[PADA: Thanks prabhu, yes this confirms what we have been saying the whole while. Agreed! ys pd]
angel108b@yahoo.com
From: Matty Dread
Here is a sure fire way to cut down on your friends and find out who your real true friends are. Cutting the wheat from the chaff so to speak. Not airing no dirty laundry here, but speaking the truth whilst sharing with you what has been going on in my heart and head for many, many months now. I'm away for a week as from today, will check back next weekend maybe?
RAPE, BURN AND PILLAGE -- AT BHAKTIVEDANTA MANOR (UK).
It is a sad, sad day indeed, when my wife turns around to me and says, "I will never step one foot passed the gates of Bhaktivedanta Manor to do seva again." Myself and my wife, have both been attending Bhaktivedanta manor since our teenage years, separately before we met, and then later on as a married couple, we our both now in our forties. I personally, will never do any seva at Bhaktivedanta Manor again. Well, not at least until there is a big change in the managerial structure there. After this letter, I’ll probably be lucky to even take darsan, but I am beyond the point of caring about being shunned by an increasingly sectarian "community" because what I have to write about here is so serious.
We have both been treated like dirt, for want of a better expression by Syamasundara dasa, the farm manager at Bhaktivedanta manor and head of ISKCON'S European farming and goshalla's, and also by his wife, Lalita Sakhi devi dasi, the new dairy manageress, for allegedly stealing seventy jars of honey, Then, two weeks after Janmastami 2013, this had escalated to now also include £1000.00 or so.
All this, we allegedly took from the goshalla craft shop that we created over two years ago. We were asked to create a craft shop on the wishes of Syamasundara dasa. Back in September 2013, my wife, Lainey was sent a text by Syamasundara dasa “to urgently check her email.”
By the way, Syamasundara dasa didn't even have the gumption to tell us to our faces. He had written in his email that, "that she was suspended from her position as craft shop manageress." Suspended!!! The laughable thing is, is that neither of us have ever been on a wage. That’s right folks, it’s called good old fashioned bhakti, remember that?
Please, please ask yourselves one rational question here. Why would Lainey work so tirelessly, over two years on building up such a beautiful craft shop, getting all the devotee crafters on board, which was a logistical nightmare, whilst supporting the goshalla, and mainly grihasta devotee’s from our very own UK yatra, only then to shoot herself in the foot by dipping in to the `honey pot?
My dear wife Lainey, would do anything to help anyone, especially within the devotee community. Sad to say that both of our seva, and the kripa of our bhakti, has been well and truly trampled over. May I ask the questions?
A: Where is the proof of these alleged allegations?
B: If we are guilty, then why haven't the police been called on us?
This whole honey-gate "suspension" was a smoke screen ruse to get rid of us, plain and simple, as we obviously served our purpose of getting the shop established, and were also always seen by the management as "lose cannons." Plus, since Syamasundara's wife, Lalita Sakhi devi dasi, took over as dairy manageress, and started to stock the shop with her dairy products, she has had her beady eye’s on the New gokul Craft shop right from the start.
I myself, have been doing unpaid ox-seva, for what would have been four years last November, and I was asked, in yet another email, by Syamasundara, again not in person, to return all my farm keys. I take this as indirectly telling me, that my service to the oxen, and the goshalla at Bhaktivedanta manor was no longer required. This is yet another bullying tactic by the Bhaktivedanta Manor management, and i am sorry, but I will not be bullied by anyone.
The basic problem with most of the devotees on a wage at Bhaktivedanta manor, (not the one’s living in the derelict, rat infested "dog house" just up the road from the temple.) Is that most of them are also living in temple owned accommodation outside of the temple, and they also take a wage from the temple. So thus, by speaking out against any injustices or cover ups at the manor, they have everything to lose because Bhaktivedanta manor has them, for want of a better expression by the short and curlys. So basically, they’ll either lose their job(s) or lose their house(s), simple. Yet another well thought out strategical plan by the Bhaktivedanta manor managers?
Where as, on the other hand, for those of us who do not rely on the temple for a salary, and accommodation, we stand to lose neither. We own our small one bedroom flat, where we live a modest life, and we have stood on our own two feet from when we were both, coincidentally, at the same age of sixteen years old. As I said before, Lainey, my dear wife has vowed that she will never engage in any seva at Bhaktivedanta manor again, and I now too have taken this vow also.
As far as any alleged theft was concerned, I proceeded to contact the temple president, Srutidhama dasa by email regarding the unfair `suspension`, and treatment of me and my wife. I received a punitive email that, directed me to the `grievance / complaints department ` at Bhaktivedanta manor. Like i could just be cheaply fobbed off. There was no `sorry` or, `i will be looking into this matter.` Or, I will be making sure that an independent body oversees the investigation, as the person who is accusing you of theft, is the same person who is heading up the investigation. I wouldn't` in reality of expected anything less then this sort of email from him to be honest, maybe if I was a Hindu and not white bodied then I may of received a slightly different reaction or reply?....Who Knows?
Now here is the real crux of the matter. I, nor my wife will not be party to a Bhaktivedanta manor management team, that thinks its `OK` to cover up the alleged rape of a twenty one year old wwoofer volunteer, who was staying at the manor on Pigotts farm, the temples agricultural plot, where she was allegedly raped by two other male wwoofer volunteers, on temple ground. What is a definite fact though, is that the girl in question, after entering a completely packed out busy Sunday temple room the following morning, completely dazed, confused and naked, where no-one tried to help her, was then escorted and man handled into a car, and dumped at the gates of the temple.
She was then covered up with some clothing by the girl who heard the alleged rape take place the night before, taken down the road a few hundred yards to Piggotts farm. Another volunteer at Piggots farm, who is a follower of Sai Baba, and acts on piggotts farm, and at Bhaktivedanta manor goshalla as some sort of unpaid coordinator/mediator for the wwoofers, and recently released criminals from prison who are on probation, ended up paying for her taxi fare from the farm property of Bhaktivedanta Manor, to Kings Cross train station, London. Not a cheap taxi fare may I add. So she was shipped back to France on the Euro Star train, ASAP. Out of sight, out of mind?
The poor girl had allegedly been drugged, and has allegedly suffered severe internal bruising. I for one, will not be an active part of a temple where, the management team think that it is OK, not to report the alleged rape of a twenty one year old wwoofer volunteer, while the alleged perpetrator's of the crime are possibly still on temple grounds.
Ask yourselves one question please. Especially to all you Mothers, Fathers, Brothers, Sisters and Son’s out there. How would you feel if this happened to your daughter, sister or your mother, and would you want it reported? And, if you do not report such a serious incident to the police, then does that make you almost as bad the perpetrator? This is not yet a police matter, as wwoofer head quarters UK are looking into this very serious matter, and are yet to question the wwoofer volunteer girl who heard this alleged rape take place. Unfortunately, as we all know, sadly through out the history of ISKCON there have so many cover ups, so this will most likely not be the last.
I am sure that Their Lordships Sri Sri Radha-Gokulananda are OK with this, no?
This is part of the real reason why Syamasundara dasa the farm manager had got rid of us, because my wife dared tell Syamasundara dasa, that this alleged rape should not be covered up, and should of been reported to the police immediately. He then went in to a complete demoniac rage, locking the craft shop shop door, pointed his finger a few centimeters from my wife's face whilst shouting at her, and reduced her to tears. Big, big man huh?....Small brain. May i add that she does not cry so easily.
But hey.....guess what? There cant be any bad publicity, especially as the new Halawi multi purpose wedding centre is due for construction at Bhaktivedanta manor soon. You must get your priorities right.
Whilst on the subject of wwoofers though, may I please also add. These wwoofers spend a lot of their evenings five hundred yards away down the local pub getting drunk. They smoke dope, cigarettes and have even been known to have meat barbecues, on temple grounds. Seeing as they are left to their own devices in the evening, because no-one is there to over see them. Well, at least not back in 2013 any way. All this while the farm manger, Syamasundara dasa turns a blind eye, all at the price of him getting his free labour from the wwoofer organization. What is this? Eat steak of an evening, and then work oxen the next day? May i also add, that none of these wwoofers are experienced oxen workers, and this is putting the lives of the oxen at risk, as well as those of the wwoofer volunteers.
