Srila Prabhupada's Vani (Bhakta C)

"Mother Yasoda and Krishna" / PADA art / angel108b@yahoo.com

Bhakta C: I find it terribly discouraging that some of your "dear God brothers" (like Aniha?) are saying that us "new Prabhupada followers" are a dangerous sahajiya cult. That means ... some of your God brothers are openly trying to have us removed from Srila Prabhupada's movement ... just like they removed all of you. They don't know, ISKCON is empty?

Or maybe they want to have us bashed in the head by their temple goondas ... just like they had you devotees bashed in the head. It really means ... they are at war with the new and old followers of Prabhupada. We are dangerous ... because we want to worship a pure devotee. That sounds unreal, except we all know that is what they believe. 

Which means ... they are really at war with ... Srila Prabhupada. Why would they say worshiping Krishna and His pure devotee is a dangerous sahajiya cult, while seeming to forget ... their cult is seen as sahajiya and dangerous by us ... and even ... the general public! I think your idea, "Srila Prabhupada is the Jesus of ISKCON" is a big threat to them, because they always wanted to be the Jesus of ISKCON. Look at all the foolish "Jesus" they made, and they are still proud of their achievement. (???)   

Then they complain ... there are no servants in their temple? They do not want servants in their temple. It is empty, and that is just what they wanted. I see how they operate. They wanted to kick all of you people out ... to have the Hindus to come ... so they can rake in tons of donated cash money. They do not want to make serious and intelligent devotees, because those devotees will ask ... where is all the money going? I think we see how all the money ends up in the hands of the few. 

My friend says Jayapataka swami is tired of all the fighting he has been doing, and he just wants to coast to the end now. He no longer wants to fund his big lawsuit against Bangalore, ... it has been a giant waste of time and money, and simply produced a lot of bad publicity ... and huge expense. 

And even if he could win now, what would be the point? He will be dead soon, and so will Gopal Krishna swami, Lokanath swami and all the other big shots over there. So maybe they can realize, making a war against the Prabhupada devotees is not helping them in this life, or the next. I also heard Dayarama is tired of his legal battling with the Prabhupada devotees as well, and he has "retired" from the legal fight.

Every day I am reading Srila Prabhupada words and finding it an inspiration. I am not going to go to the Himalayas to find my guru there!!! These people are simply envious of Srila Prabhupada. You are right, they want anyone to be the guru as long as it is not him. I was just reading this today and wanted to share this, just to show that these words are still living ... at least for some of us. 

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66/03/02 New York, Bhagavad-gita 2.7-11 

So this is the whole thing, the whole basic principle of spiritual advancement of knowledge. One should first be convinced that he is not this body. He is not this body. Then other spiritual knowledge will begin. This is the basic principle. You'll find it. You'll find it in the Bhagavad-gita that this situation of spiritual life is called brahma-bhutah. Brahman. So

brahma-bhutah prasannatma
na socati na kanksati
samah sarvesu bhutesu
mad-bhaktim labhate param
[Bg. 18.54]

So the, unless one understands himself, he also cannot understand God also. In his, in his misunderstanding position... Now, what Dr. Mishra is teaching is very nice because he is teaching that "Just first of all you know 'What I am, what I...' " That's very good. But that "what I am" can be known from the Bhagavad-gita also, that "I am not this body. I am not this body." 

That knowledge, at least theoretically, one must accept, that "I am not this body." Now Krsna is describing that what is the position. I am not this body. That's all right. Now, actually, what we are? What we are? I'm not body. That's all right. Then what we are? 

Now, the next, next version is Krsna... We must always know that Krsna... Here it is said, bhagavan uvaca. Bhagavan uvaca. Bhagavan uvaca means that He has got so extensive knowledge that there cannot be any mistake. He's authority. He's authority. So whatever He says is right. Is right. 

That is the conception of bhagavan. Here it is not said, Krsnah uvaca. Because somebody may doubt Krsna, that "Krsna was a historical personality. Why you should be so much concerned with Krsna?" as is general view. But here it is said, bhagavan uvaca. And I have given you the definition of Bhagavan, that He is all knowledge. So whatever He will speak, Bhagavan, there cannot be any mistake. For ordinary persons, there are four, I mean to say, difficulties, four imperfectness. 

Just like we are ordinary man. We have got four imperfectness. What is that imperfectness? That we must commit mistake. We must commit mistake. Our constitutional position at the present moment is such that we are sure to commit mistake. Even greatest politician like Gandhi, he committed mistake, and so many great men, they committed mistake. "To err is human," therefore, it is called, that any, any man, however he may be great in the estimation of this world, he is sure to commit mistake. And another imperfection is that he is illusioned.

