Hanumat Prakesh Swami Thinks He Is Another Jesus?

[PADA: Hanumat Prakesh Swami already says he agrees -- that the ISKCON GBC diksha guru takes karma from the followers. And he claims to be a diksha guru himself. How did Hanuman Prakesh Swami become an equal to Jesus all of a sudden, and he and his pals can then absorb the sins of others?]

http://krishna1008.blogspot.com/2019/10/hanumat-prakesh-swami-
agrees-diksha.html

Hanumat Prakesh swami and Jayapataka.

Why would we tell neophytes to absorb sins knowing:

It is harming them?

[PADA: Hanumat often encourages other neophytes like Jayapataka swami to take sins as diksha gurus. However Srila Prabhupada says that taking sins as a diksha guru is very dangerous for a neophyte, and its thus the path of getting sick, falling down -- and as we see -- dying prematurely. 

This is what shastra says will happen when neophytes absorb sins as diksha gurus, they will degrade. Why does Hanumat want to see other Vaishnavas get sick, fall down, degrade and even die? And why does he encourage people down that destructive path, seeing the odious results going on left, right and center? 

For example some Jayapataka people sent out a message, "Let us pray for our guru maharaja because he is ill from taking our sins." Wait a minute? We are supposed to violate the orders of Krishna, and have these kanisthas taking sins like they are another Jesus, and then pray to Krishna to help us keep up that deviation? Why do these people like Hanumat think we can defy Krishna's process, then pray to Krishna to fix our deviations?

There is simply no instruction where Srila Prabhupada says the kanisthas have the same potency as Jesus and they can absorb other's sins. Srila Prabhupada says that Jesus is STILL taking the sins of his sincere followers even now, despite 2,000 years have passed. 

Hanuman ilk are saying, why bother with Jesus -- we need to have people think the rank and file priest is the (diksha) primary person taking their sins (not Jesus). That means the people will not have their sins resolved, and that also means the bogus Jesus will be loading himself up with sins that will take him down, as we see happening all the time with these hokey "sin absorbing" ISKCON gurus.]   

Mutual understanding must be clear..

Dear Hanumat Prakesh Maharaj, PAMHO! AGTSP!

Thank you for discussing these issues with us.

You said:

HpS - Jaya! Again. Again. Again. These are all things we have discussed here before. I hope our opinion is clear. We go on discussing it but for us you are not presenting anything new, so we are happy to talk in person some time but we seem to have exhausted this forum sad much as possible in terms of mutual understanding.

SSD: Actually what you said was not clear.

HpS - Not clear to who? Even Krsna does not know Balarama, the original Guru-tattva perfectly. He is always increasing. For me I have a practical understanding. We have published it in: 

http://www.jayarama.us/kd/guru-tattva.txt.

SSD: even your “disciples” are confused.

HpS - Actually only one of them mentioned this dialog to me and their comment was kind of informal that it was interesting but it seemed a little tiresome. I think it is one of the best dialogs I have had on this topic on the Blog. If they don't understand then they are not my disciples right.

SSD: You claim to be a diksa guru and then turning around and saying you are just a "formalities siksa guru only."

HpS - Boy! Never say this. I, you, can both be practical Siksa gurus, just as Vartmana prasarshika gurus, telling people buy a book, and then we can be Siksa gurus for Madhyama adhikaris by repeating Shastra or teaching how we are able to eat and sleep less, read more etc.

[PADA: We can be shiksha gurus for Madhyam Adhikaris? That makes no sense even, we are not preaching to Madhyam people? Of course we keep hearing that anyone who follows the basic kanistha sadhana is already a Madhyam, even Rocana / Kailash say that. No, Madhyam starts at the "anartha nivritti" level, or the disappearance of unwanted habits and behaviors. 

Clearly the GBC guru folks are not on that level as a group. Of course, even a kanistha follows the sadhana practice nicely, and yet we find the GBC gurus not even at that level left, right and center. Kanistha, or less, is being telescoped into Madhyam, and that is one of their justifications for making neophytes into acharyas. Except, the Nectar of Instruction says Madhyam also should not take the post of acharya.

