[PADA: Lokanath initiated some people in a private ceremony recently. They are not advertising his initiation in public. That means, our program is making them have to change their open support to some extent. Anyway, they are being exposed more and more all the time, it is catching up to them. ys pd
angel108b@yahoo.com]
G Dasi: Yes.
CM: That is what the India ICC argues, well too bad, Lokanath is famous.
C Dasi: Bhir Swami Should Be Ashamed Of Himself. No Compassion for Those That Have Been Abused. And What is His REAL Reason for his SILENCE !!????
HK Devi Dasi: In Russia we have many abuse cases and even evidence where big leaders asked victims to keep silence about child abuse. Its mostly Bhakti Vijnana Goswami, disciple of Radhanath Swami -- and others. There is no justice for victims here.
P Das: An image of one or more people and text that says 'Moral degeneracy: when calling out abuse is considered more offensive than enacting it. Yolande Norris-Clark @BAUHAUSWIFE'
LB DASA: Keeping silent about a pedophile means -- Bir Krishna has skeletons in his closet.
LHT: Lokanath has not been involved in Child abuse. What fault finding is this???
Why ruin your own spiritual life, with such gossip. Support the truly abused children and demand that their justice be served. Lokanath Maharaja is not an abuser.
SD: There is some misinformation being spread by Lokanath's supporters, and it is possibly stemming from him himself, as he refuses to step down and is clinging to power. The victim has spoken, Lokanath admitted to it in numerous written communications, phone calls, in-person conversations and even in front of the entire GBC body in the 2011 Mayapur meetings where he sat quietly while a half dozen GBC members made strong comments.
He has admitted to this to some of his disciples, in person, and other forms of communication. The GBC have been fumbling this case for 28 years since they investigated it in 1993. As with all allegations of child abuse in ISKCON, this case needs to be handled by the professionals of The Child Protection Office.
LHT: Is touching a girl on the thigh Child abuse?
SD: Lokanath's victim Satya: "The next day, he called me in the living room, and asked me to bring the Krsna book and read it to him. He had me sit RIGHT NEXT TO HIM, leaving no space between us. He PLACED HIS HANDS ON MY CROTCH, NOT ON MY LAP, and said I am keeping the book from touching you there, so just keep reading. He kept his hand there, and any time my mother would walk by the room, he would QUICKLY REMOVE HIS HAND AND PLACE IT ABOVE MY HEAD (around me). He did this several times throughout the course of an hour, and after that sick feeling inside me became the most prominent thing for me, I told him I was tired, and I left the room."
You can read the entire thing here:
https://satyavrata.wixsite.com/.../2010-statements-from...
SATYAVRATA.WIXSITE.COM
Statements from Satya - July 2010
SD: This may be the first time you are hearing about this, as the GBC members involved in Lokanath's case have been trying to hide the abuse for 28 years... disciples should know their guru is a child molester. Parents in ISKCON should know that one of their leaders in their spiritual society is a child molester. The mental health professionals who evaluated Lokanath said he should never be alone with a woman or a child. Not because Lokanath is a sannyasi. These are lay people. But because of the harm he might do to them.
PADA: We become what we worship. If we worship a person with contaminated consciousness, then the contamination spreads to the worshipers. Hence, all sorts of cases of enabling or overlooking abuse -- because enabling and overlooking abuse is being worshiped. ys pd
SD: You said, "Support the truly abused children and demand that their justice be served." I support all abused children.
V Das: Lila Suka dasi a disciple of Bir Krishna and is listed as one of the four CPO directors on their website. Another two are a married couple. The GBC, possibly only Bir Krishna, chose the CPO. Am I the only one who sees a conflict of interest? A disciple will do what the guru wants and husband and wife will agree with each other. Here we see proof of his meddling in CPO affairs. They’re compromised. Even if they took on the massive LNS case and faced the mighty ICC and 6,000 plus LNS followers.
Also many GBC and US LNS sympathisers. They’d still have to do what the GBC wants in the end. CPO won’t be deciding the fate of ISKCON. But anyway what can they do? CPO isn’t recognised by ICC so they’ll be ignored. I believe it would be better to push for creating a bigger panel and that two CPO are included. They’re investigators and consultants not judges or punishers. The GBC would be irresponsible if they allowed the CPO to handle this alone. They’re normal nice people not the Avengers. The GBC made this mess. They should sort it out.