I personally witnessed one wwoofer, who was so shaken up, because the oxen that he was working with got spooked, especially the younger oxen, which they can do very frequently. He hadn't tied them up properly, and the seated plow that he was just about to mount turned over, and as it tipped over it grazed one of his legs narrowly escaping what could have been a serious injury. May I add that the blades on these plow’s are extremely sharp, this could of caused a far more serious injury than just a grazed leg.
He was so shaken up that he couldn't work and had to take rest.
Also, I witnessed another wwoofer, whilst discing the fields with the younger, faster oxen, standing on the discing machine, which has extremely sharp skewer type blades that break up the soil. He was standing on this machine like he was surfing the waves on the sea, using young oxen that can travel at some speed. Whilst all that stood between him and the skewer blades, and the danger of getting his foot, feet or legs mangled, was a thin piece of ply wood, at least no less than one inch thick. To me it is only by Krsna`s mercy that neither of these wwoofer volunteers were not seriously injured.
Also, what about the care of the oxen? Aren’t we meant to be protecting the cows and the oxen? Syamasundara dasa has also had selective female wwoofers at his house, with his wife present, for prasadam. Everyone who knows this man, in fact all of the older devotees, and those younger ones who have lived in the temple ashram for many years, know that he is a womaniser. He was found having sexual intercourse with another devotees wife in the hay barn some years ago. It wasn’t just one woman either that he did this too. Yet although he wrecks marriages he still retains his position at Bhaktivedanta manor goshala, and as head of ISKCON European farms and goshallas. I would also like to add that it was both women who were banned from the temple and not him. Well of course he serves a purpose, why get rid of him right?
It Is very true that WE ARE ALL guilty of forgetting Lord Krsna, and for sure, we should, and are receiving the results of our past and present karma. But still the questions begs to be asked. How can `senior` devotees act like this on the strength of the Holy name? The reaction that they will suffer is sure to come back to them at least ten fold. I can only pray for Syamasundara dasa, and his wife Lalita Sahki devi dasi, that they somehow regain their initial attraction, inspiration, honesty, love and compassion that first led them to the path of Srila Prabhupada`s ISKCON, and that of Krsna Consciousness. I sincerely hope that they can act in a way that would set an example to newcomers, guest’s, neophyte devotees such as myself, and devotees less senior then them.
Would Srila Prabhupada be happy with the way things are conducted at Bhaktivedanta manor and it’s well renown Hindu wedding circus? Personally, for a lot of what goes on there, i think not.
Since, some of what I am writing here, which may i add took place back in September 2013, like the naked girl incident, and alleged rape, has now spread like wild fire on the gossip mill at Bhaktivedanta manor. Lalita Sakhi devi dasi conveniently took a five week break/holiday back then to South Africa, and then onto India to join her daughter for a wedding in Mayapur.
Also, it should be known here that, all three of their grown up offspring, who are now in their twenties, attend private school, which is not a free state school, and has huge quarterly bills. Also the fact that Syamasundara dasa owns a £400,000 house, and also owns two other properties that he rents out to other devotees. Please ask yourselves. All this on a frugal managerial farmers wage? So please can we now lets talk about thievery, and who has their fingers in the ghee and creaming of the top whilst milking the cash cow?
May i ask the GBC. What are you doing about this wwoofer scheme in ISKCON, because it is is fundamentally flawed on so many levels?
I was due to take Hari Nam initiation this year, but was warned that if I spoke out about any of these incidents that I would not get initiated. I`ll be honest. It has taken me five months to weigh up the situation and all the circumstances involved here, and has torn at my heart and soul, but all my life, I have always tried to stand for truth and rights, I will miss my boy’s the oxen. Krsna knows how, after I was stopped from my seva with them, I would wake up from dreams where I was with them in the fields, but it was only a dream and then the tears would come. Yes, I am attached.
Not so sorry either to say that I will not be a part of any dogma, where speaking the truth is deemed and seen as a wrong. Surely Srila Prabhupada wouldn’t want that? To me, the ISKCON of today is far, far removed from what Srila Prabhupada had set up, and had intended it to be.
Shame on you GBC. No doubt you can all vote me demon of the month or even the year!
And finally. A personal message from me and Lainey to all the management at Bhaktivedanta manor. Ban us or not, oh go on! You know you’ve just been waiting for an opportunity like this for ages! I am now beyond caring anymore. You have picked the wrong people to bully this time, and only time will tell. Lord Krsna sees all....Chant and be happy, if your conscious would only allow you too?
Yours truly. In the service of Sri Guru and Sri Gauranga,
Bhakta Matty.
Aniha Das: This is a truly nasty business and my heart goes out to you and your good wife. Unfortunately it is not so shocking considering the various offences committed over the years that have brought shame upon Srila Prabhupada's wonderful society. Thank you for having the courage to speak out. Connection with a genuine Vaisnava is a matter of the heart and Lord Krsna will make an arrangement for your Harinama initiation sooner or later, so do not be too distressed over missing the opportunity. Cultivate the desire to surrender to a pure Vaisnava, a Vaikuntha man, and Krsna will direct you.
Bhagavati Serry: I am very sorry to read this. Having been in and around temples for 33 years, I know how relationships between devotees and management can get really messed up. Still, for the sake of your Krsna consciousness I would advise you to seek the help of an ISKCON Ombudsman to sort this mess out. You can go to ISKCON Resolve.org for more information. I have been trained as an ombudsman myself by Braja Bihari prabhu and I can guarantee that an ombudsman is independent (from management), informal, neutral and, of course, confidential.
angel108b@yahoo.com
From: Matty Dread
Here is a sure fire way to cut down on your friends and find out who your real true friends are. Cutting the wheat from the chaff so to speak. Not airing no dirty laundry here, but speaking the truth whilst sharing with you what has been going on in my heart and head for many, many months now. I'm away for a week as from today, will check back next weekend maybe?
RAPE, BURN AND PILLAGE -- AT BHAKTIVEDANTA MANOR (UK).
It is a sad, sad day indeed, when my wife turns around to me and says, "I will never step one foot passed the gates of Bhaktivedanta Manor to do seva again." Myself and my wife, have both been attending Bhaktivedanta manor since our teenage years, separately before we met, and then later on as a married couple, we our both now in our forties. I personally, will never do any seva at Bhaktivedanta Manor again. Well, not at least until there is a big change in the managerial structure there. After this letter, I’ll probably be lucky to even take darsan, but I am beyond the point of caring about being shunned by an increasingly sectarian "community" because what I have to write about here is so serious.
We have both been treated like dirt, for want of a better expression by Syamasundara dasa, the farm manager at Bhaktivedanta manor and head of ISKCON'S European farming and goshalla's, and also by his wife, Lalita Sakhi devi dasi, the new dairy manageress, for allegedly stealing seventy jars of honey, Then, two weeks after Janmastami 2013, this had escalated to now also include £1000.00 or so.
All this, we allegedly took from the goshalla craft shop that we created over two years ago. We were asked to create a craft shop on the wishes of Syamasundara dasa. Back in September 2013, my wife, Lainey was sent a text by Syamasundara dasa “to urgently check her email.”
By the way, Syamasundara dasa didn't even have the gumption to tell us to our faces. He had written in his email that, "that she was suspended from her position as craft shop manageress." Suspended!!! The laughable thing is, is that neither of us have ever been on a wage. That’s right folks, it’s called good old fashioned bhakti, remember that?
Please, please ask yourselves one rational question here. Why would Lainey work so tirelessly, over two years on building up such a beautiful craft shop, getting all the devotee crafters on board, which was a logistical nightmare, whilst supporting the goshalla, and mainly grihasta devotee’s from our very own UK yatra, only then to shoot herself in the foot by dipping in to the `honey pot?
My dear wife Lainey, would do anything to help anyone, especially within the devotee community. Sad to say that both of our seva, and the kripa of our bhakti, has been well and truly trampled over. May I ask the questions?
A: Where is the proof of these alleged allegations?
B: If we are guilty, then why haven't the police been called on us?
