PADA: Yep. I was initiated (divyam jnanam that destroys sins) mainly by reading the books. And we are telling others to do the same. Obviously, the external formal initiation is not the main element, because most of the 1970s formal initiated deviated.
The main ingredient is accepting the divyam jnanam that destroys sins (aka diksha) from the acharya, and it is not the external ceremony that is the main element. Good news, more folks are coming to our blogs and sites and we have been interviewed for a really big media presentation.
In sum, we are making good progress. I was just talking for 2 hours with some East Coast devotees and they said, our idea of worship of the acharya is going to be the only accepted idea eventually, even if it takes 100 years. Hee hee! Right. We have to accept the acharya, offer our bhogha to the pure devotee, etc. there is no other option. ys pd
KV Serbia: PADA Pranams prabhu. Well there is other options prabhu.
First option is to accept and worship Srila Prabhupada as siksha guru and offer bhoga to him as siksha guru.Since it is not proper to switch from one deviation (unauthorized and without minimal adhikar institutional " gurus " ) to postsamadhi ritvic initiations. That is huge deviation as well since that is not system established by Sri Krishna for diksha initiations.
KV Serbia: PADA Pranams prabhu. Well there is other options prabhu.
First option is to accept and worship Srila Prabhupada as siksha guru and offer bhoga to him as siksha guru.Since it is not proper to switch from one deviation (unauthorized and without minimal adhikar institutional " gurus " ) to postsamadhi ritvic initiations. That is huge deviation as well since that is not system established by Sri Krishna for diksha initiations.
If such system is bonafide, then all vaishnavas after Lord Chaitanya will establish Srila Rupa Goswami, or Srila Ragunatha Giswami or Srila Narotama Dasa Thakura as future diksha gurus. But they did not do that since it is heresy and apasidhanta, Christianity and Kartabhaja apa sampradaya use such system.
Second option is that some of Srila Prabhupada diksha disciples reach needed adhikar, madhyam as minimum and receive order from Srila Prabhupada to start to act as diksha guru.
Second option is that some of Srila Prabhupada diksha disciples reach needed adhikar, madhyam as minimum and receive order from Srila Prabhupada to start to act as diksha guru.
[PADA: That is incorrect. The Madhyam devotee cannot give pure divyam jnanam, nor can he absorb the sins of others. Srila Prabhupada says the Madhyam has to be careful -- because he can still fall down and become a demon by hearing Mayavada. It is not a fully fixed platform.
Srila Prabhupada also says -- only the uttama has the brahmana tejyas to burn off the sins of others. Srila Prabhupada does not say the Madhyam is going to be considered as an acharya in the parampara. Where is this stated? And most of the Srila Prabhupada devotees are gone, they left ISKCON, or they left their bodies. What happens when all of them are gone, and that will be soon?]
The mentioned options ARE according to shastras, guru parampara rules and according orders from Srila Prabhupada.
[PADA: Where does Srila Prabhupada say the Madhyam devotees are members of the parampara, you do not cite any shastra? In any case, therefore people should worship "who or whom" as the current diksha guru who is taking their sins? You keep failing to say. Worship of no one is a wise choice? Not sure why you never mention the name of the current diksha guru? Is it someone or no one? Ys pd]
KV Serbia: Srila Prabhupada should be worshiped as Acarya and siksha guru. Together with chanting Hare Krishna Maha Mantra, following 4 regs, reading Srila Prabhupadas books and listening his lectures. At the moment that is the process for advancment in bhakti and purification from sins included. This is main part now, but Srila Prabhupada has one madhyam adhikari disciple who also can help with his siksha to understand better tattva and siddhanta from shastras.
[PADA: Srila Prabhupada has one Madhyam adhikary disciple who will help us, named who or whom? OK if there is no name for your diksha guru, then there is none. The Madhyam also cannot absorb sins either, that is incorrect.
Of course, since you name no one as the diksha guru, there is no one / nothing here anyway for us to consider. Srila Prabhupada has one Madhyam, and if we give the Madhyama our sins by having him absorb sins from others, we destroy his life. He cannot absorb sins.
In any case, you have no one to give us, no name, no one there, empty house, this is called mayavada, no one is ever named. Srila Prabhupada says not giving the name of the guru is mayavada. That is not the process, we are personalists, we name the persons.
I have asked you several times previously "who" is the Madhyam devotee you keep refering to, and you keep avoiding giving his name. I do not think this person exists, it is all phantasmagoria. How many times do we have to ask for the name of this alleged person before we get it?
And if people need to be liberated now and today, why are you blocking them by advertising that they need to take shelter of a guru, who does not even exist? All glories to -- nodody? That is not the process. So this is pretty amazing, we would rather worship no one and nothing -- than worship the pure devotee.
ys pd] angel108b@yahoo.com
LW: There is someone ... somewhere ... maybe ... a Madhyam Srila Prabhupada disciple, and he will liberate us and take us back to Krishna. Except, Madhyam is not considered as fully liberated yet. Nor do we know "who" this disciple is.
ReplyDeleteThis sounds like a real brainwashing job. Meanwhile we offer bhogha to Srila Prabhupada and read his books, but these books have no divyam jnanam. We have to attain that from the Madhyam disciple, who we cannot find in 45 years.
It has taken 45 years to discover, there is a Madhyam disciple now present, but we forgot to find out what his name is. Is this the best argument they can come up with at this point? I think this is the result of listening to the GBC for 45 years. You have to go find yourself another guru ... other than Prabhupada, but he is not even an uttama, and we do not know where he is, or who he is.
Does anyone think this makes any sense? There is also increasingly major shortage of original Srila Prabhupada disciples, whether Madhyam or whatever they are. What are we going to do when the last of them disappears?
Srila Prabhupada followers are going to have to be brand new people, because the first group is on the way out. They just want to cling onto the old ways, worshiping one of the old timers, but that never worked after 1978 and it still is not working. If anything, worship of the old timers has been a disaster zone. They need to wake up and grow up. Worship of the dead body of conditioned people is childish and foolish.
PADA: Yep prabhu, he still does not give the name of his alleged Madhyam shiksha guru we are all supposedly talking about. I don't think there is anyone. It is a bluff.
ReplyDeleteKailash does the same thing, we need to surrender to the Madhyam Srila Prabhupada disciples, who -- do not have any names? And evidently, do not exist. He is stumped now, because he now realizes, he cannot name anyone as the alleged Madhyam devotee. This is the result of listening to so much GBC chit chatter over the years, he has heard about the alleged Madhyam devotees over and over, but the GBC produces illicit sex deviants as gurus, who are not even kanisthas.
And since some of their gurus are pedophiles, they are not even up to mundane moral standards of the karmi society. ys pd