Friday, June 2, 2017

Jadurani / Narayana Maharaja: Defeated Srila Prabhupada? (Edited by Syamarani didi)

[PADA: A devotee of Narayana Maharaja forwarded us this article to "prove" Srila Prabhupada's jeeva tattva is not correct, i.e. that we fell from Vaikuntha. And they are boasting they have defeated Srila Prabhupada's arguments. 

We did not include the many citations from Srila Prabhupada we gave previously on this issue in order to keep it more compact. We have cited many quotes in other articles to back up the points made herein, and you can study the previous articles if you want to get the actual citations we reference here, for example this article from the past: ys pd]

The Final Proof: The Jiva Did Not Fall From Goloka 
(BV Narayana Maharaja)

Edited by Jadurani dasi / aka Syamarani didi

Murwillumbah, Australia; Feb. 16, 2002 (Evening - Part 2)

Tridandiswami Sri Srimad Bhaktivedanta Narayana Maharaja

Narayana Maharaja: Paramahamsa Babaji Maharaja replied, "Religion is one, and that religion is love and affection for the Supreme Lord. Only this love and affection is real Vaisnava-dharma, Sanatana-dharma, or Bhagavad-dharma. This sometimes transforms, however, as water transforms into ice, or fog, or steam. 

When it becomes ice, one can throw it at anyone and it will cause injury, but water will not do so. Similarly, love for Krsna, the intrinsic mood of the jiva, has now been transformed. 

[PADA: Narayana Maharaja says (A) at one time we all loved Krishna, and this love was somehow "transformed" from the original, but then he says, (B) we were never in a loving exchange with Krishna originally. How did our original love "transform," if this love was never experienced in an actual exchange, because we were not even in the realm of exchanges? 

Worse, NM says we originated in tatastha, but we are the tatastha? 

Or NM says we originated with Karandadaksayi Vishnu, the incarnation that cares for the ALREADY FALLEN. 

Makes material world for the already fallen

How can we originally love someone -- whom we have no original experience of, or original connection to? I love someone, but I was never with this someone, or had any experience of this someone, or had any actual loving exchanges with this person? This makes no sense? Love means a factual exchange, but NM says this factual exchange never took place. 

If NM's version sounds impersonal, it is. 

We all loved Krishna at one time, but we had no association with Him. This is clearly mayavada. I love someone, but never had association or connection to that someone? This is making little sense. No, Krishna is someone, we are also someone, and we have an original PERSONAL exchange or relationship together. We are persons, and so is God, and thus everything has a PERSONAL origin.] 

NM: Now we love each other, or we love dogs, cats, our own bodies, or boyfriends and girlfriends, and this is called anitya-dharma. That love originally comes from Goloka Vrndavana. 

[PADA: What? Now NM says our original consciousness and position of love is -- the love we experienced in Goloka Vrndavana, and / or Vaikuntha, but we were never there? We experienced this Goloka love, but we were never there to experience this love? (???) Who were we loving if we were never with the lover? 

Which is why Srila Prabhupada says -- contradiction means mayavada. NM says the love we originally experienced comes from Goloka, but we never experienced it? A contradiction, par excellence. Our consciousness originally comes from Goloka, we had this Goloka love originally, but at the same time we do not come from there, and we did not experience this loving exchange? (???)

How does this work, our consciousness comes from there, but we do not come from there, because we are separate from our consciousness? This sounds like mumbo jumo. No, we ARE the consciousness, that is WHO we are! If our consciousness is in Goloka, we are there as well, because our consciousness determines WHERE we are located. If we are in Goloka consciousness, we are there or we are taken there in short order, because we go where the quality of our consciousness dictates.] 

NM: That love is in the heart of jivas, but now it has been transformed, as water transforms into ice when the temperature is low. 

[PADA: OK again, same problem, we originally had this Goloka love for Krishna, and it was transformed, but -- wait for it -- we never had this Goloka love originally? Another head spinning contradiction. Where did our original state of Goloka love come from? Why did it transform? How did it transform? NM has no explanation. Srila Prabhupada says, it transformed because we became envious of Krishna. That is the logical explanation, there is a CAUSE for the transformed state.]

NM: Due to maya, our real dharma, prema for Krsna, has now been transformed and changed, and now we are 'loving' each other. In this world, 'love' is perverted and has become lust, but in its pure stage, it is love and affection for Krsna and it comes from the hearts of the gopis and Vrajavasis.

