Shishir Katote / Bhakta das / Mrinmayi etc. "Beer Drinking kulis"

[PADA: This is very odd. Rocana makes a (false flag) post about the ex-gurukulis drinking beer, but they were drinking ginger ale. Then the Bhakti Vikas swami people are quoting from Rocana, who attacks these ex-kulis. Are Rocana and BVKS people working together? 

Anyway, no one seems to be able to answer our question, if these children have become confused in the process of Krishna consciousness, who caused that? We say, its people like Rocana and Bhakti Vikas swami who promoted the bogus GBC guru system, which not only confused the children, it made many of them reject the religion wholesale. 

They are blaming the victims. Shishir is citing Rocana who is blaming the ex-kulis, instead of blaming Bhakti Vikas swami who supported the whole debauchee / molester guru infrastructure, which messed up these kulis in so many ways, no one can even count the problems the BVKS program caused for these children. They are blaming the victims.] 

Shishir Katote R -- 'Qualified Brahmins' from Kirtaniyas group quaffing beer and sporting bikini! Is sacred thread so cheap? Should the sacred thread be taken from them and given back after they give up beer? Is there any such provision in scriptures?

William G Benedict: That varna ashram is what had not yet been established by Prabhupada. It was his desire. These boys and girls are not Prabhupada's own disciples obviously. Who is responsible for them I'm unable to know.

[PADA: Bhakta das says these children are not disciples of Srila Prabhupada. OK, and how did that happen? It happened because people like Bhakta das have been supporting the worship of the GBC's bogus gurus, and thus many of these children were initiated by these bogus gurus. Bhakta das caused these children to "not be disciples" of Srila Prabhupada by supporting the false gurus program. 

Then he says, he has no idea who is responsible for that, well he is! And he will be judged for his karma of his turning the ISKCON children away from the worship of Srila Prabhupada as their guru. Bhakta das thinks varnasrama is based on the worship of his illicit sex gurus, no, that is called worship of maya. 

And now Bhakta das is promoting Radhanath swami as the biggest guru of the jagat. And the Radhanath program is the same as the Kirtanananda / Bhavananda program, which orchestrated mass abuse of many children. And now the Mukunda  / Prahlad das / Paul UK folks finally admit, they too are also promoting Bhakta das so they can get even more children victims to worship Radhanath, to perpetuate their worship of the persons who created the whole child abuse insfrastructure in the first place. Then they say, the children are not happy with the religion, no kidding, they have contaminated the religion with their pedophile pooja process. 

Bhakta das / William Benedict says, he has no idea how all this happened. Well all he has to do is to look into a mirror to see who promoted the molester messiahs program, and who still is. Of course there are those who say that some of Bhakta's / Radhanath's / Prahlad's gurus -- poisoned Srila Prabhupada.]   

Anantavijaya Das I found this discussion very interesting. I born from an ISKCON devotee parents here in Bali, Indonesia, and I never touch meat, liquor, tea and cofee up till this second. And there are quite a few like me here in Bali, the children of ISKCON devotees. Are we brahmins..? Thank you. It's clearer for me now about what is brahmana and vaishnava.. 

Mrinmayi Desai: shyama nityanand ji: how can you call yourself dvija bandhu if you have not got a birth in brahmin family? you must take another birth in brahmin family and behave in non brahminical way to become dvija bandhu this title is very expensive. yes you can transcend brahmanas in bhakti and get even more respect in this life. but if you are not born in brahmin family you cant be dvija bandhu.

With all respects, i want to tell you that the goal is not to become brahmana but reach vaikuntha. also, there is a difference between nitya dharma and naimittika dharma. please read jaiva dharma, chapter 6, conversation between cudamani and vaisnava dasa. yesterday itself i showed it to shishir. i dont have a soft copy he may furnish the quote here.

Sameer Katote a person cannot become by spending 50 paise?

[PADA: Bhakta Shushir supports the GBC gurus process, some of whom have been drinking beer?]

Anantavijaya Das Thank you. I understand about the goal. I have read Jaiva Dharma. I just try to understand more about brahmana. Actually I can say that I did all the requirements mentioned by Shyam Nityanand Prabhu.

