Discussion on Gurus and Karma Etc.

https://twitter.com/i/status/1337607082237808642

EV: Who takes the karma in the GBC guru system? 

CV: You just have to take Srila Prabhupada into ur heart, he is the original guru. He can do it.

SS: Deeksha ka process kya hai.

AKM: Hare Krishna hare Krishna Krishna Krishna hare hare hare ram hare ram ram ram hare hare. 

GS: Only Shrila Prabhupada can take karma. Only He can.

AS: The Karma will be destroyed ... by chanting harinama ... and going Back to God Head, we will be in the hands of Guru and Krishna.

DSD: The Guru you took from. He will offer it to Srila Prabhupada and Srila Prabhupada will offer it to his guru. That is called parampara. Read Bhagavad Gita as it is.

ZD: There is no authentic guru in Iskcon. Only Srila Prabhupada!

LM Dasi: Only HDG Srila Prabhupada under the guidance of the Diksha Guru.

[PADA: Notice, these folks now no longer name "the diksha guru." Who is the diksha guru?]

MN: Krishna conscious devotee is free from his karma, he does only akarma.

IP: What you say is not authentic. Only a pure Devotee has no karma. Do you think that a person who is a drug addict, a carnivore, and commits all sorts of criminal acts will begin his spiritual life and the karmic repercussions will immediately disappear?

MN: I agree prabhu, pure devotee. Fake devotees can not be free from karma if he involves in nonsance activity.

IP: A self-appointed guru may receive the repercussions of the sinful deeds of his disciples, but a self-appointed guru cannot bring anyone back to God. There are only self-appointed gurus in the Iskcon, they are scammers. Only Srila Prabhupada can bring anyone back to Krishna.

[PADA: What we said all along.]

DP: I agree. Srila Prabhupada is the only acharya and he is the only deeksha guru. Srila Prabhupada is the one who will take all our karma which is committed without knowing and he is the one who takes us back to Godhead. When u r under the shelter of a pure devotee like Srila Prabhupada u will never commit any activities that can bound us to karma. That is possible only when one takes deeksha from Srila Prabhupada and not self appointed so called gurus.

IP: This is exactly as you wrote !!!

SP: Hare Krishna.  

ZP: There are no authorized or qualified diksha gurus in iskcon.

LB: If one studies Srila Prabhupada's July 9, 1977 Directive and Last Will and Testament and ALL of Srila Prabhupada's LEGAL documents, one will know that ONLY SRILA PRABHUPADA can give you DIKSHA. PERIOD. Others will take you to HELL for ETERNITY. No self-appointed or voted-in guru. ONLY A BONAFIDE GURU.... SRILA PRABHUPADA.

NM: The self appointed voted in bogus Guru in iskcon will take all your karma, and they all of them will go to hell with the bogus Guru after this life.

MS: No one, all so called gurus in ISKCON are committing vaishnava aparadha by giving unauthorized by Srila Prabhupada dikshas. If one blind person leads other blinds, they all will end up in pithole of Yamaraja.

YS: " ISKCON " INTERNATIONAL SOCIETY FOR KRISHNA CONCIUSNESS.

MD: Yes Right prabhuji yes. Read Shrila Prabhupada books. Prabhupada told them, I am there in my books. Prabhupada is there in vrundavan Juhu and Mayapur. Shrila Prabhupada is there only don't see with material eyes when u cry for Prabhupada he appears.

MS: Yes Srila Prabhupad is there, as soon as we surrender our heart to him as our ONLY shelter, rejecting EVERYTHING ELSE, in the heart .... he immediately gives his protection, guidance and diksha. I had this live experience. There is no need guru to be present material body as those iskcon rascals claim ... Connection with bona fide guru is spiritual and transcendental, and don't depend on anything material. Welcome to spiritual life, which is NOT material.. 

Bhagavad gita is the example, like Arjuna we should experience this spiritual stress in life, only being in this helpless stage we can SINCERELY pray to surrender to Srila Prabhupada's lotus feet, from the bottom of our heart. Then it will work, THEN Srila Prabhupad will be there ... and if he is there for us, then Lord Krishna is there too, behind Srila Prabhupada, then we will be in peace, in the heart, peace... then we can start to learn chanting hare krshna hare krshna, 

MD: In Isckon Guru not taking even responsibilities of ordinary shishya, yesa nahi hota hai. Agar shishya pap kerega usko Guru ko bhi pap mil jata hai. 

EJ: Prabhu Nityananda, you are amazing Hari Hari bol.

VW Dasi: Isn't it possible to live in Srila Prabhupada's books?

ZP: Mature devotees don’t need vapuh, only vani ...

LS Dasi: If it is done like that, then who is going to collect the temple donations ...