Woman: Illusioned.

Prabhupada: Illusioned. Now, illusioned you can see. Illusioned means taking one thing for another. That is called illusion. Just like in the desert, accepting the sand as water. That is called illusion. Similarly, every one of us who are identified with this body, he's under illusion. That is a false thing, but he has no knowledge. Even President Johnson, he's under illusion. Even the greatest scientist, he's under this illusion. So that, one is sure to commit mistake, and one is under illusion, and bhrama, pramada and vipralambhana... Vipralambhana means the tendency for cheating.

Woman: That is the fourth?

Prabhupada: That is the third. First is that one is sure to commit mistake, one is sure to be in illusion, and one is adapted to cheat others. Now, he is imperfect, but he wants to give knowledge to others. That is cheating. Everyone is imperfect, but he wants to give knowledge to others. Then you can ask that "You are also giving us knowledge?" No, I am not giving you knowledge. I am speaking Bhagavad-gita. I am giving you knowledge as given by Lord Krsna. It is not my knowledge.

Woman: But this is own interpretation.

Prabhupada: Eh? Not interpretation. It is reading.

Woman: One can cheat.

Prabhupada: I give you... Cheat. No, that is also in the definition of a conditioned soul. These four principles are there. It is not my manufactured thing. The, these are information from authoritative scripture, that a conditioned soul has four imperfectness. One imperfectness is that he's sure to commit mistake. He's illusioned, and he has got a tendency to cheat, and, above all, his senses are imperfect. So anyone who is above all these four imperfectness -- who never commits mistake, who is never illusioned, who never cheats others, and who has got perfect senses -- He is God.

Prabhupada: Now, the next question is that the Mayavadi philosophers, they say that "Because I am now covered in ignorance, therefore I see individuals." Yes.
Woman: Is that a main claim?(?)

Prabhupada: Yes. My... This individual experience that you are Mr. Such and Such, you are Mr. Such and Such, you are Mrs. Such and Such, this individual experience, is due to my ignorance. And generally, they give the example of a disease. I think it is called, medical terms, myopia. Myopia means they see this moon in two. The eyes become so defective that whenever they see things, they see two.

Woman: No, that's astigmatism.

Prabhupada: Uh, yes.

Woman: Myopia is when you have to see very near.

Prabhupada: I said... It may not be myopia, but some disease.

Woman: Astigmatism. Some sees, if somebody sees...

Prabhupada: Yes. Sometimes...

Woman: Astigmatism. In two, if somebody sees. Astigmatism.

Prabhupada: Yes.

Woman: In two. Is it a sickness?

Prabhupada: Yes. It is sickness.

Woman: In the eyes.

Prabhupada: Because, because the thing is one, but due to my disease of the eye, I see one thing, two. That is a disease. There is a disease like that. So...

Woman: Usually people who drink.

Prabhupada: Anyway, that's an abnormal condition. In abnormal condition sometimes we can see one thing into two, divided into two. So now that ignorance, you cannot apply to Krsna because He's all-perfect. And if He is not all-perfect, then there is no value of His instruction. A man with defect in knowledge cannot impart instructions. His instructions... Therefore the whole Vedic process is parampara system. Parampara system means that I cannot deviate. I cannot make any interpretation. Evam parampara-praptam imam rajarsayo viduh [Bg. 4.2]. 

You'll find in the Fourth Chapter. Now we are reading Second Chapter. You'll find, as we have explained in the introduction of Bhagavad-gita, that because... Just like I am speaking to you. I am an imperfect person. I cannot give you any knowledge. I cannot manufacture any knowledge. If I do that, then I shall deceive you. I can simply present before you the original knowledge. I can explain it in an understandable way but not deviating from the original text. 

Now, here it is clearly stated by the Supreme Personality of Godhead that na tu eva aham jatu [Bg. 2.12]. Aham. Aham means Sri Krsna Himself. Now sometimes we make some grammatical jugglery of words, but I cannot understand. Now, aham, "myself," when I speak aham, or "myself," is applicable to me. When you speak, the aham is applicable to you. But that does not mean because there is a common understanding of myself between you and me, therefore I... Now that I and you become one. When you speak, you say, "I speak." When I say, I say, "I speak." 

That does not mean this "I" and that "I" becomes one. So Sri Krsna says like that, na tu aham.

Woman: Ah, yes.

