Saturday, February 11, 2017

Sridhara Maharaja / Swarupa Hebel and Shiksha and Diksha

PADA: The books of Srila Prabhupada are giving divyam jnanam which destroys sins. That is diksha. Swarup Hebel and co. have not identified the source of diksha in their process? The books are no longer giving divyam jnanam which destroy sins (diksha)? Then who is the source of diksha? 

Swarup Hebel: Diksha diksha diksha -- you have a one track mind. Diksha -- everyone needs to get a name and join the club. 

[PADA: OK so getting initiation from a pure devotee is some sort of "joining the club"? In any case, you failed to tell us who is the source of diksha in your system? Yes, this is a one track issue, we need to know who is the source of diksha in your system?] 

Swarup Hebel: Never mind that as far back as '72 Prabhupada was saying that we don't need to expand but rather we need to boil the milk. Already so many were falling away -- not following the principles and not chanting -- and many not understanding the philosophy properly. 

[PADA: Great! So why did you and your Sridhara Maharaja "club" say that the same GBC leaders that you mention, i.e. those who are falling down left, right and center, -- are God's successors and acharyas? And is this not what your same club did after 1936, annointed a non-realized soul as your acharya? You are arguing with yourself, you said the leaders are falling away, and at the same time, Sridhara Maharaja is authorized to declare these falling away people are the appointed acharyas?

Yes, the leaders are falling down, and yet you and your Sruta Srava program supported Sridhara Maharaja, who says these falling down people are -- the appointed acharyas. That means -- you appointed them as acharyas, no one else did! Why did your program name known falling down persons as Krishna's acharyas?]  

Swarup Hebel: ISKCON was never meant to be an assembly line for making new club members. Prabhupada wasn't initiated until over a decade after his first meeting with his guru maharaja. There is no artificial process for diksa -- not the ritvik way and not the ISKCON way. Oh -- then there must be another way? Figure it out, genius. You're the expert on the subject.

[PADA: Well you guys already figured it all out apparently, your Sridhara Maharaja program first supported a bi-sexual deviant as the acharya in 1936, and then your program supported 11 deviants as acharyas after 1977 in ISKCON. 

Meanwhile, you cannot give any better explanation for what was ordered? 

Meanwhile the followers of Sridhara Maharaja like Pancadravida, Tripurari and others are taking disciples based on the idea they are the current diksha gurus. Where is the mandate to make them the successors to Krishna? And why do they think they can absorb sins like Jesus?] 

Swarup Hebel: Sure -- on the basis of some unclear letter that could swing either way --- you want to set Prabhupada up to be awarding diksa forever to an unlimited stream of unqualified people he has to take the karma for. Real compassionate. If Prabhupada wanted to continue initiating after his departure (and don't you dare jump down my throat for saying "departure' or "demise" or "posthumous" because Prabhupada used the same words about previous acaryas so don't you dare play that idiot game with me) --- he would have issued the mandate clear as day. 

[PADA: But Sridhara Maharaja is the one who said that the mandate is that 11 conditioned souls are the appointed acharyas. Where is this mandate ordered? And Sridhara Maharaja also first of all said that the 1936 mandate is that Ananta Vasudeva is the acharya. Maybe you guys should validate your own mandate before you challenge others? 

Anyway, the bottom line is that Sridhara Maharaja said that there is a mandate is to worship conditioned souls as the acharya, and now you wonder -- where is the mandate that we should have worshiped the pure devotee instead? Why do we even need a specific written mandate to order us to worship pure devotees as the acharya? Why do you expect that Jesus would have to write "a mandate" that he would be worshiped for the next 2,000 years? Didn't people continue his worship because -- he is qualified to accept that worship?]   

Swarup Hebel: Some knucklehead above used the sun example trying to insinuate that my eyes can't see the sun even though it's out. Brilliant way to debate a point. Why am I wasting my time with you people? You have your minds made up and you demonize everyone who disagrees with you.

[PADA: Well, your Sridhara Maharaja program is famous for demonizing the dissenting people who failed to worship his appointed illicit sex acharyas. People who dissented his false gurus in 1936 were banned, beaten and killed, and people who dissented his false gurus after post 1977 were also banned, beaten and killed. And this is the program you support?]  

RJL: Srila Prabhupada he knew that these sanyasin's were falling down when he was present , to suggest that he would make such a monumental error, as to leave and authorise these people as good as God gurus, knowing they are liable to fall down, is to cast a shadow of doubt over his authority.