BH: Yes... we live in the transcendental sound vibration

LS Dasi: Srila Prabhupada Transcendental book distribution kiJai!!

BH: Please read this from GBC ... it's ridiculous ... and you want to take Diksa, then they say their guru may be "hopelessly entangled in sense gratification." They are producing bogus gurus as themselves tell us. 

DP: Yes! Seriously ridiculous. Still people are blindly accepting so called ISKCON gurus. Srila Prabhupada and Krishna only should save them.

KP Dasi: Does the GBC address the karma issue and taking back to Godhead issue anywhere at all? What is their opinion?

BH: They will tell you keep taking re-initiation ... which gets even more seriously ridiculous ... just crazy ... GBC doesn't know Arthur from Martha ... the "guru and disciples course" material shows how they are caught in their own logic trap ... so many contradictions. Only when your guru falls down can you worship Prabhupada ... temporarily. That means they cannot wait to set you up ... in another cheating.

Bhagavad-Gita 4.37 ... fire of knowledge burns up karma ... no need to drown further by GBC fallacy ... Srila Prabhupada and Krsna are always there... If you read the disciples course regarding initiation from voted in non - liberated guru...you will need an FBI investigation to see his alignment with the GBC....

JJ: They simply don’t understand the meaning of Guru. They use it as some sort of fashion. They don’t know what’s a Guru. Yet they claim to have become Guru.

BH: GBC talks big time of re-initiation in their laws....but Srila Prabhupada talks on initiation ... this is proof of their deviant hoax... with their ignorant following.. which is sad.

JJ: Correct Prabhuji.... all these GBC laws that they keep changing is a sign of their fear ... because the cat is out of the bag ... whole thing is false platform.

BH: Yes Prabhu, anyone can see they are desperate to protect their illegal ill gotten positions, and are trying to look as genuine gurus in an artificial way. A Guru is infallible, and it can be seen by their regulations ... they indicate they are fallible ... and a lot of crooks.

Bhagavad-Gita 4.42 purport ....  text that says 'all these seeks that objective is the real student of Bhagavad-gita, but one who therefore pretends who doubts the authority of Krşna falls. He is advised to study Bhagavad-gita, or any other scripture, under a bona fide spiritual master, with service and surrender. 

Spiritual master is in the disciplic succession from time eternal, and he does deviate at all from the Supreme's words, that were imparted millions of years ago to the sun-god, from whom the instructions of Bhagavad-gita have come down to the earthly kingdom. One should, therefore, follow the path Bhagavad- gita it is expressed in the Gita itself and beware of self-interested.'

PADA: According to shastra, false acharyas and their followers will take future births together -- in a lower birth.

VW Dasi: Wow!

AT: Achha ... tell me ... what is lower birth....

TRD: Prabhupada :: "These rogues are the most dangerous elements in human society. Because there is no religious government, they escape punishment by the law of the state. They cannot, however, escape the law of the Supreme, who has clearly declared in Bhagavad gita (16.19-20) that envious demons in the garb of religious propagandists shall be thrown into the darkest regions of hell. Sri Isopanisad confirms that these pseudo religionists are heading toward the most obnoxious place in the universe after the completion of their spiritual master business, which they conduct simply for sense gratification."

(Sri Isopanisad, mantra 12, purport)

(Sri Caitanya-caritamrta, Madhya-lila, 1.218 purport)

"A jealous person in the dress of a Vaisnava is not at all happy to see the success of another Vaisnava in receiving the Lord's mercy. Unfortunately, in this Age of Kali there are many mundane persons in the dress of Vaisnavas, and Srila BhaktivinodaThakura has described them as disciples of Kali. He says, kali-cela.

DE: It is kali yuga - there are many unusual paths back to Godhead which are not necessarily traditional. Luckily, this does not hamper the divine will of Lord Krsna, Who sees, hears and controls everything usually by way of His associates, expansions or agents.

AT: ...do you even experienced it ... or just repeating some memorized words.

AP: Karma goes to the guru who initiates, whether he is bonafide or not. Bona fide guru has this karma burnt up by his spiritual potency, but bogus guru suffers through sickness and / or fall down from spiritual platform. Only The bona fide Acarya, in this case, Srila Prabhupada, will take the devotee back home BTG.

DSD: So you saying that Srila Prabhupada's disciples can't offer the karma to Srila Prabhupada to offer his Guru to Offer His Guru ...... until it reaches Krsna.

[PADA: There is no such process as taking karma and offering to the guru mentioned by Srila Prabhupada. This is all speculation. He said us neophytes have no authority to take karma, end of story.]

ZP: Or they have car crashes or have their heads chopped off ... gurus don’t offer karma to their gurus. Are u out of your mind. 