Prabhupada: He. That means this aham, Sri Krsna. And na tvam: "And you." That means Arjuna. And na ime janadhipah: "Neither all these kings." He's dividing the whole audience into three: "Myself, yourself and they." And again He confirms it, sarve: "all." He never identifies into one. So this is the version of Sri Krsna. Now, if I say that our interpretation of aham, I, myself, yourself, and he, or she, different vision, this is due to our ignorance. You can say. Because I am ignorant, it may be my mistake, that I see differently from you. But Sri Krsna, Lord Sri Krsna, cannot see like that. He is above all this ignorance because He's all-perfect. 

And we have already defined that the Supreme Lord is full of knowledge. So... He's full of knowledge, supreme knowledge. Now, if the Supreme Personality, with full knowledge... He cannot commit any mistake.

Woman: No.

Prabhupada: How can He commit any mistake? Then there is no meaning of full knowledge. If you are in full knowledge, then how you can commit mistake? So this ignorance of duality, because they say that "We see two because it is due to our ignorance. All, everything is one," but here you cannot apply that ignorance to Sri Krsna. Otherwise, His instruction of whole Bhagavad-gita, which is so importantly taken by all authorities, all scholars, then it is at once rejected. If it is supposed that Sri Krsna was also to commit mistake, or He was in imperfect knowledge, then whole thing becomes rejected. So it is not, not like that.
So Sri Krsna, He is the Supreme Personality of Godhead, He's in full knowledge, and therefore as He says that "Either Myself or yourself or all these persons, kings and soldiers, who are assembled here, they're all individuals. 

In the past they were individuals, in the present we are individuals, and in the future they will continue to be individuals." Now, one thing... Suppose another argument is that due to ignorance... Just like an animal. It thinks that there is water in the desert, on the reflec...

Woman: What?

Prabhupada: Water in the desert. Now, in the desert, due to sun's reflection... You might have experienced in the street also, during blazing sun. It appears like water. Now, that animal, because it has no knowledge, it is, I mean to say, flying towards water in the desert. Although there is no water. But a sane man like you and me, or a human being, he knows that there is no water. There is no water. So this direction, that there is water, this mistake is committed by the animal because he, it has no sufficient knowledge. But one, a human being who has got sufficient knowledge, he does not commit that mistake. Yes.

Woman: Does an animal make that mistake? I thought the animals...

Prabhupada: Eh?

Woman: ...wouldn't, would, uh...

Prabhupada: No, no. This is a...

Woman: ...not see the water that our eyes tell us that there is a mirage in the desert.

Prabhupada: Yes. I mean to say, any sane man who has got the knowledge that "This is only reflection of the sun; it is not water," he will never go there. He knows that it is useless to search water in the desert. Similarly, if Sri Krsna is in full knowledge, He cannot say that in future also we shall all remain individuals. He says that in the future also we shall continue to be individuals. Now, He cannot give us misdirection. 

Suppose we, in the future we shall not remain. After liberation, we shall not become, remain, individuals. Then that sort of misguidance cannot be given by Sri Krsna. Just like a sane man cannot direct you that "Just go there. There is water in the desert." A man with perfect knowledge cannot give you that direction. A animal may go there. That is a different thing. Similarly, when Sri Krsna says that "In future also, we, all these, yourself, Myself, and all these, they will keep their individuality," so that is not a misdirection. You want to say anything?

Woman: Sure. But is that what the Bhagavad-gita's saying on...

Prabhupada: Yes.

Woman: ...I mean (being?) a lot to it? (?)

Prabhupada: Yes. It is, it is... I'll, I'll, I'll give you, I'll give you the exact meaning. Na tu eva aham: "Neither Myself." Aham means "myself." Jatu. Jatu means "at any time." At any time means present, past, future. Jatu kadacit. Kadacit means "at any time." Nasam: "Not that we did not exist." So na tvam. So this aham, "myself and yourself," na ime, "neither these janadhipah, all these kings." Now, this plural: "Myself," first person, "yourself," second person, "and these janadhipah," third person. Na caiva na bhavisyamah: 

"It is not that in future also we shall not exist like this, Myself, yourself and all these." You see? Sarve. Now, here it is called sarve. They never becomes one. Sarve means all, plural number. Here means janadhipah. "As they are now plural numbers, Myself, yourself, and they, similarly, in future also, we shall remain like that. We shall remain like that." Sarve vayam atah param: "After this." This is the clear version of number -- you can note down -- number twelve verse of the Second Verse, er, Chapter of Bhagavad-gita.