This whole honey-gate "suspension" was a smoke screen ruse to get rid of us, plain and simple, as we obviously served our purpose of getting the shop established, and were also always seen by the management as "lose cannons." Plus, since Syamasundara's wife, Lalita Sakhi devi dasi, took over as dairy manageress, and started to stock the shop with her dairy products, she has had her beady eye’s on the New gokul Craft shop right from the start.
I myself, have been doing unpaid ox-seva, for what would have been four years last November, and I was asked, in yet another email, by Syamasundara, again not in person, to return all my farm keys. I take this as indirectly telling me, that my service to the oxen, and the goshalla at Bhaktivedanta manor was no longer required. This is yet another bullying tactic by the Bhaktivedanta Manor management, and i am sorry, but I will not be bullied by anyone.
The basic problem with most of the devotees on a wage at Bhaktivedanta manor, (not the one’s living in the derelict, rat infested "dog house" just up the road from the temple.) Is that most of them are also living in temple owned accommodation outside of the temple, and they also take a wage from the temple. So thus, by speaking out against any injustices or cover ups at the manor, they have everything to lose because Bhaktivedanta manor has them, for want of a better expression by the short and curlys. So basically, they’ll either lose their job(s) or lose their house(s), simple. Yet another well thought out strategical plan by the Bhaktivedanta manor managers?
Where as, on the other hand, for those of us who do not rely on the temple for a salary, and accommodation, we stand to lose neither. We own our small one bedroom flat, where we live a modest life, and we have stood on our own two feet from when we were both, coincidentally, at the same age of sixteen years old. As I said before, Lainey, my dear wife has vowed that she will never engage in any seva at Bhaktivedanta manor again, and I now too have taken this vow also.
As far as any alleged theft was concerned, I proceeded to contact the temple president, Srutidhama dasa by email regarding the unfair `suspension`, and treatment of me and my wife. I received a punitive email that, directed me to the `grievance / complaints department ` at Bhaktivedanta manor. Like i could just be cheaply fobbed off. There was no `sorry` or, `i will be looking into this matter.` Or, I will be making sure that an independent body oversees the investigation, as the person who is accusing you of theft, is the same person who is heading up the investigation. I wouldn't` in reality of expected anything less then this sort of email from him to be honest, maybe if I was a Hindu and not white bodied then I may of received a slightly different reaction or reply?....Who Knows?
Now here is the real crux of the matter. I, nor my wife will not be party to a Bhaktivedanta manor management team, that thinks its `OK` to cover up the alleged rape of a twenty one year old wwoofer volunteer, who was staying at the manor on Pigotts farm, the temples agricultural plot, where she was allegedly raped by two other male wwoofer volunteers, on temple ground. What is a definite fact though, is that the girl in question, after entering a completely packed out busy Sunday temple room the following morning, completely dazed, confused and naked, where no-one tried to help her, was then escorted and man handled into a car, and dumped at the gates of the temple.
She was then covered up with some clothing by the girl who heard the alleged rape take place the night before, taken down the road a few hundred yards to Piggotts farm. Another volunteer at Piggots farm, who is a follower of Sai Baba, and acts on piggotts farm, and at Bhaktivedanta manor goshalla as some sort of unpaid coordinator/mediator for the wwoofers, and recently released criminals from prison who are on probation, ended up paying for her taxi fare from the farm property of Bhaktivedanta Manor, to Kings Cross train station, London. Not a cheap taxi fare may I add. So she was shipped back to France on the Euro Star train, ASAP. Out of sight, out of mind?
The poor girl had allegedly been drugged, and has allegedly suffered severe internal bruising. I for one, will not be an active part of a temple where, the management team think that it is OK, not to report the alleged rape of a twenty one year old wwoofer volunteer, while the alleged perpetrator's of the crime are possibly still on temple grounds.
Ask yourselves one question please. Especially to all you Mothers, Fathers, Brothers, Sisters and Son’s out there. How would you feel if this happened to your daughter, sister or your mother, and would you want it reported? And, if you do not report such a serious incident to the police, then does that make you almost as bad the perpetrator? This is not yet a police matter, as wwoofer head quarters UK are looking into this very serious matter, and are yet to question the wwoofer volunteer girl who heard this alleged rape take place. Unfortunately, as we all know, sadly through out the history of ISKCON there have so many cover ups, so this will most likely not be the last.
I am sure that Their Lordships Sri Sri Radha-Gokulananda are OK with this, no?
This is part of the real reason why Syamasundara dasa the farm manager had got rid of us, because my wife dared tell Syamasundara dasa, that this alleged rape should not be covered up, and should of been reported to the police immediately. He then went in to a complete demoniac rage, locking the craft shop shop door, pointed his finger a few centimeters from my wife's face whilst shouting at her, and reduced her to tears. Big, big man huh?....Small brain. May i add that she does not cry so easily.
But hey.....guess what? There cant be any bad publicity, especially as the new Halawi multi purpose wedding centre is due for construction at Bhaktivedanta manor soon. You must get your priorities right.
Whilst on the subject of wwoofers though, may I please also add. These wwoofers spend a lot of their evenings five hundred yards away down the local pub getting drunk. They smoke dope, cigarettes and have even been known to have meat barbecues, on temple grounds. Seeing as they are left to their own devices in the evening, because no-one is there to over see them. Well, at least not back in 2013 any way. All this while the farm manger, Syamasundara dasa turns a blind eye, all at the price of him getting his free labour from the wwoofer organization. What is this? Eat steak of an evening, and then work oxen the next day? May i also add, that none of these wwoofers are experienced oxen workers, and this is putting the lives of the oxen at risk, as well as those of the wwoofer volunteers.
I personally witnessed one wwoofer, who was so shaken up, because the oxen that he was working with got spooked, especially the younger oxen, which they can do very frequently. He hadn't tied them up properly, and the seated plow that he was just about to mount turned over, and as it tipped over it grazed one of his legs narrowly escaping what could have been a serious injury. May I add that the blades on these plow’s are extremely sharp, this could of caused a far more serious injury than just a grazed leg.
He was so shaken up that he couldn't work and had to take rest.
Also, I witnessed another wwoofer, whilst discing the fields with the younger, faster oxen, standing on the discing machine, which has extremely sharp skewer type blades that break up the soil. He was standing on this machine like he was surfing the waves on the sea, using young oxen that can travel at some speed. Whilst all that stood between him and the skewer blades, and the danger of getting his foot, feet or legs mangled, was a thin piece of ply wood, at least no less than one inch thick. To me it is only by Krsna`s mercy that neither of these wwoofer volunteers were not seriously injured.
Also, what about the care of the oxen? Aren’t we meant to be protecting the cows and the oxen? Syamasundara dasa has also had selective female wwoofers at his house, with his wife present, for prasadam. Everyone who knows this man, in fact all of the older devotees, and those younger ones who have lived in the temple ashram for many years, know that he is a womaniser. He was found having sexual intercourse with another devotees wife in the hay barn some years ago. It wasn’t just one woman either that he did this too. Yet although he wrecks marriages he still retains his position at Bhaktivedanta manor goshala, and as head of ISKCON European farms and goshallas. I would also like to add that it was both women who were banned from the temple and not him. Well of course he serves a purpose, why get rid of him right?
It Is very true that WE ARE ALL guilty of forgetting Lord Krsna, and for sure, we should, and are receiving the results of our past and present karma. But still the questions begs to be asked. How can `senior` devotees act like this on the strength of the Holy name? The reaction that they will suffer is sure to come back to them at least ten fold. I can only pray for Syamasundara dasa, and his wife Lalita Sahki devi dasi, that they somehow regain their initial attraction, inspiration, honesty, love and compassion that first led them to the path of Srila Prabhupada`s ISKCON, and that of Krsna Consciousness. I sincerely hope that they can act in a way that would set an example to newcomers, guest’s, neophyte devotees such as myself, and devotees less senior then them.
Would Srila Prabhupada be happy with the way things are conducted at Bhaktivedanta manor and it’s well renown Hindu wedding circus? Personally, for a lot of what goes on there, i think not.
Since, some of what I am writing here, which may i add took place back in September 2013, like the naked girl incident, and alleged rape, has now spread like wild fire on the gossip mill at Bhaktivedanta manor. Lalita Sakhi devi dasi conveniently took a five week break/holiday back then to South Africa, and then onto India to join her daughter for a wedding in Mayapur.