We simply do not find that the Madhyam Adhikari "anartha free" program is working in the GBC's guru sabha, instead we keep finding fallen behavior that is worse than Kanistha Adhikari (bona fide neophytes). Bona fide neophytes do not engage in all the debauchee behaviors we have kept seeing manifesting in the GBC's guru sabha. 

Meanwhile, we still see various GBC gurus saying they are NOT merely priests or shiksha gurus, they claim they are absorbing sins as Jesus-like Diksha Gurus. And they also are often getting Vyasa poojas -- guru poojas, guru daksine (money donations) and so forth, which is only applied to uttama diksha gurus.]  

SSD: This is really confusing. If you say Srila Prabhupada is the diksa guru, that needs to be clear. It is very clear to me and it should be to you and others.

HpS - We have tried to get a "Clear" "German precise" definition of Diksa guru, we are glad to adopt any position if we be near Srila Prabhupada's lotus feet, but it was not clear. Then we heard Hrdayananda Goswami and our good disciple, Radhika-Ramana Das, who chants his rounds and follows four principles for decades and is also an Oxford scholar and Sanskritist that there is not emphasis on Diksa in our Sampradaya, so the definition is not so hard. 

[PADA: Except Hrdayananda says he is a diksha guru in the parampara, and that means he is claiming to be an Uttama Adhikari who can absorb sins like Jesus. Meanwhile many other GBC claim that Hrdayananda is bogus for: His Krishna West deviation; His previous support of Bhavananda and Kirtanananda; His constant chit chat with ladies, and so on and so forth. Why would the GBC say (A) Hrdayananda is a diksha guru who can absorb sins like Jesus, therefore (B) he and his Krishna West is bogus? 

And if there is "no emphasis on diksha," why are people being kicked out of ISKCON when they object to deviants taking the post of diksha gurus? If anything, there is a severe requirement to accept that deviants are part of the process of diksha gurus, or one is banned and removed (as we were).]

HpS - More is who is on the Kanishtha, Madhyama, Uttama, Sampradaya Acharya level. So again, taking the definition from 'kiba sudra kiba nyasi' verse we are a Diksa guru acting for our Acharya Srila Prabhupada. Even as Madhyama Adhikari we can accept disciples but only if they have accepted Srila Prabhupada as an Uttama Adhikari guru. That's pretty clear. Let us get back to work. How to get more books into the heart of more people.

[PADA: No, we neophytes cannot accept disciples as diksha gurus because then we are for starters, taking charge of their sins. As Srila Prabhupada says -- if we neophytes absorb the sins of others we will get sick, fall down, or both. A number of the false GBC gurus has died prematurely from taking sins. Srila Prabhupada says when an unqualified person takes the post of guru he WILL DEGRADE, as he states in the Nectar of Instruction. 

There is no recommendation for neophytes to claim they are equals to Jesus and they too can absorb sins. No such directive can be found anywhere?

Furthermore, such false gurus are "destined for the most obnoxious regions of the universe" along with their followers. Again! There is no instruction for neophytes to take the post of diksha gurus and absorb the sins of others and so forth, rather it is forbidden. When Hanumat says we (neophytes) are diksha gurus, he is just flat out not correct.]

SSD: If we try to mix both things, it just creates confusion and your siksa disciples will be confused. They will say HPS says he is a diksa guru, now saying he is a siksa formalities guru only and not a diksa guru. You say they should worship the Acarya (Srila Prabhupada) but they want to worship you (or other GBC gurus).

HpS - We have corrected some of the above, but one point is to ask how many of the people Srila Prabhupada initiated had a clear idea of Guru tattva. Many of us were initiated in like 1974 but thought that maybe Srila Prabhupada was conscious of everything we were doing. Revatinandana Swami asked Prabhupada if this was true and Srila Prabhupada answered that he was not the super soul. When he need to know something about a disciple Krsna would inform him and usually externally.