SD: Someone may have taken initiation from a certain guru, but it doesn't mean that years later they still get inspiration from that person. Look around ISKCON. Many former followers gave up on their "gurus" a long time ago.
V DASA: So does she no longer follow Bir Krishna? I’m surprised he hasn’t removed her from The CPO. But my point still stands. CPO are compromised by the GBC choosing them and financing them. If you look at the CPO member profiles on their website, you’d be forgiven for thinking that these are not the devotees who can take on ICC, who come across as vicious people.
Also the two top guru leaders in India. Who are also behind LNS. Or would CPO not allow a defence from LNS. I’m no fan of LNS but I’m a realist. One of those gurus did nothing to stop child sexual abuse in Mayapura from the 70s and the other has a history of severe wife beating and neglect. So it’s no wonder they take the LNS side.
LHT: Is touching a girl on the thigh Child abuse?
SD: Lokanath's victim Satya: "The next day, he called me in the living room, and asked me to bring the Krsna book and read it to him. He had me sit RIGHT NEXT TO HIM, leaving no space between us. He PLACED HIS HANDS ON MY CROTCH, NOT ON MY LAP, and said I am keeping the book from touching you there, so just keep reading. He kept his hand there, and any time my mother would walk by the room, he would QUICKLY REMOVE HIS HAND AND PLACE IT ABOVE MY HEAD (around me). He did this several times throughout the course of an hour, and after that sick feeling inside me became the most prominent thing for me, I told him I was tired, and I left the room."
You can read the entire thing here:
https://satyavrata.wixsite.com/.../2010-statements-from...
SATYAVRATA.WIXSITE.COM
Statements from Satya - July 2010
SD: This may be the first time you are hearing about this, as the GBC members involved in Lokanath's case have been trying to hide the abuse for 28 years... disciples should know their guru is a child molester. Parents in ISKCON should know that one of their leaders in their spiritual society is a child molester. The mental health professionals who evaluated Lokanath said he should never be alone with a woman or a child. Not because Lokanath is a sannyasi. These are lay people. But because of the harm he might do to them.
PADA: We become what we worship. If we worship a person with contaminated consciousness, then the contamination spreads to the worshipers. Hence, all sorts of cases of enabling or overlooking abuse -- because enabling and overlooking abuse is being worshiped. ys pd
SD: You said, "Support the truly abused children and demand that their justice be served." I support all abused children.
V Das: Lila Suka dasi a disciple of Bir Krishna and is listed as one of the four CPO directors on their website. Another two are a married couple. The GBC, possibly only Bir Krishna, chose the CPO. Am I the only one who sees a conflict of interest? A disciple will do what the guru wants and husband and wife will agree with each other. Here we see proof of his meddling in CPO affairs. They’re compromised. Even if they took on the massive LNS case and faced the mighty ICC and 6,000 plus LNS followers.
Also many GBC and US LNS sympathisers. They’d still have to do what the GBC wants in the end. CPO won’t be deciding the fate of ISKCON. But anyway what can they do? CPO isn’t recognised by ICC so they’ll be ignored. I believe it would be better to push for creating a bigger panel and that two CPO are included. They’re investigators and consultants not judges or punishers. The GBC would be irresponsible if they allowed the CPO to handle this alone. They’re normal nice people not the Avengers. The GBC made this mess. They should sort it out.
SD: Someone may have taken initiation from a certain guru, but it doesn't mean that years later they still get inspiration from that person. Look around ISKCON. Many former followers gave up on their "gurus" a long time ago.
V DASA: So does she no longer follow Bir Krishna? I’m surprised he hasn’t removed her from The CPO. But my point still stands. CPO are compromised by the GBC choosing them and financing them. If you look at the CPO member profiles on their website, you’d be forgiven for thinking that these are not the devotees who can take on ICC, who come across as vicious people.
Also the two top guru leaders in India. Who are also behind LNS. Or would CPO not allow a defence from LNS. I’m no fan of LNS but I’m a realist. One of those gurus did nothing to stop child sexual abuse in Mayapura from the 70s and the other has a history of severe wife beating and neglect. So it’s no wonder they take the LNS side.
SF DASI: Out of curiosity, did anyone do any statistics yet, what percentage of membership currently as of now in ISCKON -- is in full support of Lokanat Swami?
SD: That would be a costly and large endeavour, and probably not accurate. But following one's own laws shouldn't be affected by how many people support it.