JS: The proper understanding of SRILA PRABHUPADA'S INSTRUCTIONS cannot be "the basis of some unclear letter that could swing either way", so the proper understanding of JULY 9, 1977 LETTER is essential.

RJL: All you have to do is look at what happened to the first eleven, all of them failed, that's not a good foundation and clear indication something is wrong, the GBC is self selected -- no authority. SRILA PRABHUPADA COMES WITH A 100% GUARANTEE TO TAKE YOU HOME THE OTHERS DONT. YOU DECIDE.

Swarup Hebel Ugh! Yes -- but that doesn't mean he continues initiating everyone that comes forward. It means he is jagat guru forever and for everyone through his teachings as he lives forever in his books. Look up the word siksha. One letter -- off by one letter -- and all this confusion and hysteria.

PD: Swarupa, you say, "The ISKCON process of GBC approved initiators is wrong .. but so is the idea that Prabhupada continues to initiate new disciples after his departure. Both are wrong". Since you say that both these 'systems' are wrong, what is the right system? 

And of course there is the July 9th letter that clearly confirms Srila Prabhupada's "answer" from May 28th. So, again Swarupa, how much "clear as day" does Srila Prabhupada need to be for you?!

Swarup Hebel: Elvis has left the building so talk among yourselves. I'm all 

PADA: Right, so that is the whole problem with Swarupa's program, and his former BBT truck driving associated pals like Sruta Srava, who supported Sridhara Maharaja. They think that neophytes can absorb sins like Jesus, BUT Srila Prabhupada said if the neophytes do that, they will get sick, fall down, or both, and not only do these false diksha gurus fall down, so do the people who supported that system. 

There is no confusion, these neophytes are falling down, because they are not able to absorb sins. Sridhara Maharaja said I was wrong to protest Jayatirtha, and look what happens? And his 1936 guru fell down and commited suicide. What kind of guru parampara is this? Only a pure devotee can give pure divyam jnanam, and nullify the sins of the conditioned souls. 

"On the Passing of Sripada Vaishnava Maharaja" (Sruta Srava)

You guys are with the Gaudiya Matha.

Swarupa's pal Sruta Srava went over the river to the Gaudiya Matha. Did we forget to mention the Gaudiya Matha had the same illicit sex acharyas program that the GBC had? Yes, they MIS-IDENTIFY the source of divyam jnanam which destroys sins. Worse, Sridhara Maharaja says acharyas "go mad after money, women and followers." 

Why did Sruta Srava et al. go and "seek shelter" of the people who created debauchees as their acharyas? They are the ones who created all the confusion and hysteria, by appointing fools as diksha gurus. That is what these folks said also in 1936, Srila Saraswati is the SHIKSHA guru and DEBAUCHEES are the DIKSHA gurus. Why did they not learn this was wrong way back then after they produced scandals, beatings, murders, lawsuits etc.? 

Of course, now that Sridhara Maharaja has departed, his program has morphed into now doing guru pooja to people like Tripurari swami, Pancadravida and other diksha guru wanna-bes. More foolishness created by the Swarupa / Sruta srava program. These guys have never learned, conditioned souls cannot be diksha gurus! 

RKD: Person bhagavat and book bhagavat there is no difference .

PADA: Right, in the Sruta Srava / Swarupa Hebel plan, the book Bhagavata is dead, gone and invalid, and their "living" debauchees are the living, valid and worshipable persons. They just did a guru pooja for Panca Dravida in Santa Cruz, and the reason they worship him is that he supports Sridhara's illicit sex acharya's process. Sridhara Maharaja is the founder father of the post-1936 illicit sex acharya's program, and he was a huge cheer leader of the post-1977 GBC's illicit sex acharya's program. 

Did we forget to mention that our "Prabhupada fanatic" dissenters were banned, beaten, and killed, in both post 1936 and post 1977? Apparently, the only living persons allowed in their process are their illicit sex acharyas and followers of such deviations, and everyone else has to be banned, leave or die. Yep, not only the book Bhagavat does not deserve to live on, neither are we allowed to live on. We all have to be eliminated. 