[PADA: What is a guru parampara that is in a constant state of "correcting mistakes"? That means Hanumat is saying the acharyas are generally deviants who need to correct their bad behaviors, which is also called the mad elephant offense, to consider gurus are ordinary mundane men who need chastisement, correction, reform, monitoring for deviations, and so forth.

So the GBC keeps adding more and more corrective "guru position papers" which are chopping, changing, adding, subtracting, correcting, reforming and modifying their position on guru. That means they are not gurus but speculators. They have not realized the topic. 

"Change means rascal." 

Hanumat Prakesh is right, the GBC keeps "correcting" things on an ad hoc basis, and that means they have not been situated on the absolute plane all along. When they keep "correcting" and adding speculative materials on their directives over the guru issue, that is speculation. Then they have to try to correct the first mistake with other mistakes, which is why their position on guru is being altered, changed, re-designed and so forth all the time, now with a directive to make women the next wave of voted in gurus, and that means they are on the relative platform, not absolute.

Of course, the Hanumat Prakesh sampradaya buries pedophiles and porno swamis in samadhis, creating the illusion that worship of pedophiles and porno swamis in samadhis can remove one's karma and "save the souls" of their victims. No, its just means they are:

*** Cheating people into worshiping deviants in samadhis, 

*** Cheating the poor innocent public into thinking such worship will liberate them of their karma, 

*** Cheating people into thinking the deviants who bury pedophiles in samadhis are diksha gurus, 

*** Cheating people into thinking that a policy of banning, beating, suing and killing Srila Prabhupada's worshipers is creating good karma, and so on.] 

Hps -- I hope you can see that I would like to do my job better. I would like to see a better institutional ISKCON. I would like to see a better group of friends ISKCON, I would like to see my individual connection with Prabhupada better.

Are you chanting 16-nice rounds a day under the authority of Srila Prabhupada and following the four principles strictly. Have you received the Mantra from someone who received it from Srila Prabhupada and was himself doing 16 / 4? And trying to correct any deviations in the institution? If yes, then I can consider that you are a disciple of Srila Prabhupada. Have you seen the citation in the seventh canto about Prahlada Maharaja's relationship with his older Godbrothers.?

you commented: [https://monkeywarrior.com/detail/10635/]

Yes, we can talk of Guru tattva in Mexico. Basically Srila Prabhupada is Founder Acharya for you, me, everyone in ISKCON, no? Then he left over one-hundred volumes of instruction so why should we be confused, no? Basic principle is chant Hare Krsna and be happy.

SSD: Then what is your ROLE? If he (Srila Prabhupada) is founder Acharya for you, me and everyone in ISKCON, then your role is not DIKSA, it is of siksa only, why claim to be a diksa and confuse people? You are saying that everything is very clear but it is not!

HpS - We have discussed this above and in previous letters. We are claiming to be Diksa guru because we are the ones who 'initiate according to the process'. Why are you confused? We discuss this a LOT while traveling and lecturing. It is clear to the audiences. 

[PADA: We are initiating people according to the "process" of promoting illicit sex with men, women and children deviants as acharyas?]

HpS - Guru tattva is unlimited and expanding. We want to KNOW guru well enough to improve our service to Krsna. Are you following our Founder Acharya? Are you chanting 16/4. Are you keeping full morning program. If now, then you will not be able to chant 16-enthusiastic rounds. Then it will not be clear to YOU.

https://monkeywarrior.com/detail/10640/

SSD: You stated about letters shouldn’t be published here is Hansadutta's reply:
“I never heard this, who said this ? In the early years anyone who received a letter would duplicate it and send to the other centers, later on it became impractical”


HpS - Madhuvisa Das, one of the early devotees who had so many letters from Prabhupada told me that when they asked devotees for their letters for publishing he sent in a lot, but some he did not because they were personal.