LM DASI: Why is Bir Krishna still covering things up? “Sociopaths are masters at not being caught. You never know you're being lied to because you're never not being lied to.” This really is so disturbing and disgusting. It's straight out evil! It's immoral and unholy, as in ungodly. It's sabotage, as in he is acting deliberately. This is his choice. He has free will!
He's admitting that he is an accomplice to covering up child molestation, which is so hideous and destroys other people's lives, and that is how he is persuading "teaching" his disciples (students) to act that way, which is so wrong, manipulative and so destructive. Is that the demeanor of a Vaishnava? Is it?...
This is not divine clarity, it's straight up lying, and it's so despicable and they will only misquote you and purposely direct you in the completely wrong direction, which will not lead you to self-Realization. That is not sincere, genuine Krsna consciences. Not At All!
They will not stop. It's a disease, an infectious sickness even. This is and has been their character. This is their career, as in how they make money and what gives them power. They will keep swinging people until it's too late and ISKCON will have million's of blind followers who will and ruin, destroy countless amounts of more lives, once again due to Lust, Greed, Power, Money, ...Maya!
Bir Krishna and everyone else, as in all of them, that are in so-called "leadership" are guilty and they are the "gurus" (teachers) that represent? The acharyas "one who lives by example."...Is this the example that you are proud of and want to leave behind and pass on to other spirit souls? It can be so much better, as in authenticity, truthful and real. ... Not to mention auspicious, and transcendental.
This is the time to speak up and say something for things to improve, as in the truth to save countless amounts of spirit souls that will be cheated out of a chance. Lying and trying to cover up child molestation, (mental, physical, and sexual abuse) which has ruined and destroyed so many lives because it is so destructive to one's mental health, and it is not irreversible, it is so cruel. It really is a Demonic Act. Many of these spirit souls suffer for the rest of their lives, awake and asleep.
The GBC / ISKCON, as in the leadership of this spiritual and auspicious movement are still trying to sweep all of it, as in everything under the rug, as if it's just a little dirt. ...It's beyond dirty. It's filthy and disgusting.... It's horrifying, and they are all trying to hide and keep the truth of what has really happened and which continues to happen, because it never really stopped.
They just try to be slick, or skillful about it, so not to ruin their status... Because who wants to be affiliated with Pedophila, especially when it comes to your connection with God and the spiritual realm?... It they continue to remain silent, or as an accomplice and have Not come clean and owned up to the truth, but deny and lie about it instead, means that they are not self-Realized spirit souls.
Bir Krishna is not a someone that anyone should be taking instruction from. He should not be giving direction. He is disingenuous! *self-Realization / Krsna Consciousness is the opposite of being deceitful, dishonest and devious. They are not bonafide, legitimate gurus. They did not come from a straight line of disciplic succession. Not At All!
They, ISKCON is treating this as if it all the maliciousness never really happened and will just go away, which is what they want are hoping for, and trying to do, so that they can keep continuing to keep taking advantage of other spirit souls doing it, as they always have. ...
...Don't let them pull you down with them!
Please! Karma is real!
They, ISKCON is treating this as if it all the maliciousness never really happened and will just go away, which is what they want are hoping for, and trying to do, so that they can keep continuing to keep taking advantage of other spirit souls doing it, as they always have. ...
...Don't let them pull you down with them!
Please! Karma is real!
SD: Let's not lump everyone in together. We can approach this on a case-by-case basis. Every person is different.
LM DASI: That's your point of view. I know better, sorry. I don't mean that to be disrespectful. I'm just being honest. If you don't want to read it, then don't. But please don't tell me how to feel. I know exactly what I know and what I have been through and why I feel the way that I do. I know that you are a part of ISKCON and that you are going to get defensive, but I have seriously suffered because of these egotistical men that are lost in Maya.
SD: I am sorry you suffered, I truly am. ISKCON is my family but I can still it can be dysfunctional at times. Your words will have more merit if you speak specifically about people and situations, rather than make sweeping generalizations. Just my point of view.
LM DASI: I am healing right now,. You have NO idea what I've been through! Sweeping judgments? Why are you not telling others how to feel? If your intention is to truly help those that have suffered because of child abuse due to ISKCON, then why are you trying to tell me how I should try to heal and recover from my horrible situation? That's not how recovery from therapy works.
SD: I'm sorry. I didn't mean to hurt you. This group is focused on child protection in ISKCON, policies and execution, and through that to help people heal.
LM DASI: Show me that you actually really don't care about kids that have been abused by ISKCON. Please accept my very humble obeisances. Would you rather me single people out and start a lynch mob? I didn't just walk in.