Regarding your questions are the Spiritual Master and the Grand Spiritual Master consciously aware of the prayers of a sincere devotee who prays in love to Them?—the answer is that no conscious prayers go in vain. They are transmitted positively. But one thing you must know that any prayer you offer to your Spiritual Master and Superior Spiritual Master, all of them are conveyed to Krishna, so no sincere prayers go in vain. We shall always offer such prayers to Spiritual Master, Superior Spiritual Master, Vaisnava Acaryas, Lord Caitanya, and at the end Radha Krishna, that is the system.
Hope this will meet you in good health.
Your ever well-wisher,
A.C. Bhaktivedanta swami

Swarupa was asking for fundme money to help his dire "living on a shoestring" situation. Even Swarupa Hebel could no longer stand the horrible smell coming from his, Sruta Srava's and Sridhara's alleged GBC living gurus. And so even Swarupa, Sruta Srava etc had to leave the scene. So they create these false gurus, create a hellish situation for everyone, including even themselves, then they just waltz off the stage leaving the ISKCON house burnt to the ground. 

That is also what Sridhara did in the Gaudiya Matha, he backed false gurus ... and Srila Prabhupada said "there was a fire in the Matha," and then Sridhara just waltzed off and did nothing to rectify the mess he had made. This is exactly what the Sridhara, Swarupa Hebel and Sruta Srava program did after 1977, they made ISKCON into an uninhabitable place with their bogus living gurus, and then they just leave like nothing happened. 

Yes, me and Sulochana used to discuss this point: Srila Prabhupada made a religion the whole world could live in. Right! Then, the GBC / Sridhara Maharaja / Swarupa Hebel / Sruta Srava / debauchee guru program was so bad, even they could not live in their own stinky pie mess! Even they had to leave! Same think happened in 1936, Sridhara Maharaja made such a mess of the Gaudiya Matha, even he had to leave it behind! Sridhara Maharaja de facto said, yes, the stink I am making here is so bad, get me out of here! And the same can be said of the individual members of their program like Bhakti Vikas swami ---

Bhakti Viksa Swami: ISKCON -- A society no one can live in?

Swarup Hebel: I sometimes wonder how devotees appear to outsiders -- especially those who read some of the exchanges that go on right here on facebook? Do we sometimes appear to be ...

Over quoted
Blindly devoted?
Extremely philosophical?
Intensely theosophical?
Sometimes somewhat tentative
... and often argumentative ??

I certainly hope not. I do think that it's important to always remember who and what we are representing when we present ourselves as "the Hare Krishna people."

[PADA: Well great, your Sridhara Maharaja / Sruta Srava illicit sex acharya program has given Krishna's movement a black eye, in both 1936 and now. ys pd]


  1. Right prabhu, Swarupa fell down himself, apparently into heroin addiction, and the living gurus in Sridhara Maharaja and Swarupa's program often fell down as well. Yes, its very depressing to be promoting bogus gurus, and a lot of the bogus gurus and the people who promoted them fell down.

    As one devotee told me recently "these false gurus and their supporters all went down in a fiery crash." And almost right away, one of the living gurus in the Sridhara program ran off with a woman, the temple money and so on, and that type thing is also what happened to a number of the GBC gurus.

    So their gurus are falling down, the supporters are falling down, the whole thing is collapsing because its based on an artificial idea, that conditioned souls can be gurus. So their bogus gurus fall down, the supporters fall down, then the whole ISKCON society fails, just like Sridhara made the Gaudiya Matha fail with the same bogus guru process in 1936.

    The good news is, many of our new Prabhupadnaugas are not failing, rather they are doing good service because they are connected to the acharyas and the parampara. Swarupa is such a fool, he wants our new Prabhupada people to give up their connection to the parampara just like he did, and join him in "the fiery crash and burn program."

    Yes, misery loves company! Hee hee! Well too bad, our new people are not going for it by and large, and that's because they have the superior taste of following the parampara system. It is amazing how these people ruined ISKCON by their helping Sridhara in promoting false gurus, and they still think this was the right path! ys pd

  2. Right, Sridhara Maharaja is promoting the worship of illicit sex and drugs as God's eternal acharyas and messiahs from heaven, and then we wonder why his shiksha disciples like Swarupa have a drug problem?


    Hee hee, yes, someone else says, these guys are getting what they really want, a cheap path to God without doing any actual heavy lifting, and that is why they compromise with the worship of illicit sex and drugs, they think there is some "easy path" back to God, and technically this is called SAHAJIYA VADA (one who takes things cheaply). Correct! ys pd


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