[PADA: Sounds good! Our original love for Krishna is just like the gopis and vrajavasis, but has now been transformed and changed into material love. Except? Meanwhile Narayana Maharaja says we have had no original love for Krishna, because we were never there with Krishna. How is the love transformed, if it never existed? The original vrajavasi love becomes perverted, but we were never there, so we did not experience it. If this love never existed, there is no cause for it to transform?  

Srila Prabhupada says that our original love for Krishna is like milk, and when tamarind is added, the milk becomes soured and transforms, and so our original Krishna consciousness is transformed into material. NM says, there was no original milk, we started out as soured tamarind milk? God made a bunch of Satans as His children?

Then NM says no, we actually have had our original Goloka milk consciousness? What! Worse, some NM followers tell PADA that we originated in the material world through Maha Vishnu, nope, He takes care of souls who have ALREADY fallen. Some souls start out as saints, some start out as Satans? No. Satan was in heaven and HE FELL from there.]

NM: Paramahamsa Babaji Maharaja quoted Caitanya-caritamrta:

jivera 'svarupa' haya - krsnera 'nitya-dasa'
krsnera 'tatastha'sakti' 'bhedabheda-prakasa'
suryamsa-kirana, yaiche agni-jvala-caya
svabhavika krsnera tina-prakara 'sakti' haya

["It is the living entity's constitutional position to be an eternal servant of Krsna because he is the marginal energy of Krsna and a manifestation simultaneously one with and different from the Lord, like a molecular particle of sunshine or fire. Krsna has three varieties of energy." (Cc Madhya 20.108-109)]

[PADA: The original eternal constitutional position of the living entity is to be a servant of Krishna, then NM says we were never there doing any service, and this service mode is not our original position. How can one say: (A) the original swarupa of the living entity is to be ETERNALLY Krishna's servant, and then (B) have NM say, we never were Krishna's servant? OK, so where were we for all eternity before falling here? We were all asleep for eternity until now? That is basic Christian church jeeva tattva!]

NM: krsna bhuli' sei jiva anadi-bahirmukha
ataeva maya tare deya samsara-duhkha

["Forgetting Krsna, the living entity has been attracted by the external feature from time immemorial. Therefore, the illusory energy (maya) gives him all kinds of misery in his material existence." (Cc Madhya 20.117)]

[PADA: Except, Narayana Maharaja says there is no original forgetfulness of Krishna, because we were never with Krishna to forget Him. We forgot Krishna, but we were never with Him? I forgot what Australia looks like, oops, but I was never there? How do we forget something we never experienced? We can only forget something we have had previous experience of.] 

NM: We are eternally Krsna dasa, servants of Krsna, but now we are Krsna bhuli; we have forgotten Him. The words 'krsna bhuli' are used here. It means 'the jiva forgets Krsna', but what does this actually mean? It seems to mean that the jiva was once engaged in Krsna's service, but now he has forgotten that service.

[PADA: Oh oh, here we go. Srila Prabhupada says we are all originally in Krishna's leela or sport, serving Him, and now NM say that is not correct. Except, how do we forget someone we never connected with? We forgot our service, but we were never there serving? 

We forgot Krishna, "seems to mean," something else? This is called bogus personal interpreting of shastra. This is like Mahatma Gandhi saying, Bhagavan "seems" to indicate Krishna, but it indicates something else, an allegorical person. The concept of "forgetting Krishna" is very simple, we had to have been with Him in order to have forgot Him.]

Actually, this is not true. This is not the meaning. There is defect in worldly languages. They are not perfect, and therefore they cannot purely express what is the nature of our svarupa (constitutional form). To clarify the meaning of 'krsna bhuli', Srila Krsnadasa Kaviraja Gosvami writes in the next line, "krsnera 'tatastha'sakti' 'bhedabheda-prakasa.'" 

[PADA: Srila Prabhupada's explanation that we originate with Krishna is "defective worldly language." Why does Jadurani always end up "editing" these documents where she says that Srila Prabhupada's words are "defective worldly language." The only way their idea works is to attack Srila Prabhupada as defective and using worldly language?]

Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakura has clearly explained all these truths. You should very carefully note this down in your heart and on your paper. He took his understanding from Srila Sanatana Gosvami's Srimad-Bhagavatam and from Sri Jiva Gosvami's Sat-sandarpa, and then he wrote:

[Pundarika dasa reads from Jaiva Dharma, Chapter Sixteen:] 

[PADA: Srila Prabhupada told us this version of Jaiva Dharma has been edited and should not be read or cited.]