Also, it should be known here that, all three of their grown up offspring, who are now in their twenties, attend private school, which is not a free state school, and has huge quarterly bills. Also the fact that Syamasundara dasa owns a £400,000 house, and also owns two other properties that he rents out to other devotees. Please ask yourselves. All this on a frugal managerial farmers wage? So please can we now lets talk about thievery, and who has their fingers in the ghee and creaming of the top whilst milking the cash cow?
May i ask the GBC. What are you doing about this wwoofer scheme in ISKCON, because it is is fundamentally flawed on so many levels?
I was due to take Hari Nam initiation this year, but was warned that if I spoke out about any of these incidents that I would not get initiated. I`ll be honest. It has taken me five months to weigh up the situation and all the circumstances involved here, and has torn at my heart and soul, but all my life, I have always tried to stand for truth and rights, I will miss my boy’s the oxen. Krsna knows how, after I was stopped from my seva with them, I would wake up from dreams where I was with them in the fields, but it was only a dream and then the tears would come. Yes, I am attached.
Not so sorry either to say that I will not be a part of any dogma, where speaking the truth is deemed and seen as a wrong. Surely Srila Prabhupada wouldn’t want that? To me, the ISKCON of today is far, far removed from what Srila Prabhupada had set up, and had intended it to be.
Shame on you GBC. No doubt you can all vote me demon of the month or even the year!
And finally. A personal message from me and Lainey to all the management at Bhaktivedanta manor. Ban us or not, oh go on! You know you’ve just been waiting for an opportunity like this for ages! I am now beyond caring anymore. You have picked the wrong people to bully this time, and only time will tell. Lord Krsna sees all....Chant and be happy, if your conscious would only allow you too?
Yours truly. In the service of Sri Guru and Sri Gauranga,
Bhakta Matty.
Aniha Das: This is a truly nasty business and my heart goes out to you and your good wife. Unfortunately it is not so shocking considering the various offences committed over the years that have brought shame upon Srila Prabhupada's wonderful society. Thank you for having the courage to speak out. Connection with a genuine Vaisnava is a matter of the heart and Lord Krsna will make an arrangement for your Harinama initiation sooner or later, so do not be too distressed over missing the opportunity. Cultivate the desire to surrender to a pure Vaisnava, a Vaikuntha man, and Krsna will direct you.
Bhagavati Serry: I am very sorry to read this. Having been in and around temples for 33 years, I know how relationships between devotees and management can get really messed up. Still, for the sake of your Krsna consciousness I would advise you to seek the help of an ISKCON Ombudsman to sort this mess out. You can go to ISKCON Resolve.org for more information. I have been trained as an ombudsman myself by Braja Bihari prabhu and I can guarantee that an ombudsman is independent (from management), informal, neutral and, of course, confidential.
Please prabhu, you don't want to spend the rest of your life feeling angry and frustrated with a whole list of devotees. Even if you never want to do service in the Manor again, still try to resolve the issues, so you can have some peace of mind.
[PADA: What happens when the GBC "resolves" that Krishna's guru successors are often debauchees, and their alleged "parampara from God" contains "illicit sex with men, women and children." And then those who protest (like us) are banned, and that is minor when we consider -- in addition we have been getting death threats etc? And why would any religion teach their little children that God's successors are often debauchees? And how can this be "resolved" in any other way, other than to expose this deviation (or crime?) of corrupting the morals of minors? The people who are promoting the debauchee messiah's program -- are going to resolve complaints about it?]
Janardan Das: Not surprised. Sorry for both of you. Guess now you know why I decided to walk away from all these nasty stuff. Forget about them. Seek association form real Vaishanavas and keep chanting Harinama. Krishna will somehow guide you.
Jim: Very sorry to hear about all this man. If you guys ever need a listening ear, I'm always about. x
Mark: I'm sorry to hear about this also, i will say just because I know for a fact that none of their kids have ever gone to private school. X
Mukunda Kishore Das: We are also very sad to hear this, and our thoughts and prayers are with you both, I would agree with Bhagavati, get independent help and advice. And as you rightly say, Krsna see's all and the truth will come out eventually, it is just so saddening that you have to go through these things. Take care and trust in Prabhupada and Krsna to support and always inspire you to be honest and humble devotees.
[PADA: What happens when the GBC "resolves" that Krishna's guru successors are often debauchees, and their alleged "parampara from God" contains "illicit sex with men, women and children." And then those who protest (like us) are banned, and that is minor when we consider -- in addition we have been getting death threats etc? And why would any religion teach their little children that God's successors are often debauchees? And how can this be "resolved" in any other way, other than to expose this deviation (or crime?) of corrupting the morals of minors? The people who are promoting the debauchee messiah's program -- are going to resolve complaints about it?]
Janardan Das: Not surprised. Sorry for both of you. Guess now you know why I decided to walk away from all these nasty stuff. Forget about them. Seek association form real Vaishanavas and keep chanting Harinama. Krishna will somehow guide you.
Jim: Very sorry to hear about all this man. If you guys ever need a listening ear, I'm always about. x
Mark: I'm sorry to hear about this also, i will say just because I know for a fact that none of their kids have ever gone to private school. X
Mukunda Kishore Das: We are also very sad to hear this, and our thoughts and prayers are with you both, I would agree with Bhagavati, get independent help and advice. And as you rightly say, Krsna see's all and the truth will come out eventually, it is just so saddening that you have to go through these things. Take care and trust in Prabhupada and Krsna to support and always inspire you to be honest and humble devotees.
Chandi: I understand you are upset by what may or may not have happened last year, but please do not insult my family with fabrications, a lot of what you have said in regards to my parents and our lifestyle is simply not true. Its not necessary to spread negativity. If any of what you say is true, then Krsna will take care of it in the appropriate way.
Johnny: Well f**k me sideways this is f**ked up beyond belief, from the outside looking in -- its the age old story of using enlightenment as exploitation, get away from these vampires!
Acaryavan Das: Sorry Matty ans Lainey to hear that there is some troubles between you and the management at the bhaktivedantan manor. I wish to both of you all success in your devotional life.
Eileen: I didn't watch but I can guess, makes me depressed, but I still wish u a lovely week away from all the hustle and bustle of nothingness lol xx
Jasoda Dasi: How in heavens name can you "resolve" such stuff by taking it to an ombudsman or such... who does that serve; saving face of the GBC? Matty and his wife have done their service above and beyond the call of duty. And I personally have experienced Matty's kindness and heart felt mood. For those who have eyes which can see purity and bhakti Matty has nothing to be criminalised about!...why should he further associate with corruption which many of us have been aware of years? .... cut lose while you can and save your sadhana like we have in the provinces!!
For the sake of Srila Prabhupad don't allow further contamination to yourself or your good wife! When the temple is finally so crude that even the simplest of people can see it is bogus, its a no brainer. Then a new movement can start a new temple which we have been waiting for for 20 years!!
All Glories to Srila Prabhupad!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dharmatma Das Acbsp: So sorry you are going thru this! Sadly, it's rampant in Iskcon society. Unfortunately, they'll just shut you out and hope that you go away. I would suggest Iskcon Resolve, but don't get your hopes up, the Iskcon Bureaucracy is quite amazing. If you're not deemed important, you just don't matter to them.
Jasoda Dasi: Yes huge hugs to you both .. you are always welcome here, we have spare rooms... remembered when you offered bullock training classes to my youngster friend ... changed his life!! There are now 9 cows local to us that need a lot of love too!
Eileen: Hi I did just read your words and its the same ole same ole the world is full of conniving, corrupt, controlling people, the rich get rich and the poor get poorer, the so called underdog will always be brow beaten and bullied by controlling hierarchy, its the sad truth but we have got to hold our head up and fight back even if we lose at least we tried and didn't go down without a fight its sad to read of your problems but it seems to have been brewing for a long time and as u say karma will swing around hope u and your wife find another meaningful path to walk as u have a lot to give, as one door closes another opens good luck to u both x
Bhagavati Serry: Sorry Matthew, I'm an ISKCON resolve ombudsman - although not such an active one - and what you're saying is nonsense. An ombudsman is confidential, neutral and completely independent. ISKCON resolve does not work for the GBC or for temple management. I'm sorry you had a bad experience, but I've followed the different training and I know this to be a fact. All the negative comments really don't help solve the problem, nor do they help Matty and Lainey in dealing with the emotions that accompany problems like this. Please, say something constructive in stead of using other people's problems as a forum to shout your own discontent. That's what your own site is for.