Mrinmayi Desai I am not against Srila Prabhupada or Srila Bhaktisiddhanta for they supported sacred threads to mlecchas. It can be because when Prabhupada was in USA, he did not have an Indian brahmana who could perform deity worship. 

Shashank Katote Brahmanas of kali. I never pay any attention to these "kirtaniyas". They use mahamantra to make money.

[PADA: OK, so the kirtaniyas are disciples of Kali yuga, and bogus, according to folks associated with ISKCON, and they are at the same time always going to ISKCON temples? If they are making money, how much are they really making? They could probably all get jobs and make lots of money. Anyway, they are part of the ISKCON process, at the same time, people associated with ISKCON are attacking them. Is there no loyalty in the ISKCON camp? Why is this group not saying that the GBC acharyas program is bogus for their illicit sex, drugs and so on?]

Daniel Neighbors All of you have been too quick to pass judgement. These are nice devotees doing nice service. They were drinking Ginger beer, NOT alcoholic beer. Please see the photos below. Sampradaya Sun issued an apology for jumping to conclusions as many of you have.

Silly people. BTW, they don't make lots of money doing kirtan as someone suggested. They barely make ends meet.

[PADA: Right, no one makes money unless they are GBC gurus or their paid up lackeys.]

Mrinmayi Desai Mr Daniel, you are funny. You cannot see that beer is a secondary discussion. Primary discussion is bikini show. Do you approve this? Would you be happy if your wife/daughter is enjoying in the swimming pool with the other half naked men by hugging.

[PADA: Good point, the GBC says their gurus are falling into illicit sex with men, women and children, why would you want your children, or even your family cat, to worship such a sabha?] 

Nipuna Devi Dasi some of the people pictured are married. to each other. it's not sex frolicking. judge much?

[PADA: Well yes, at least many of the kulis are now married, whereas we often find the GBC's gurus are having illicit sex without being married, good point. So the kirtaniyas have to have a higher standard than the acharyas? This is hypocrisy.]

Mrinmayi Desai A is married to Y, B is married to Z. A and B are men, Y and Z are women. Y is half naked in front of a man who is not her husband and same with Z. Does sastra approve this? Is there a single example in sastras that such thing was allowed. 

[PADA: Is it allowed in shastra to say acharyas engage in illicit sex, as the GBC guru system says?]

If this is not offensive then why don't these women go to temple in bikini? After all it is not "sex frolicking", as Mother Nipuna has pointed. She does not find anything wrong with this. Prabhupada asked women to wear sarees and these women are sporting bikinis.

Anantashesh Das Jps: There are many misled brahmans in India too. Look at this picture. Who knows what all activities they engage in besides smoking. I think Ginger beer is much better than gaanjaa


[PADA: Good point, the GBC gurus are also associated with drinking beer, schnops, and smoking ganga, taking percodan, LSD, ecstacy drugs, you name it. Satsvarupa writes "I am being called the guru of pills."] 

Mrinmayi Desai Anantashesh - There is no proof that these babajis are officially brahmin initiated by any sampradaya. Can you provide any proof for this? But there is a proof that the pretenders in the pic posted here are officially initiated in ISKCON. Also, according to you, mleccha and yavana vaisnavas are superior to brahmana vaisnavas. Your understanding of sastras in itself is tatterdemalion.

[PADA: OK so why are these pretenders always advertised by ISKCON?]

Anantashesh Das Jps A vaishnavs is a vaishnav.there is no high-low in vaishnav. wen did I say that? you are accusing me of what I hav nt even said!

Also, see this quote by Srla Prabhupada about babajis in Vrindavanadhaama:

There are many babajis. They are collecting ...

[PADA: And the GBC gurus are associated with these babajis ...]

Mrinmayi Desai Funny. You could not prove that these babajis are bonafide brahmanas. And which of my argument has been defeated by you? Just by wearing vaisnava tilaka, does one become vaisnava? Show me the proof if these babajis are really brahmin initiated. 