NM: "Innumerable jivas appear from Sri Baladeva Prabhu to serve Vrndavana-vihari Sri Krsna as His eternal associates in Goloka Vrndavana, and others appear from Sri Sankarsana to serve the Lord of Vaikuntha, Sri Narayana, in the spiritual sky. 

Eternally relishing rasa, engaged in the service of their worshipable Lord, they always remain fixed in their constitutional position. They always strive to please Bhagavan, and are always favorable to Him. By virtue of the spiritual sakti, they have the strength to stay fixed in their devotion, and they have no connection with the material energy. 

In fact, they are unaware that there is a deluding energy called maya. Since they reside in the spiritual world, maya stays far from them and does not affect them at all. Always absorbed in the bliss of serving their worshipable Lord, they are eternally liberated and are free from material happiness and distress. Their life is love alone, and they are not even conscious of misery, death or fear."

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] They are all liberated. They don't know what is maya and what is this material world. Who knows? We know. We have come from tatastha-sakti, from a manifestation of Baladeva Prabhu called Karanadaksayi Visnu, who is situated on the marginal line, in the Karanabdhi (Causal Ocean).

[PADA: Now we are really getting things mixed up. The jeevas are coming from Karanadaksayi Vishnu, fine except, He is the incarnation who takes care of souls who have ALREADY FALLEN. Now NM is saying Krishna creates some souls in Vaikuntha with Him -- and some not in Vaikuntha and without Him, which is Christian theology, some souls start in heaven with God, some do not. That means NM is saying God is biased with His children, some start out in a better situation than others, biased. No! The souls that "start out" with Maha Vishnu are ALREADY FALLEN, they did not START there.

Upendra: "The innumerable universes are generated from skinholes of this Karanodakasayi Visnu, and in each one of the universes the Lord enters as Garbhodakasayi Visnu."

Prabhupada: Again, after creation of the universes, He enters each and every universe. This universe is filled with water, half. What you are seeing, that is half only. And half is filled with water. In that water Visnu again lying, expanding. This is Visnu's power. He can expand in innumerable identities. 

[PADA: Another problem, the tatastha jeevas came from a place called tatastha jeevas? No. The jeevas themselves are called the tatastha shakti. The jeevas are not a region or a place, they are spiritual sparks. Spiritual sparks are not a place? We have not come from the tatastha shakti, we are the tatastha shakti. Nor did we originate here in the material universes under Karanadaksayi Vishnu, which means our origin is to be in the hellish material world. Why is NM saying God originates some of His children in hell? He is preaching Christian jeeva tattva!]

NM: The jivas are not coming to this world from Goloka Vrndavana, nor are they coming from Vaikuntha. They are coming form the marginal line, from the glance of Karanabdhisayi Visnu. Among them, those who look towards Vaikuntha are liberated, and they go there at once without delay. Conversely, those who look toward this world will come here.

[PADA: OK Narayana Maharaja says that all have original Goloka love, then he says this is experienced in the tatastha marginal line, but there is no such thing as the tatastha marginal line, we are the tatastha ourselves. Nor does he explain how people in the so-called tatastha region experience original Goloka consciousness, but they are not in Goloka? 

They have original Goloka consciousness, but they are not allowed there? 

Why are they excluded from Goloka if they have original Goloka consciousness? We have a bunch of jeevas who have original Goloka consciousness, but they are not allowed there? Why would Krishna banish people from Goloka if they have original Goloka consciousness?, and He would put them in the tatastha region, which does not exist?]
NM: Jivas are independent because Krsna has made them so. This independence is like a special jewel, and the jivas can use it properly or misuse it. If they using it well, they will quickly go towards Vaikuntha, and if they misuse it they will have to suffer.

[PADA: But if there is no activity, planets, teachings etc. in the marginal so-called tatastha region, how will people know how to choose anything? God makes us choose, but He gives us no tools to use for making the choice?]

NM: Here is an example. If you have a sharp sword or knife and you drop some very small and round mustard seeds on it so that they falls in the middle of the sword, some will fall over to one side and some will fall to the other. The jiva has got some independence to go here or there. This is not the fault of Krsna, but rather it is their independence to look here and there. If they look towards Vaikuntha or Goloka Vrndavana, Yogamaya will at once help them and they will go there. On the other hand, those who look towards the material world will be attracted by Mahamaya. Krsna is not at fault here. 

