lord Caitanya. Read TLC on the stage, just like Caitanya Mahaprabhu is giving instruction to Sanatana Goswami, and the actors may speak little philosophy, without need for special costumes or other things. Then kirtana. There must be always kirtana. Dialogue, kirtana; then again dialogue, again kirtana; again repeat; like that. No humor should be there, just philosophy and kirtana. If it is successful, then the same dialogue-kirtana may be followed by other sankirtana parties in Europe and America.
- Letter to Madhuvisa – Amsterdam, 29 July, 1972

Yes, I did not see your drama in New Vrndavana about the advent of Lord Krsna. But I have heard from others that it was done very nicely, so I am very much pleased. These kinds of dramas about Krsna, Krsna's pastimes, and also Lord Caitanya's pastimes, are very much desirable for presenting to the public widely. So if you can organize your traveling party to present such dramas all over your country and other places that will be very much appreciated. Perhaps you can work together with Visnujana for presenting our road show opera to the public also. I had opportunity to see that opera in Pittsburgh and it was very well done, with a lot of drama and dancing as well. You may keep me informed from time to time what is the progress of your play-acting group, Vaikuntha Players.
- Letter to Nayanabhirama – Los Angeles, 18 Septempber 1972

………and I have noted the contents, along with the drama-script from Srimad-Bhagavatam. It is very nice. This kind of play-acting is wanted. Now introduce it to your country-men very nicely presented. Emphasis should be given to the words of Bhagavat, they are spiritual and will have powerful effect if someone only hears them with attention, do not be very much enamoured by fancy costumes and stage-decorations, they will only distract. Real acting art is to know how to speak. The greatest dramas, even in your western culture, they can be played without any extra equipment. Just like your Shakespeare--sometime I saw they were playing one drama, I think Hamlet or something like that, and only two men were there on the bare stage and everyone was praising. So the art is catching their ears. Now in that spirit go on with your work and try to do something wonderful.
- Letter to Jayadhrama – Ahmedabad 13 December 1972

Dramas are alright if you can perform them nicely. Even if you don't speak them in English, they can be rendered into Hindi on the microphone while the drama goes on.
- Letter to Aksayananda – Calcutta, 13 January 1976
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You don't post anyone's comments but your own. you are same as rocana. on Rocana's "Moving Ahead" to Where?

Anonymous
on 8/18/13

[PADA: Posting quotes from trolls does not help anyone. ys pd]

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Why are you all just blaming him, the women in his life, they also should shoulder some of the shame, and also receive some of the criticism. Why don't these women find a nice single man. There will always be a category of women who will attach themselves to either a sanyasi or married man, these women should be vilified and maybe in the future they will think twice before taking part in these karmic paths of degradation. on RE: Mahanidhi -- RECENT COMMENTS (with our responses):

Anonymous
on 8/18/13

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Sir, sir! whats with Mahanidhi now? GBC paper clearly states he is fallen down. Signed by two GBC leaders. For days Mahanidhi didnt say anything. His last explanation is that it is all made up and - a lie. So far so good. What is this called, your word against mine - one person's word against another's? Mahanidhi objected the GBC paper. Now again radio silence. Are they discussing if their first falldown message was wrong? How can this happen? Is GBC defective or Mahanidhi a liar? Or are both untrustworthy? Thanks for clarification! on Balaram Jayanti Festival on August 18th @ Sunnyvale temple

Anonymous
on 8/18/13

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Like all other issues - poison issue, abused children, initiation issue, Goura Govinda Swami issue - TKG is yet another issue that causes Western Vaishnavism to split into multiple hostile camps. No agreement since 20 years. Meanwhile all preaching programs are stopped to zero because of all those infights.

Each group believes their explanation is crystal clear. Only problem, the other group says, nope, we never accept your version. Tell you what, there is a totally different problem at the bottom line. None of these groups is able to do any preaching or establish any successful impressive transcendental project! Nothing zero. Well yes, ISKCON Bangalore.

However, all US Prabhupadanugas basically reject ISKCON Bangalore's prasadam program calling it mundane welfare. When Madhu Pandita pr started Krishna-lila theme park in Bangalore this was totally torn in pieces as Disneyland madness by every single US Prabhupadanuga. In sum, the only successful project, ISKCON Bangalore is on Why Some Say PADA Caused Tamal's Untimely Departure?

Anonymous
on 8/18/13

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Is ISKCON Going to be taken over in India?

[PADA: Some folks sent us a letter a long time ago saying that ISKCON in India was going to be shut down by the government very soon, well that has not happened as they predicted. Instead, we see exactly the opposite going on, namely all kinds of big shots and important government leaders are hanging out with the GBC's gurus over there. Meanwhile, we are told Swami Nithyananda is back in action after he was busted there? Is that right? India seems to have very little standard for acharyas? Apparently, even after a person is busted they get back in the saddle very shortly thereafter. Or what?

Of course, if the India government takes over any religion, then it might become another victim of another set of swamis, yogis and avatars who will be running these places instead, and who knows what kind of problems those people will be having. Just because someone places a new set of managers, gurus and swamis into an institution, does not mean there will not be any more problems. There are problems with bogus gurus all the time in India, not just in ISKCON. Read the news papers in India and you will find various stories about yogis and swamis having problems, then again in usa we have priests who have troubles, so this is a problem everywhere really.

At the same time, we see so many cartoons from India making fun of India's politicians, its seems the people over there have little faith that their own government can manage things. Is the India government going to be able to manage say for example, the Akshaya Patra program, if they seize it? And what happens if they cannot? 

The real problem for the government of India is -- if they seize ISKCON's property, then they might get compared in the world's media to say, Stalin's taking over the churches and so forth, it may make the India government look backwards and a bit dictatorial. Perhaps that is the reason they have not acted a long time ago. 

In any event, whatever happens is in Krishna's hands, if the institution is taken over, that's not going to stop people from worship of Srila Prabhupada and Krishna over there, rest assured. If the original institution fails, and Srila Prabhupada said it could, the movement will go on in an undercover status for some time and come out again under another name and so on, as has happened to the Gaudiya Vaishnava religion already hundreds of times over the past thousands of years, its disappears and re-surfaces over and over, and this happens all the time. And sometimes a good shake up is required to get people back to the basics. ys pd]