Jasoda Dasi: Bhagavati Serry this is not logic. Airing ones one analogous issues serve to reassure Lainy and Matty that they will not have to stand alone and be bullied anymore as we are fully awake and aware of the sea of hypocrisy and deceit. Calling a spade as spade is important when dealing with shadows. Bhagavati Serry said these words further up on this post.." All the negative comments really don't help solve the problem, nor do they help Matty and Lainey in dealing with the emotions that accompany problems like this."
Johnny: Well f**k me sideways this is f**ked up beyond belief, from the outside looking in -- its the age old story of using enlightenment as exploitation, get away from these vampires!
Acaryavan Das: Sorry Matty ans Lainey to hear that there is some troubles between you and the management at the bhaktivedantan manor. I wish to both of you all success in your devotional life.
Eileen: I didn't watch but I can guess, makes me depressed, but I still wish u a lovely week away from all the hustle and bustle of nothingness lol xx
Jasoda Dasi: How in heavens name can you "resolve" such stuff by taking it to an ombudsman or such... who does that serve; saving face of the GBC? Matty and his wife have done their service above and beyond the call of duty. And I personally have experienced Matty's kindness and heart felt mood. For those who have eyes which can see purity and bhakti Matty has nothing to be criminalised about!...why should he further associate with corruption which many of us have been aware of years? .... cut lose while you can and save your sadhana like we have in the provinces!!
For the sake of Srila Prabhupad don't allow further contamination to yourself or your good wife! When the temple is finally so crude that even the simplest of people can see it is bogus, its a no brainer. Then a new movement can start a new temple which we have been waiting for for 20 years!!
All Glories to Srila Prabhupad!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Dharmatma Das Acbsp: So sorry you are going thru this! Sadly, it's rampant in Iskcon society. Unfortunately, they'll just shut you out and hope that you go away. I would suggest Iskcon Resolve, but don't get your hopes up, the Iskcon Bureaucracy is quite amazing. If you're not deemed important, you just don't matter to them.
Jasoda Dasi: Yes huge hugs to you both .. you are always welcome here, we have spare rooms... remembered when you offered bullock training classes to my youngster friend ... changed his life!! There are now 9 cows local to us that need a lot of love too!
Eileen: Hi I did just read your words and its the same ole same ole the world is full of conniving, corrupt, controlling people, the rich get rich and the poor get poorer, the so called underdog will always be brow beaten and bullied by controlling hierarchy, its the sad truth but we have got to hold our head up and fight back even if we lose at least we tried and didn't go down without a fight its sad to read of your problems but it seems to have been brewing for a long time and as u say karma will swing around hope u and your wife find another meaningful path to walk as u have a lot to give, as one door closes another opens good luck to u both x
Bhagavati Serry: Sorry Matthew, I'm an ISKCON resolve ombudsman - although not such an active one - and what you're saying is nonsense. An ombudsman is confidential, neutral and completely independent. ISKCON resolve does not work for the GBC or for temple management. I'm sorry you had a bad experience, but I've followed the different training and I know this to be a fact. All the negative comments really don't help solve the problem, nor do they help Matty and Lainey in dealing with the emotions that accompany problems like this. Please, say something constructive in stead of using other people's problems as a forum to shout your own discontent. That's what your own site is for.
Jasoda Dasi: Bhagavati Serry this is not logic. Airing ones one analogous issues serve to reassure Lainy and Matty that they will not have to stand alone and be bullied anymore as we are fully awake and aware of the sea of hypocrisy and deceit. Calling a spade as spade is important when dealing with shadows. Bhagavati Serry said these words further up on this post.." All the negative comments really don't help solve the problem, nor do they help Matty and Lainey in dealing with the emotions that accompany problems like this."
Why deal with psychology when we are dealing with crimes? And hasn't Matty had enough ... he has nothing to prove or disprove, he is just another reject from the manor ... we are getting to be quite a crowd with different styles of rejection ... it is more the norm than some strange case requiring investigation.
Perhpas now it the time for a census we may have enough to start a new temple.
Elaine: Thank you all for your guidance and support. I firstly would like to say I did report the alleged rape to Hertfordshire police and to the woofer head quarters who promised that they were cutting all ties with the manor. This past 6 months have been a very hard time for me and my lovely husband. Especially matty as his ox seva meant everything to him and he loved the oxen like family.
That has been the most heart breaking part for me.
As far as the goshalla craft shop goes I did all the ground work for that shop to succeed and I hope it goes from strength to strength. I know in my heart I poured a lot of my love and contacts and experience into that shop.i know this and more importantly Krishna knows this. Why would I do hundreds of unpaid hours just to take a box of honey. I am diabetic for Krishnas sake!!! I forgive those that have lied about me and my husband. I will quite happily turn the other cheek so they can slap that one too.
I am not sad about being branded a thief as I can not be upset by something I haven't done. When I met my maker it will be with a clean heart. I hope god is merciful to those who cover up such abhorrent acts. But I guess when you are going to hell what difference does it make? I am not a liar or a thief my sin is that I do speak unpalatable truths without any qualms. I love people and I loved all the crafters and wanted it to succeed as a craft shop.
But others clearly didn't care about the craft element it was a lazy way for them to get an operating shop. And that's fine.i still would have got the shop together. shame others aren't as honest. As I said I forgive those that have branded me a liar. Because anyone who knows me has laughed at this accusation. I feel nothing but pity and forgiveness as I feel that they do not know what they do.
Forgiveness is my path.
Love and light lainey. X
Matty Dread: A big thank you to all our friends and sincere well wishers, especially Sarva and Jasoda. Strange that the only response as regards my post as to where my facts were off was that Syamasundara`s offspring didn`t go to a private school. For that i apologize. What a massive over sight given the seriousness of the post. As for negativity Chandi, I'll leave that to some of you guy's Bhaktivedanta manor. There are people that have either commented, or liked comments on this thread, some of whom have known me for nearly thirty years or more. They will all tell you that I am a very, very positive person, but will always speak out against injustice and corruption, no matter where it emanates from, a temple, on the hillside, on the street, place of work or at home.
Elaine: Thank you all for your guidance and support. I firstly would like to say I did report the alleged rape to Hertfordshire police and to the woofer head quarters who promised that they were cutting all ties with the manor. This past 6 months have been a very hard time for me and my lovely husband. Especially matty as his ox seva meant everything to him and he loved the oxen like family.
That has been the most heart breaking part for me.
As far as the goshalla craft shop goes I did all the ground work for that shop to succeed and I hope it goes from strength to strength. I know in my heart I poured a lot of my love and contacts and experience into that shop.i know this and more importantly Krishna knows this. Why would I do hundreds of unpaid hours just to take a box of honey. I am diabetic for Krishnas sake!!! I forgive those that have lied about me and my husband. I will quite happily turn the other cheek so they can slap that one too.
I am not sad about being branded a thief as I can not be upset by something I haven't done. When I met my maker it will be with a clean heart. I hope god is merciful to those who cover up such abhorrent acts. But I guess when you are going to hell what difference does it make? I am not a liar or a thief my sin is that I do speak unpalatable truths without any qualms. I love people and I loved all the crafters and wanted it to succeed as a craft shop.
But others clearly didn't care about the craft element it was a lazy way for them to get an operating shop. And that's fine.i still would have got the shop together. shame others aren't as honest. As I said I forgive those that have branded me a liar. Because anyone who knows me has laughed at this accusation. I feel nothing but pity and forgiveness as I feel that they do not know what they do.
Forgiveness is my path.
Love and light lainey. X
Matty Dread: A big thank you to all our friends and sincere well wishers, especially Sarva and Jasoda. Strange that the only response as regards my post as to where my facts were off was that Syamasundara`s offspring didn`t go to a private school. For that i apologize. What a massive over sight given the seriousness of the post. As for negativity Chandi, I'll leave that to some of you guy's Bhaktivedanta manor. There are people that have either commented, or liked comments on this thread, some of whom have known me for nearly thirty years or more. They will all tell you that I am a very, very positive person, but will always speak out against injustice and corruption, no matter where it emanates from, a temple, on the hillside, on the street, place of work or at home.