[PADA: Madhuvisa das was a big supporter of the GBC's guru process and he was infuriated that I was calling the GBC's guru folks "the illicit sex with men, women and children guru lineage of deviants." At one time, I thought he was going to assault me while he was shouting at me about all this. People who vociferously defend the worship of illicit sex with men, women and children as "God's guru successors" programs should not be cited as our authority?  

Madhuvisa was later unable to drive due to going blind, and that is probably because he was apparently an alcoholic. He was also hated by a mother, maybe more than one, for his women chasing process. This allegedly got some of their daughters pregnant and so forth. In sum, he supported the worship of debauchees as God's messiahs because, he was one himself? Or what? 

Why would anyone support the worship of debauchees as Krishna's guru successors -- if had understood the teachings of Krishna? Or unless one wanted to justify one's own debauchee activities by claiming this is what messiahs are also doing? In any case, he is not qualified to speak on the topic, that is clear.

Where does Krishna says, find some nice illicit sex with men, women and children deviants, and make them My worshiped guru successors? Of course Madhuvisa did not like our publishing the letters, because the letters instruct us NOT to conduct these deviations. The letters exposed his promoting deviants as acharyas process as -- the path to hell. And it is. 

And that is also why ISKCON itself went to hell, and some of the ex-gurukula children report to me being in the schools of these GBC guru people was like being in a German concentration camp, it was hell on earth for them. 

Why are we citing the defenders of this process as our authority? As soon as someone says, we cannot have a banning, beating, molesting, lawsuits, police raids and murders program going on in Krishna's name, then people like Madhuvisa get into my face yelling and screaming that I should not object to that process. We should give Krishna a bad name for what good reason? We should create German concentration camps for children, for what good reason? We should worship illicit sex with taxi drivers as "Vishnupada" for what good reason etc.?]

Hps: Jayadvaita gives nice evaluation of the standard that Srila Prabhupada made for the authenticity of this letters. I told you, no, that it is in a letter to Brahmananda about nor circulating letters unless Prabhupada told him to do it. It is in Jayadvaita's intro to the Vedabase, "what you are getting".

[PADA: And Jayadvaita is the person who says the ISKCON gurus are falling into illicit sex with men, women and possibly children as well. So if someone says, God successors are poking everyone in the house, maybe also the family goat, then we should quote that person as our authority?]

Hansadutta Das told me that Prabhupada told him that every big man would have three secretaries. With the first he would discuss the general content of the letter. Then 1 would tell 2 what to write and 3 would type it and clean up the syntax. 2 would look at it and if o.k. initial it and give it to 1 and if number one initialed it the Big Man would just glance at it and sign it unless it was very specfic topic. I have not said to not cite letters here but just with this level of understanding them. Did Srila Prabhupada tell his secretary when asked for how long the GBC Secretaries should serve that they should serve 'for as long as they have life', and the secretary then typed up the letter as, "they should serve" for life? Prabhupada says that at 50 years old the life in the body is finished, that maybe you can push it to fifty five. See my point about letters??

A set of 5 volumes of prabhupada were published by Nischinya das

[PADA: Right, after Sulochan was murdered for publishing letters, then Nischintya got Sulochan's microfiche and he published them. So people are being murdered for publishing the letters, and Hanumat is with that group, he also says we should not have them published. He is with the people who murder devotees for publishing the letters of their guru?]


HpS - Five volumes of letters?

[PADA: Yes, Sulochan said its better to worship a bucket of dog stool rather than a GBC guru, because a bucket of dog stool will not ban, beat, molest and kill the vaishnavas. Hanumat is saying he and his GBC pals are another Jesus, and they can absorb sins, but why have we seen so much banning, beating, molesting, lawsuits, murders, and horrible public media -- if these people are really the equals to Jesus? 

Of course no one is more famous than Jesus. So if someone thinks he can perform the same feats as Jesus, and absorb sins like he does, then maybe that is their ticket to also being famous? Except Krishna says, He casts false prophets into the lowest regions of the universe and into the lowest species, so its not something that pays off long term.
ys pd]

Give me your karma?