TB: Where in Sastras does this say this? I've never been able to find that they take on their devotees sins in any sastras yet.

N.G.D. Instructor Gurus, not Initiating Gurus, that is what was TFO and requested, and still needs to be.

DS: Until, unless u dont know 100% dont put any mess like this what do u know about diksha u people have no brain 1st read prabhupada's book then comment. I use to eat non veg all alcohol drink smoke everything. After I go to Isckon I gave up everything n my family happy I have good health at the age of 62. I look like 45 peace of mind n happy with my JC japa I love everyone n all the living creature please come to krishna temple 4 6months n give u r decition hare krishna.

JJ: Cheater gets cheated. Blind leading the blind. Whoever is acting in the capacity of the Guru, takes on the karma. Whether they have the ability to burn off their disciples karma or not.

ST: harey krishna ji

BH: In South Africa lately ... a sad moment ... but some will still argue revealing their blindness. This happen in South Africa lately... please read ... it's sad though...

PADA: This happens all the time. A devotee was initiated by Jayatirtha, then Bhagavan, then Bhavananda, then Bhakti Caru. And now that BCS is gone, who knows what? Of course if we want to worship Prabhupada, we'll be booted out. It is a caste monopoly guru franchise business. They offered me to be the guru of Ireland in 1979. Neine danke! Give your franchise to someone else. ys pd

BH: By the way Partha Sarathi Maharaja has initiated a mataji on behalf of BCS...in Johannesburg South Africa...few weeks ago...

PADA: Yes, Kadamba Kanan is initiating as a disciple of Jayadvaita. It is ok for them to make ritviks of themselves ...

 MS: PADA, thank you and respect for not offending Srila Prabhupad !

TB: Do you have any sources on this? I fully believe you on this, but I'd like to have something to show others I know about it.

PADA: Kadamba Kanana Swami took sannyasa initiation[4] from his guru, Jayadvaita Swami,[5] (Wikipedia) He is listed as an ISKCON initiating guru on various GBC sites. ys pd

AT: Chutiaya hai tu....yahin sadega..sale...Kya likha hai..khud ko samajh me Aya ki nahi...

MF: Too much focus on "taking karma" is the mechanical conception of transcendence!!... Just simply chant with real devotion, give up offenses, and serve and surrender to Srila Prabhupada and His sincere devotees!! It's not about externals!! Hare Krishna 

[PADA: Taking karma is not an external process, it is at best subtle external. Taking other's sins contaminates the neophyte with other's karma and it covers his soul with a mass of sins on the subtle plane. This is not even seen on the external plane.] 

MN: It’s better join the ISKM you know the true preaching of AC Bhaktivedanta swami prabhupad, they separated from isckon. I also previously used to go isckon but when I go there I left to go to isckon any more. Or you can read his books and also you can watch his past lectures.

BC: Let's split our karma between the 11 disciples who took over, if they want our karma, let them take it. They want to go down, let them.

[PADA: Wow! Srila Prabhupada said we neophytes cannot be diksha gurus and absorb sins. He said: If we take sins without authority, we'll have to suffer. This story explains the results way better than we ever could! ys pd]

BAD KARMA OF THE UNQUALIFIED GURU.

As told by Her Grace Shrimati Govinda Dasi.

There is a famous story in India, you've maybe heard it. A great saint was walking with his disciples and they saw a large black snake writhing in pain, while being eaten alive by dozens of ants.

He asked his disciples, "what is this"? They said, "its a snake being devoured by ants."

Their guru then said, "No, the snake was a pseudo guru, who could not save his disciples, so the disciples have become ants and are eating the snake alive, causing him to suffer so."

And so, (with apologies to Bob Dyan) ...

A Mayavadi died last week, and we're free now of his rants, but he has reincarnated as a snake, being eaten alive by ants.

And those ants they were his disciples, and they're enjoying now their snack,
cause when they paid him to become Gods, you see, there was karma to pay back.

Oh Krishna! Can this really be the end, to be stuck within samsara, and in a serpent's form again. This story reminds me of the time we were having a morning walk in Brooklyn with Srila Prabhupada. His Divine Grace was sauntering like a conquering general as usual, in front of a large crowd of devotees including me. Suddenly he stopped pointed with his cane to the cracks in the sidewalk and asked, "What is that?

Naturally devotees had answers: "Oh that is grass growing from the sidewalk, Prabhupada." (Like he did not know... duh)

To which His Divine Grace replied, "No one has come here to plant this grass so where did it come from? These are demigods whose good deeds have become exhausted. And they have fallen down in the rain to become blades of grass.

With that he tossed his regal head back once again and continued marching along ... with devotees struggling to catch up!