[PADA: But if there is no activity or teaching in the so-called tatastha region, how can people make an educated choice?]

NM: You cannot understand this in your present stage, but when you come in our stage, then you will realize something. At present you should chant, follow your guru, and follow all these teachings. 

Don't conclude that the jivas have come from Goloka. Although Srila Swami Maharaja never said that the jivas fell from Goloka, some of his disciples try to prove that he has said the opposite. But I know the truth. He has told me, and it is also in sastra. Srimati Syamarani dasi has collected so many of Srila Swami Maharaja words, confirming that he never accepted that the jivas came from Goloka Vrndavana.

[PADA: Srila Prabhupada says we all originated in Krishna's leela or sport, why is Jadurani helping NM "prove" that we originated in the "tatastha region" which sounds very much like impersonal brahman?]

NM: na tad bhasayate suryo
na sasanko na pavakah
yad gatva na nivartante
tad dhama paramam mama

"That supreme abode of Mine is not illumined by the sun or moon, nor by fire or electricity. Those who reach it never return to this material world." (Bg 15.6)

Goloka is such a dhama that there is no maya. Rather, only Yogamaya is there. A person who is seriously chanting, remembering and following, passes through the stages of sraddha, nistha, ruci, asakti, and prema, after a long, long, long time. If he has gone to Goloka Vrndavana Dhama and is serving Krsna, there is no chance at all to fall down. There is no example at all in the Vedas, Upanisads, or any other scriptures.

[PADA: But Srila Prabhupada says even if you go to Vaikuntha, you can still fall back here again, if you choose to.]

Srila Gour-Govinda Swami used to say very boldly that those who wear big kanti-mala and chant, "Hare Krsna, Hare Krsna," at the same time being duplicitous, hypocritical and critical, are kali-cela, disciples of Kali. They are not Vaisnavas because they have none of the symptom of a Vaisnava. Such persons think that they can vote to determine siddhanta or to determine who is acarya or guru. This is totally against Vaisnava law. Experts are experts. Guru is guru.

[PADA: Why did NM say these disciple of Kali Yuga can be worshiped as rati keli siddhas, and they are gurus? And this is also not the point, the GBC had no bearing on this, it is Srila Prabhupada who said we originate with Krishna, not the GBC? Why did Gaura Govinda Maharaja stand up and defend keeping Tamal in the acharya seat in 1993, if Tamal is a Kali chela? And why was NM hanging out with Tamal all the time, and harassing us for challenging NM's "dear Tamal tree of Radha"?] 

Who made Srila Swami Maharaja guru? Has Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura made him acarya? Has he given him a certificate saying, "After me you will be acarya, and you will do such and such"? It's ones own service that makes one acarya or guru. There was no duplicity in him, and he was very kind and merciful to all.

[PADA: No it is not one's service, one has to get the order to be acharya from his acharya.] 

NM: He realized this fact and he served like that. Similarly, Prabhupada Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura has not made our Guru Maharaja an acarya. He did not tell him, "After me, you shall be acarya," but still he has become a very famous acarya - strong like a lion. Those who serve their Gurudeva properly will become acarya. Who made Sri Sukadeva Gosvami acarya? Who made Sri Jiva Gosvami acarya? Who made Srila Gour-Govinda Maharaja acarya? 

[PADA: Gaura Govinda Maharaja was made acharya when the GBC reinstated sex with taxi drivers as their acharya. He was made acharya by the votes of the GBC, and he was one of the biggest defenders of keeping Tamal in the post of guru.]

NM: It would be quite absurd to think that liberated souls in Goloka Vrndavana can ever be covered by maya. You should have strong faith that the jivas did not fall from there. They have come from the marginal point. They have come from Karanabdhisayi Visnu and from tatastha-sakti. Jiva himself is tatastha-sakti.

[PADA: Karanadaksayi Vishnu takes cares of the souls who have fallen. Worse, NM says we come from tatastha, and we are tatastha. We created ourselves? What happened to Krishna, thought He created us!]