If you see that as a negative then you are in an illusion about what is truth and what is lies, and what is positive and what is really a negative. I have also had a few friends PM me with there revelations and also some other incidents that have gone on recently at Bhaktivedanta manor. I am awaiting their replies, because i want to post their comments on the main thread.
Elaine: I am actually a second degree usui reiki master so I have been able to heal any wounds with love and positive vibrations. That's why after the initial shock of what had happened had sunk in I was able to re balance and project positive vibes to those who had sinned not just against me but against all of the good hearted crafters that had been cast adrift. I am normally spot on when it comes to people as I can reach in and see their true self's.
But I have to say bravo to the wolf in sheep's clothing.
You had me fooled until about a year ago.
Chandi I mean you nor your sibling's any upset.i feel sorry for you all and your mum. I know the shame that was bestowed onto you all. May God be with you in your hearts and steer you all to the path of goodness honesty and love. May the sins of the father not blemish his children.
Hare Krishna
Namaste Amen Love and light lainey.
Matty Dread:
To Matty Prabhu. Did you know that Pranabhandu Dasa was suspend for four months from the temple for trying to get me into bed with him. I was a victim of his mad behaviour. They are covering everything up, and now in less then a few weeks he his allowed to go on again with his madness. What a shame. I like some of your points that you made in your letter. You are quite right. HK ~
(Anonymous private message to me today by another devotee.)
Elaine: I am actually a second degree usui reiki master so I have been able to heal any wounds with love and positive vibrations. That's why after the initial shock of what had happened had sunk in I was able to re balance and project positive vibes to those who had sinned not just against me but against all of the good hearted crafters that had been cast adrift. I am normally spot on when it comes to people as I can reach in and see their true self's.
But I have to say bravo to the wolf in sheep's clothing.
You had me fooled until about a year ago.
Chandi I mean you nor your sibling's any upset.i feel sorry for you all and your mum. I know the shame that was bestowed onto you all. May God be with you in your hearts and steer you all to the path of goodness honesty and love. May the sins of the father not blemish his children.
Hare Krishna
Namaste Amen Love and light lainey.
Matty Dread:
To Matty Prabhu. Did you know that Pranabhandu Dasa was suspend for four months from the temple for trying to get me into bed with him. I was a victim of his mad behaviour. They are covering everything up, and now in less then a few weeks he his allowed to go on again with his madness. What a shame. I like some of your points that you made in your letter. You are quite right. HK ~
(Anonymous private message to me today by another devotee.)
Mikki: Thanks for sharing, the truth is always enlightening, thought you two were having a bit of a hard time but wasn't sure why. So glad i know now. you are both lovely people and don't deserve to be treated like sh*t by anyone for any reason. brave of you to speak up too. respect x x x
Matty Dread: Well done guys .. was wondering when u where going to speak out!!! Such a shame & makes me sooo angry that just because u / we don't fit the mold or there are hidden agenda's ...some judge & use us for their own gain... we are our own people strong in who we are. With love in our hearts & those that don't see that or feel that well they are the sad people living a life of so called faith!! Almost laughable as totally hypocritical. Luckily we have our own friends who understand... bless both of u. ~ Anonymous private message to me today by another devotee.
Lilavati: Yes Matty I am not surprised, you know Gauri the child abuser represents ISKCON regularly in the media, and with politicians, and even met with a Queen. The court found him guilty, but hey Bhaktivedanta Manor rewards him for the crime! And in fact he is about to become kind of president again.
Utpal: Quite shocked to hear all this...........
Parividha Das: I'm written you previously that I hope you could leave it to our Sweet Lord, who is in everyone's heart, and by Whose will nothing can happen in this world. Please try to let go of this resentment. However painful it was, it is the past. Try to live now peacefully, and just wait what the future will bring you.
Matty Dread: Well done guys .. was wondering when u where going to speak out!!! Such a shame & makes me sooo angry that just because u / we don't fit the mold or there are hidden agenda's ...some judge & use us for their own gain... we are our own people strong in who we are. With love in our hearts & those that don't see that or feel that well they are the sad people living a life of so called faith!! Almost laughable as totally hypocritical. Luckily we have our own friends who understand... bless both of u. ~ Anonymous private message to me today by another devotee.
Lilavati: Yes Matty I am not surprised, you know Gauri the child abuser represents ISKCON regularly in the media, and with politicians, and even met with a Queen. The court found him guilty, but hey Bhaktivedanta Manor rewards him for the crime! And in fact he is about to become kind of president again.
Utpal: Quite shocked to hear all this...........
Parividha Das: I'm written you previously that I hope you could leave it to our Sweet Lord, who is in everyone's heart, and by Whose will nothing can happen in this world. Please try to let go of this resentment. However painful it was, it is the past. Try to live now peacefully, and just wait what the future will bring you.
Sakhya Prema: ISKCON is a Big Daddy organisation these days and along with Big Daddy comes Big Saddy. So ISKCON GBC have recognised the need for OMBUDSMEN to help unravel the complications that arise due to so many different people with different agendas and values. We can never expect others to be like ourselves and must learn to accept the differences between us, as the liberated souls do in Vaikuntha and Goloka Dham (that's why they are liberated - no envy).
So please take the advice of these devotees and contact ISKCON RESOLVE and you'll get justice, satisfaction and peace. Always remember the bottom line Matty, that we are all here in this world because we are inimical and envious toward the Lord and Supreme Enjoyer of All. Our envious mentality will leak out from time to time and these situations are often a form of test to help us get an objective understanding of our true level of love and bhakti. I hope you and Lainey make the right decision and go forward to becoming the great servants of Srila Prabhupada that you can be and in fact are.
Oh another thing Matty, I have conducted many funerals and have attended many too. In fact I'm going to my uncle Gerald's funeral this Friday as it happens. A great self made wealthy man in his own right! There are two ways to speak at a funeral ceremony, the pampering paid priest style or the truthful well wishing word wrangling style. In every case I have chosen the latter, even at the cost of my 'paid priest' status. I would rather say 'to hell with the pay' rather than 'to hell with the people'. Always choose the right path Matty and even if it looks like you're losing the battle, you will eventually win the war, because every dog has his day, today or tomorrow and tomorrow is in fact another feature of today. This is the law of time and karma and this is God's law, an infallible law.
Lilavati: Well dear Parividha Das -- why you say let it go? How do you know how the Lord working? Do you think He will personally come and stop all of this nonsense? No!!! He will act through us, His devotees and why not Matty? He has Him in his heart too. Matty can be agent just as anyone can. Too many crimes and abuse are ignored in the Manor and too many corruption as well. The truth can come from any source.
The duty of the management is to protect woman and children. . So if they fail to do so, that is wrong. No matter is the past or whenever. And having sexual intercourse with someone else's wife, well according Srimad Bhagavatam the result is hell.
Elaine: I appreciate everyone's input. however I do not accept bullying in my life or my husbands. To keep ones mouth shut on such matters is making a grave mistake. By doing this you are enabling the bullies. This is the biggest problem in the movement, people are too scared to speak truths. And that is totally wrong. Matty has thought about this long and hard, this decision has weighed heavily on his heart for 6 months.
If I had in fact been guilty of taking a box of honey that apparently had a value of 2k I would have nothing to say on the matter. The truth is this is between me and the farm manager but he choose to drag my lovely husband into it. I have even emailed him and said as much. So please ask yourself why keep quiet?
We all know people that have been bullied and mistreated. AND IT'S WRONG SIMPLE AS.
I wish those who have lied and cheated me and matty forgiveness.
Love and light lainey.
Sakhya Prema: I agree with the bullying programme in Srila Prabhupada's movement, unless we are bullied, we won't become pure devotees! Duh!!! Some people actually think like this and therefore we have bully boys and girls to hand out the bananas!!!
Hari Ananda Yogi Das: Ma, and prabhu. keep shri hari naam in your heart... and your temple travels with you... also, i have a hanuman murti for your home... couldn't keep it secret, i'm rubbish...but he'll keep you strong. OM JAI SRI RAMA! HARE RAMA!