[PADA: The GBC says that people engaged in illicit sex are giving initiations, how is that possible?]

Mrinmayi Desai Note: Brahmin initiated means having become srotriya brahmana after taking birth in brahmin family. Birth in brahmana family is the first birth. Without this first birth one cannot take second birth to become dvija.

[PADA: This is good.]

Shishir Katote R Whatever. but we must agree that they did not have alcohol. you may talk against bikini show. but it does not prove that it is alcohol. lets be honest. anantashesha prabhu, show me a single pic where indian brahmana couple is going half naked with other couples. the pics you have shown does not prove anything. because these babajis are not brahmanas.

[PADA: Show us one example of gurus in the parampara engaged in illicit sex and / or drinking beer, like BVKS gurus are found doing?]

Daniel Neighbors Not that I necessarily have a problem with your doing so Mrinmayi, but in "Vedic Culture" women didn't argue with and debate with men they don't know. Assuming of course that you are who you represent yourself to be in your profile.

[PADA: OH oh, here we go again, women cannot speak up in a debate, they have to sit around and let foolish men do things like -- make molesters into acharyas? Why can't women speak up when something is wrong? This is not helping Daniel prabhu. We need to encourage women to know the shastra and to preach strongly when shastra is being violated. We are not saying the women here are speaking the right thing, but the principle that women should be allowed to speak is important.]

Mrinmayi Desai How can you decide Daniel that I am arguing? Argument is not allowed to both, men and women. Where it is stated that only women cannot argue? You call everybody silly when they are supporting what is true. Seems that you are also shared a part of money. ...

Angela Johnson lol Mrinmayi, in your profile there is a pic where you have argued with people without any reason. Many elder people have been offended by you. Mr Padmanabha Desai, who seems to be your relative, is declaring you have lost a blood relation with him.

Mrinmayi Desai You don't know what was the argument about. Do you know what is the meaning of sudra? Let me make it clear to people here. The topic is can sudra perform bhakti. As usual, my relatives were against it. Rest you know.

Angela Johnson You are free to speak whatever you want. I trust my world with the lord. HE knows what is right. Animals CAN be eaten by the superior creatures. It is the law of nature. You don't trust that. I cant help it.

Vijaya Gopikesa Das Stop blaspheming Mrinmayi. And reply to her arguments. Its vaisnava aparadha to speak against her. She is initiated in madhva sampradaya which is authentic sampradaya. Its due to her I got entry into Raghavendra Swami mutt when they allow only brahmanas to enter.

Mathias Sabji Mrinmayi Desai ........mamamia mamamia!! You are a very heavy demon! Nothing more! No soft heart, no merciful , no humble, no women more a heavy pit bull male dog, no real transcendental knowledge about VEDIC SASTRA ( only hindu caste brahmana blah blah).

SB 4.8.54 Purport:

Those who are not actually in the line of acaryas, or who personally have no knowledge of how to act in the role of acarya, unnecessarily criticize the activities of the ISKCON movement in countries outside of India. 

Your post with brahmana , ksatryia , Vaishiya and sudra spiritual masters is irrelevant mataji ! Because every body can become a brahmana in kali yuga, especially by pancaratriki vidhi initiation !!! Brahmana means by gunas , by qualities , not by birth. Stop your indian nationalism caste brahmana foolosophy. All indian are same sudras in general like all westerns in kali yuga. It is vedic sastra knowledge! But it is right that to take birth in india is a better chance to become a Vaisnava. Yes. But in same time you must understand that the indian or better vedic culture was brought to india from central asia!

[PADA: India today is the place where most of the GBC's gurus are always hanging out and making many disciples. These bogus gurus rarely even appear in the West. There is a problem in India with people understanding the siddhanta, that acharyas are not debauchees. The GBC says all the time that acharyas fall into illicit behavior, and the mass of people in India are not challenging that. Anyway, there is a problem with the kirtaniyas, they are good for making advertising for ISKCON, then they are shot down and criticized at the drop of a hat in the ISKCON circles. Is this not exploiting them, as was the problem some of them had when they were five years old? ys pd]