Thank you for your apology though. I appreciate it. I'm not trying to offend you. What am I doing wrong that you would chastise me? Is there something particular that you can point out that I should retract according to you, even though that all those words were just poured out from my heart?
SD: This part "...The GBC / ISKCON, as in the leadership of this spiritual and auspicious movement are still trying to sweep all of it, as in everything under the rug, as if it's just a little dirt." What is all of it that is getting swept under the rug?
LM DASI: I did single him out. I am only talking about him in my comment. There are no names in there but when I say "him" I'm referring to, Bir Krishna Goswami.
Wow! I got really defensive and there for a sec. I just want to say that I sincerely do apologize for biting off your head like that ND. This subject makes me and everyone else on here a bit edgy.
LM DASI: That's your point of view. I know better, sorry. I don't mean that to be disrespectful. I'm just being honest. If you don't want to read it, then don't. But please don't tell me how to feel. I know exactly what I know and what I have been through and why I feel the way that I do. I know that you are a part of ISKCON and that you are going to get defensive, but I have seriously suffered because of these egotistical men that are lost in Maya.
SD: I am sorry you suffered, I truly am. ISKCON is my family but I can still it can be dysfunctional at times. Your words will have more merit if you speak specifically about people and situations, rather than make sweeping generalizations. Just my point of view.
LM DASI: I am healing right now,. You have NO idea what I've been through! Sweeping judgments? Why are you not telling others how to feel? If your intention is to truly help those that have suffered because of child abuse due to ISKCON, then why are you trying to tell me how I should try to heal and recover from my horrible situation? That's not how recovery from therapy works.
SD: I'm sorry. I didn't mean to hurt you. This group is focused on child protection in ISKCON, policies and execution, and through that to help people heal.
LM DASI: Show me that you actually really don't care about kids that have been abused by ISKCON. Please accept my very humble obeisances. Would you rather me single people out and start a lynch mob? I didn't just walk in.
Thank you for your apology though. I appreciate it. I'm not trying to offend you. What am I doing wrong that you would chastise me? Is there something particular that you can point out that I should retract according to you, even though that all those words were just poured out from my heart?
SD: This part "...The GBC / ISKCON, as in the leadership of this spiritual and auspicious movement are still trying to sweep all of it, as in everything under the rug, as if it's just a little dirt." What is all of it that is getting swept under the rug?
LM DASI: I did single him out. I am only talking about him in my comment. There are no names in there but when I say "him" I'm referring to, Bir Krishna Goswami.
Wow! I got really defensive and there for a sec. I just want to say that I sincerely do apologize for biting off your head like that ND. This subject makes me and everyone else on here a bit edgy.
None of them were appointed by Srila Prabhupada for a reason! Read...
“....Why this Gaudiya Math failed? Because they tried to become more than guru. He [Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura], before passing away, he gave them all direction and never said that “This man should be the next acharya .” But these people, just after his passing away, they began to fight, who shall be acharya . That is the failure. They never thought, “Why Guru Maharaja gave us instruction so many things, why he did not say that this man should be acharya? ” They wanted to create artificially somebody acharya, and everything failed. They did not consider even with common sense that if Guru Maharaja wanted to appoint somebody as acharya, why did he not say? He said so many things, and this point he missed? The real point? And they insist upon it. They declared some unfit person to become acharya . Then another man came, then another, acharya, another acharya . So better remain a foolish person perpetually to be directed by Guru Maharaja. That is perfection. –Srila Prabhupada, August 16, 1976, Bombay ( Conversations with Srila Prabhupada, Vol. 26, p. 59-60)
SD: We are not talking about whether gurus were appointed or not, we are talking about how to help child protection in ISKCON's existing system, whether we agree with how that system was set up or not.
LB: We should always try to keep Srila Prabhupada in the centre in whatever we do. However I agree to focus on the topic of child protection. Otherwise it gets frustrating and doesn’t help solve problems. I often get people commenting on my posts that have nothing to do with my post.
LM DASI: It's all connected. We are talking about a guru right now though. This post is on a a so-called guru. You just posted that yesterday. This page now has two men, or guru's that are singles out that I am aware of. Who do you think it is that controls these kids and does the abusing?
Did you read my comment? Do you think it is irrelevant to the topic? It's not. Sorry if you can't see it? I was upset. This upsets me.