Matty Dread: Sakhya Prema. Yes, when you analyse the word `believe` it contains the word `lie...be-lie-ve, maybe it has it`s roots in Christianity?....To be-lie-eve, but on this I only speculate, unlike my article that contains truth and things that I know for a fact, as I experienced and witnessed them. I like yourself therefore appreciated Srila Prabhupada's books because I was always searching for the ultimate truth. I also don't belong to this or that party or clique and never will, and have always appreciate and supported the underdog too. Thank you Sakhya for your honesty. If you cannot be honest and the speak truth openly, in whatever society you`re in then that is a dogmatic situation.
Thank you Hari Ananda Yogi Das. You are a diamond. :-)
Hari Ananda Yogi Das: I think radha gokulananda would be proud of your lion heart. are their any other temples/ mandir/ satsangh?
Matty Dread: Yes Ash there are plenty. As you know I grew up in Southall so I have had a wealth of experience of visiting different Mandirs and Gurudwara`s. No worries on that one dude, and I really, really appreciate your spirit of looking out for us.
Anita Yogamaya Cannon: Radha Gokulananda will miss you both and all the wonderful service you performed for them out of lovexxxxxxxxxxxxx
Elaine: Thank you Anita. I will miss being there but I can't be a part of such lies and corruption. Xxxxxxx
Rama Nrsimha Das: Wish you well guys, the lack of your warm & cheery presence is a loss for the Manor. Krishna bless :)
Utpal: I personally will miss Matty although it's not very often we come face to face, but relished his company whenever we met. Get in touch here. I'll definitely miss you and so will many others at the Manor. I'm sure...
Elaine: We really will miss all our friends very much.x
Malini Nitai: Matty and Lainey, it is all very sad and shocking and I know how much you hurt. Most of us have been through a very tough time in our spiritual life and it is very testing time . It is time to grab your japa beads, no matter what, and stay on the path of KC . Please don't loose your faith and do not forget that the Lord Krishna has his plan and way of dealing with devotees that are very dishonest. Lots of love to you both ,keep chanting and be strong .xxxxxx When Pandavas were at exile, Krishna appeared to Yudishtira who was suffering a lot and just said two things - "Everything is temporary " and "All must pass" With those instructions within his heart he carried on without anxiety.
Elaine: Thank you Malini Nitai you and nila are like family to us. Nothing can shake our love and faith in god. If anything it has made it stronger. I really do hope Krishna rights a lot of wrongs that are happening to good devotees. We have had many private messages from devotees telling us abhorrent things that have happened to them also. It's truly heartbreaking. And for me as a healer its hard that they are scared to go public with what's happened to them. That's just so sad that people of God are living in fear of speaking out against horrific things done to them. What has happened to this movement? We should be about love and compassion not fear and bullying.
It's a mess and I fear it will just get worse as all I can feel is a downward spiral of cover ups and lies. May God be merciful to those that are acting against his word. Love and light Lainey
Judy: I remain deeply disturbed about the series of events described here. I rely on devotees to help me stay sane, in other words to maintain a degree of attachment to Srila Prabhupada and his dear Lord Krsna and Srimate Radharani. Not to speak of all the other great personalities who hold Radha Krsna deep within their hearts. I have never been part of a well established KC community, partly due to my own streak of independence amongst other reasons, so I am not qualified to comment in an intelligent manner upon the issue in question.
Oh another thing Matty, I have conducted many funerals and have attended many too. In fact I'm going to my uncle Gerald's funeral this Friday as it happens. A great self made wealthy man in his own right! There are two ways to speak at a funeral ceremony, the pampering paid priest style or the truthful well wishing word wrangling style. In every case I have chosen the latter, even at the cost of my 'paid priest' status. I would rather say 'to hell with the pay' rather than 'to hell with the people'. Always choose the right path Matty and even if it looks like you're losing the battle, you will eventually win the war, because every dog has his day, today or tomorrow and tomorrow is in fact another feature of today. This is the law of time and karma and this is God's law, an infallible law.
Lilavati: Well dear Parividha Das -- why you say let it go? How do you know how the Lord working? Do you think He will personally come and stop all of this nonsense? No!!! He will act through us, His devotees and why not Matty? He has Him in his heart too. Matty can be agent just as anyone can. Too many crimes and abuse are ignored in the Manor and too many corruption as well. The truth can come from any source.
The duty of the management is to protect woman and children. . So if they fail to do so, that is wrong. No matter is the past or whenever. And having sexual intercourse with someone else's wife, well according Srimad Bhagavatam the result is hell.
Elaine: I appreciate everyone's input. however I do not accept bullying in my life or my husbands. To keep ones mouth shut on such matters is making a grave mistake. By doing this you are enabling the bullies. This is the biggest problem in the movement, people are too scared to speak truths. And that is totally wrong. Matty has thought about this long and hard, this decision has weighed heavily on his heart for 6 months.
If I had in fact been guilty of taking a box of honey that apparently had a value of 2k I would have nothing to say on the matter. The truth is this is between me and the farm manager but he choose to drag my lovely husband into it. I have even emailed him and said as much. So please ask yourself why keep quiet?
We all know people that have been bullied and mistreated. AND IT'S WRONG SIMPLE AS.
I wish those who have lied and cheated me and matty forgiveness.
Love and light lainey.
Sakhya Prema: I agree with the bullying programme in Srila Prabhupada's movement, unless we are bullied, we won't become pure devotees! Duh!!! Some people actually think like this and therefore we have bully boys and girls to hand out the bananas!!!
Hari Ananda Yogi Das: Ma, and prabhu. keep shri hari naam in your heart... and your temple travels with you... also, i have a hanuman murti for your home... couldn't keep it secret, i'm rubbish...but he'll keep you strong. OM JAI SRI RAMA! HARE RAMA!
Matty Dread: Sakhya Prema. Yes, when you analyse the word `believe` it contains the word `lie...be-lie-ve, maybe it has it`s roots in Christianity?....To be-lie-eve, but on this I only speculate, unlike my article that contains truth and things that I know for a fact, as I experienced and witnessed them. I like yourself therefore appreciated Srila Prabhupada's books because I was always searching for the ultimate truth. I also don't belong to this or that party or clique and never will, and have always appreciate and supported the underdog too. Thank you Sakhya for your honesty. If you cannot be honest and the speak truth openly, in whatever society you`re in then that is a dogmatic situation.
Thank you Hari Ananda Yogi Das. You are a diamond. :-)
Hari Ananda Yogi Das: I think radha gokulananda would be proud of your lion heart. are their any other temples/ mandir/ satsangh?
Matty Dread: Yes Ash there are plenty. As you know I grew up in Southall so I have had a wealth of experience of visiting different Mandirs and Gurudwara`s. No worries on that one dude, and I really, really appreciate your spirit of looking out for us.
Anita Yogamaya Cannon: Radha Gokulananda will miss you both and all the wonderful service you performed for them out of lovexxxxxxxxxxxxx
Elaine: Thank you Anita. I will miss being there but I can't be a part of such lies and corruption. Xxxxxxx
Rama Nrsimha Das: Wish you well guys, the lack of your warm & cheery presence is a loss for the Manor. Krishna bless :)
Utpal: I personally will miss Matty although it's not very often we come face to face, but relished his company whenever we met. Get in touch here. I'll definitely miss you and so will many others at the Manor. I'm sure...
Elaine: We really will miss all our friends very much.x
Malini Nitai: Matty and Lainey, it is all very sad and shocking and I know how much you hurt. Most of us have been through a very tough time in our spiritual life and it is very testing time . It is time to grab your japa beads, no matter what, and stay on the path of KC . Please don't loose your faith and do not forget that the Lord Krishna has his plan and way of dealing with devotees that are very dishonest. Lots of love to you both ,keep chanting and be strong .xxxxxx When Pandavas were at exile, Krishna appeared to Yudishtira who was suffering a lot and just said two things - "Everything is temporary " and "All must pass" With those instructions within his heart he carried on without anxiety.