[Srimati Syamarani dasi:] Throughout Srila Prabhupada's books he confirms Srila Gurudeva's statements that the jiva never fell from Goloka Vrndavana. In the First Canto Srimad-Bhagavatam, first chapter, first verse, last line, it's stated:

dhamna svena sada nirasta-kuhakam satyam param dhimahi

Srila Vyasadeva says, "I meditate on that Absolute Truth, Sri Krsna, who eternally resides in His own abode which forever free from the illusory representations of this material world. This means that at no time is there any amount of maya in Krsna's abode. In the Third Canto Srimad-Bhagavatam, in the history of Jaya and Vijaya, Pariksit Maharaja asks Sukadeva Gosvami, "How is it possible that Jaya and Vijaya could have fallen down from that realm? 
I don't believe it." 

Any pure devotee will not believe it. Srila Prabhupada writes in the purport of the Seventh Canto, Chapter 1 (Text 35), "Therefore it is to be understood that when Jaya and Vijaya descended to this material world, they came because there was something to be done for the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Otherwise it is a fact that no one falls from Vaikuntha." Jaya and Vijaya had a desire to please the Lord. All the associates of the Lord have only one desire: to give Him pleasure.

[PADA: Except there are many other quotes where he says we did fall from Vaikuntha.]

It's not that this is a new teaching or something that is hidden deep in Caitanya-caritamrta. I joined Prabhupada in New York in October, 1966, and two months later I heard him speak this same thing in his morning class. [Dec. 17, 1966: Karanabdhi-pare. Just on the other side of the Causal Ocean, this material energy is situated. Virajara pare paravyome nahi gati. And this material energy has no entrance in the spiritual kingdom.

Now, the description of the spiritual world is that there is no rajas-tamah. These modes of passion and modes of ignorance is not there. Suddha-sattva. Suddha-sattva means simply goodness, pure goodness, without any tinge of passion and ignorance. So pravartate yatra rajas tamas tayoh sattvam ca misram na ca kala-vikramah. There is no mixed goodness; simply goodness. And na ca kala-vikramah: And there is no influence of time. This is the description of the spiritual world: There is no modes of passion, and there is no modes of ignorance, and there is no influence of time." That means there is simply pure goodness. And in pure goodness we can understand our constitutional position: we can understand what is God, what is creation, everything.]

Srila Gurudeva often quotes a verse from Bhagavad-gita, as does Prabhupada. In his translation and commentary of Bhagavad-gita, Prabhupada writes that when one experiences a higher taste, he leaves the lower taste.

One gives up lower engagements when he experiences a higher taste. Even in the stage of ruci, taste, one has no desire for material pleasures. In asakti, in bhava, what to speak of prema, and what to speak of the devotees who are enraptured, enjoying the pleasures of Goloka Vrndavana; there is no desire for such mundane pleasures. Krsna says in the Gita that one who takes shelter of His spiritual energy is free from maya. That spiritual energy is Yogamaya, and Yogamaya is an expansion of Srimati Radhika. For one who serves Radha and Krsna, there is no question of every having the desire to come to this material world.

Someone wrote Prabhupada a letter and asked, "Did we ever see Krsna?" Prabhupada replied, "Yes, we saw Krsna, just as the child was with the father before coming out of the mother's womb."

["Regarding your second question, have the conditioned souls ever seen Krsna? Were they with the Lord before being conditioned by the desire to lord it over material nature? Yes, the conditioned souls are parts and parcels of the Lord and thus they were with Krsna before being conditioned. Just as the child must have seen his father because the father places the child in the womb of the mother, similarly each soul has seen Krsna or the Supreme Father." (Letter to Jagadisa, Los Angeles, 25 April, 1970)]

In other words, he was saying that we never saw Krsna. We were with Krsna because we came from Krsna - from His tatastha-sakti. That person who came out of his mother's womb never actually associated with the father previously. Later on he meets his father.

[Gokula dasa:] Actually, within ISKCON there was two or three.

[Srila Narayana Maharaja:] I know. I have read them. Srila Swami Maharaja sometimes gave baby food to babies. When I give a baby medicine like quinine, I tell him, "Baby, baby, it is very sweet." I'm telling him something that is not true so that I can give him the medicine. Similarly, Srila Swami Maharaja has written to someone who was very low in bhakti. A letter cannot always be proof. What Srila Swami Maharaja has written in Caitanya-caritamrta and in his Gita and Bhagavata explanation is authentic. These are proofs. He can write something else for a little baby, but it is not proof.

[Gokula dasa:] Srila Gour-Govinda Maharaja said that he was doing it to encourage them. Otherwise.