“....Why this Gaudiya Math failed? Because they tried to become more than guru. He [Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati Thakura], before passing away, he gave them all direction and never said that “This man should be the next acharya .” But these people, just after his passing away, they began to fight, who shall be acharya . That is the failure. They never thought, “Why Guru Maharaja gave us instruction so many things, why he did not say that this man should be acharya? ” They wanted to create artificially somebody acharya, and everything failed. They did not consider even with common sense that if Guru Maharaja wanted to appoint somebody as acharya, why did he not say? He said so many things, and this point he missed? The real point? And they insist upon it. They declared some unfit person to become acharya . Then another man came, then another, acharya, another acharya . So better remain a foolish person perpetually to be directed by Guru Maharaja. That is perfection. –Srila Prabhupada, August 16, 1976, Bombay ( Conversations with Srila Prabhupada, Vol. 26, p. 59-60)
SD: We are not talking about whether gurus were appointed or not, we are talking about how to help child protection in ISKCON's existing system, whether we agree with how that system was set up or not.
LB: We should always try to keep Srila Prabhupada in the centre in whatever we do. However I agree to focus on the topic of child protection. Otherwise it gets frustrating and doesn’t help solve problems. I often get people commenting on my posts that have nothing to do with my post.
LM DASI: It's all connected. We are talking about a guru right now though. This post is on a a so-called guru. You just posted that yesterday. This page now has two men, or guru's that are singles out that I am aware of. Who do you think it is that controls these kids and does the abusing?
Did you read my comment? Do you think it is irrelevant to the topic? It's not. Sorry if you can't see it? I was upset. This upsets me.
LB: Yes I read your comments. No it’s not irrelevant. I am not against what you are saying. I am speaking in general. There are a myriad of problems and sometimes it can open up a can of worms and devotees can go off on all kinds of tangents.
Then there is…more of…Revolution, then no solution. For example I had to delete a few devotees going off topic about something innocent I posted. They mentioned Prabhupada being poisoned etc. Because I have friends both devotees and non devotees. There is no need to keep reminding devotees about something bad and a sensitive topic, whether true or not especially when it doesn’t directly relate to the topic. It’s sometimes distasteful and doesn’t serve any purpose.
LM DASI: I thank you for your kindness and I understand what your saying, but I'm going to have to agree and disagree with you because I always find it distasteful and heartbreakingly so sad, but I believe it does have a purpose, but I understand why you would say that though, which is also really sad.
P.S. Just out curiosity if you don't mind answering, are you saying that because it's your non devotee friends that are the ones that bring it up and were once devotees?
AC DASI: So many times these things are covered up, by so many leaders.
LM DASI: “Sociopaths are masters at not being caught. You never know you're being lied to because you're never not being lied to.” Thank you to everyone that is saying something about the vile child molestation and overall abuse that took place within really actually happened within ISKCON, due to the leadership that is corrupt.
This cycle need to be put to a stop! And anyone and everyone, as in 1st generation devotees, that know about it need to speak up for anything to progress and change for the better. Otherwise this is it! You are looking at the future of ISKCON and all the sinister and malicious things that took place. happen. and keeps happening, as in it never has stopped.
These so=called gurus love a program where there is sex with minors -- and money. They are not to be followed as saintly beings. They are tricksters lost in their own ego at this point. due to the leadership "the 11 princes that took over ISKCON" and still are in charge now.
It's honest and the truth. That way people know what they are getting themselves into, if they weren't born and forced to have to grow up in that way. It's kinda a NOW or Never situation. First generation devotees will never have another chance like this to speak up and stop hiding the facts and truth that took place in ISKCON, unless you want this to continue into your grandchildren and great grandchildren.
It's a very toxic and dangerous organization if the truth about everything can not be open and honestly revealed and how it all got started and came to be and how it got to this point. If something needs to be hidden, it means that's it's wrong, as in shameful. Continuing to covering it up.
MM DASI: That makes me very suspicious of his own behaviour to be honest...
It's honest and the truth. That way people know what they are getting themselves into, if they weren't born and forced to have to grow up in that way. It's kinda a NOW or Never situation. First generation devotees will never have another chance like this to speak up and stop hiding the facts and truth that took place in ISKCON, unless you want this to continue into your grandchildren and great grandchildren.
It's a very toxic and dangerous organization if the truth about everything can not be open and honestly revealed and how it all got started and came to be and how it got to this point. If something needs to be hidden, it means that's it's wrong, as in shameful. Continuing to covering it up.
MM DASI: That makes me very suspicious of his own behaviour to be honest...
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