It is absurd to think that any jiva can fall from Goloka Vrndavana. Any liberated soul can come with Krsna to assist in His pastimes, as Sridama and Subala do. Krsna sends them here only to help the rebellious souls. Try to remember Krsna and follow this doctrine: God is one, there is one religion, and that religion is love and affection for the Supreme Lord Krsna.

Gaura Premanande!

Transcribers: Yamuna dasi, Madhuri dasi, and Vrndavanesvari dasi
Editor: Syamarani dasi
Typist: Radhika dasi 


Srila Bhaktivinoda Thakur says “However, because of contact with matter, the imprisoned soul loses the memory of his original spiritual form in Vaikuntha. . . material rasas are perverted reflections of the soul’s original spiritual RASAS.” Prema-pradipa, p. 83

Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarawati Thakur: ‘It is the jivas who are the attendants IN HIS SPORTS. They become attached to matter, having deviated from their own essential nature as the result of their desire for enjoyment. But when again the soul . . . gains true wisdom of the transcendental region of God . . . he begins to get back his pure essential nature . . .’ Sri Chaitanya’s Teachings, page 323


"The moment the attracted souls are distracted, they glance towards maya from Vaikuntha. At that time the universe is created and material enjoyment overcomes the constitutional duties of the living entities belonging to the marginal potency of the Lord and makes them averse to Krsna. This aversion to Krsna induces the conditioned souls to become bewildered with incomplete thoughts of Brahman and Paramatma, and in their incomplete conceptions of Brahman and Paramatma they are covered by their individual material sentiments."

-- Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakura, in Caitanya Bhagavata, Madhya-khanda 13.084


PADA: NM has a discussion with the GBC in 1978, we know various eye-witnesses, and he said (A) that Srila Prabhupada had told him ALL of his followers are monkeys. Fine. Yet then, (B) NM then said that 11 of these monkey have to be worshiped as rati keli siddhas. Why does NM think that monkeys are rati keli siddha acharyas? 

If we would ask any average five year old child if monkey pooja will take one back to God, they will laugh in your face at this ridiculous idea, even children know this is utter foolishness, you cannot attain God by worship of monkeys. Why doesn't NM know what any child already knows? You can only attain God by worship of His pure devotee, whereas worship of monkeys will simply take one to a future birth as a monkey. 

Even five year olds know you cannot worship monkeys as God's successors? It really does not matter if NM knows how the jeeva falls or not, since he thinks the path to liberate the jeeva is monkey poooja. ys pd


  1. Ginsberg: As the material shadow. How did we fall into that?
    Srila Prabhupada: Yes. Yes. That is very natural. . . Because jiva, although para-sakti, he has got independence. So when he wants to imitate Krishna. . . In the spiritual world, Krishna is the enjoyer. And all others, they are enjoyed--predominator and the predominating. The Lord is the predominating, so there is no disagreement. There they know, ‘The Lord is predominator; we have to serve.’ When this service attitude is impaired, that--‘Why serve Krishna? Why not ourself?’--that is Maya. - Room conversation with Allen Ginsberg in Columbus, OH 5-14-69
    Acyutananda Maharaj: In Krishna book, it says that there were some color-fighting in Dvaraka. They were throwing color. And some men became lusty seeing the women. . . Will that be the first part of their falldown, to be in Vaikuntha and think of personal lust with Krishna’s associates?
    Srila Prabhupada: “Yes.”
    Room conversation in Mayapur, India, February 19, 1976

  2. "The original home of the living entity and the Supreme Personality of Godhead is the spiritual world. In the spiritual world both the Lord and the living entities live together very peacefully. Since the living entity remains engaged in the service of the Lord, they both share a blissful life in the spiritual world. However, when the living entity wants to enjoy himself, he falls down into the material world. Even while he is in that position, the Lord remains with him as the Supersoul, his intimate friend. Because of his forgetfulness, the living entity does not know that the Supreme Lord is accompanying him as the Supersoul. In this way the living entity remains conditioned in each and every millennium. Although the Lord follows him as a friend, the living entity, because of forgetful material existence, does not recognize Him."
    Srila Prabhupada SB 4.28.54

  3. Ok prabhu, so I am offending Narayana Maharaja, at the same time, you are saying that some scumbags from 1936 appointed false gurus, and some scumbags from 1977 appointed even more false gurus. OK, so why does NM say these scum bags are his poojya padas and Tamal is his dear Tamal tree of Radha? Should we not agree with shastra, that scumbags are not our poojyapadas and dear Tamal trees? You lost me here, what is your point? ys pd


Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.