Elaine: Thank you Malini Nitai you and nila are like family to us. Nothing can shake our love and faith in god. If anything it has made it stronger. I really do hope Krishna rights a lot of wrongs that are happening to good devotees. We have had many private messages from devotees telling us abhorrent things that have happened to them also. It's truly heartbreaking. And for me as a healer its hard that they are scared to go public with what's happened to them. That's just so sad that people of God are living in fear of speaking out against horrific things done to them. What has happened to this movement? We should be about love and compassion not fear and bullying.
It's a mess and I fear it will just get worse as all I can feel is a downward spiral of cover ups and lies. May God be merciful to those that are acting against his word. Love and light Lainey
Judy: I remain deeply disturbed about the series of events described here. I rely on devotees to help me stay sane, in other words to maintain a degree of attachment to Srila Prabhupada and his dear Lord Krsna and Srimate Radharani. Not to speak of all the other great personalities who hold Radha Krsna deep within their hearts. I have never been part of a well established KC community, partly due to my own streak of independence amongst other reasons, so I am not qualified to comment in an intelligent manner upon the issue in question.
My heart goes out to you for your pain and I admire your decision to speak out, especially on behalf of the girl who is a victim of rape, which from what I read, was dealt with in an appalling and inhumane manner. I have high regard for Lord Krsna's devotees and am totally jaded to hear of this management. However, I remain affectionate towards the devotees with whom I have a personal relationship with, Srila Prabhupada and the dharma of Lord Caitanya. This, I am sure, is what you must do, while standing in a space of honesty and truth. Continue to care for each other, exchange loving relationships with your dear friends and family and never forget Lord Krsna! With love xxx
Krish: Ignore and move on to the next service, it is what service The Lord him self wants you do next that is benefitting and rewarding for all devotees. Hare Krishna.
Jasoda Dasi: Just dont shoot the messenger! Matty and Lainy are in fact in the role of whistleblowers... and this is a service not to be appraised by those whose seva is different ... Hari Bol!! I got my story too ... of being held at arms length when applying to gurukul .... and fobbed off repeatedly as not from the 'in crowd' .... and given the scullery maid treatment as assumed to be a newbie .... so I developed a new adendum to 'humbler than a blade of grass ... not so humble as you get eaten by the goat!..
Elaine: Krish this is a serious matter and it's that keep your mouth shut attitude that allows such misjustices to continue. It has to stop, and I am engaged in service always have been. i serve my fellow humans by helping them heal. The Manor isn't the centre of my universe. theres a whole wide world out here. I am so proud of everyone that is speaking out. Truth is truth.
Jasoda Dasi: and the attitude that devotees must tolerate above the call of duty towards the truth. My Gem also doesn't want to go back there anymore, and Lewis who had hoped to learn bullock training with Matty is saying here he doesn't want to come there either... I am telling him that Prabhupad had said that 5 miles radius of the temple no one goes hungry... so all included....it is the people's temple.. There is another big bad story on a teacher who was given marching orders after years of voluntary teaching .... I will ask the detail and post it up too.....time to ring the changes..
Matty Dread: Didn't Srila Prabhupada say that the only way that ISKCON could become corrupted was from the inside? Looks like the cookie has really started to crumble?
Jasoda Dasi: When there is a big enough number of us, I vote we march in and occupy Iskcon with continous kirtan....and not settlle for the existing management continueing unless complete change of practice and accountability starts....
Matty Dread Just a little reminder of who this guy is, if he gets voted in as the new temple president of Bhaktivedanta Manor.....http://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/.../4010104.Temple.../
Former temple leader continues paid work despite child abuse verdict
WATFORDOBSERVER.CO.UK
Judy: Deary deary me, this is really not good.
Jasoda Dasi: Its time us beleagered devotees with clear cb checks came for some paid work ....
Parividha Das: To be wronged is nothing unless you continue to remember it.
~ Confucius
Jasoda Dasi: This time no dirt is going under the carpet! Commemorate the gurukul heros and heroines and keep their stories alive ...
Ros Ramya Murphy: Sorry to hear about all this, you two. Unfortunately the Manor bears absolutely no resemblance now to how it used to be. Neither does Iskcon, come to that.
Matty Dread: Parividha Das to be wronged on any level is wrong. As I have said before. If people do not speak up against injustice, especially on these matters regarding so called `men of God` who should know better. These men are nothing more than politicians dressed as saints. Faced with what is right, to leave it undone shows a lack of courage.~ Confucius
Srila Prabhupada also said. "A sincere sweeper in the street is far better than the charlatan meditator who meditates only for the sake of making a living."
Thank you Ros, We are well and truly over it, just needed to make devotees and the public aware of our situation. I`m sure that Srila Prabhupada wouldn't`t be happy with what is going on there. I feel sad for him that the manor bares his name at the beginning of it.
Janardan Das: It's not only at the manor. It's everywhere that falls within the umbrella of this movement. Truth should be known but don't let this eat you up. I've moved on, learned more in a short time than all my time at this corporation. Devotion does not depend on the environment or on the dealing of others. It is ahaituky apratihata. Nothing can obscure that flow except our own ego - Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhar Dev Goswami.
[PADA: Well yes, but Sridhara Maharaja should not support debauchees as his acharyas and then create dangerous personality cult road blocks on the spiritual path of others. Simply put, Sridhara Maharaja has no authority to support debauchees as his acharyas, which then ban, beat, molest, sue and kill Vaishnavas.]
Lila: Well people who want not to remember perhaps have a reason for it. No one acts in certain way unless they have a benefit. Sorry. You know Matty in the Manor they always made sure give protection to the "men" and completely ignored the women. They considered us to be just a problem.
Matty Dread: What ever happened to the philosophy that we are not the body?
Lochan Das Thakur Das: It's a shame Matty, you are venting your frustration at the whole 'society'. I am sure its just that you are upset but remember we are persons first. We have a personal philosophy. The manor isn't all 'ISKCON' in it's entirety. It seems this thread has become a typical venue for old axes to be ground and is in danger of distracting from some of the genuine issues you have raised.
Judy: Bhaktivedanta Manor administration and management does, however, majorly represent ISKCON. And what of the woman who was raped and allegedly mistreated further? I have no axe to grind but so far, we have not heard the other side to this saga from the other side, as it were but I am so disappointed to hear of this "management". So I agree, lets stick to this issue alone.
Lilavati: I heard from someone else, who is more in the temple than me, so it is true. And the new management will make it worst.
Nityalila Devi Dasi: Hare Krishna! PAMHO Dear Matty Dread and Dear Lainey's Love. What has happened to you both and how you have been treated is disgusting. However in some ways maybe you shouldn't take it personally.
[PADA Yep, they wanted to hi-jack the craft store so they would have booted out anyone else who was there.]
Matty Dread: It`s a shame Lochan Das Thakur Dasa that you do not fully understand the seriousness of what is going on right under your nose in the UK yatra, or like the majority are you happy and content just to sit back and ignore it? I am really, really not upset, but please try to understand that the girl who was raped at the manor is also a person too. What would you do if that was your wife, mother or sister?
You say that, "The manor isn't 'ISKCON' in it's entirety." Yet it still remains the head quarters for ISKCON UK. I in no way have detracted from my original post on my initial thread, only to point out who the new (old) TP at the manor will be. I have no axes to grind as I am done with it all. Yes Jude. Funny how no one else from `the other side` has piped up yet. I wonder why?
Elaine: Dearest Natalie Thank you for your love as always. The truth is that me and my lovely husband have been over the hurt for quite some time. But as seekers of truth I was getting sick and tired of devotees coming back to me telling me the rubbish that certain manager were saying about me. So Matty decided to go public with the real truth.
I am totally sick and tired of spineless people who know truths but are too dumb or brainwashed to speak out. People forget me and matty are not new comers we have been around for 30 years. I am happy to have been the sacrificial lamb to cover up a real crime and I would do it all again. Anyone who thinks it's on to cover up crimes against women are going to hell. My soul and my beliefs will not allow me to be part of a corrupt regime. A blind man can see what's happened here. Or are people really that sick in the head that they are so brain washed.
This is cultish behaviour. Last time I checked I was a free spirit with my own values and opinions. There are no axes being ground on this it's called TRUTH you spineless little man. SHAME ON YOU. How small minded and disgusting you actually are. There's nothing more toe curling than some idiot being artificially humble. While I'm thinking about it what service do you actually do? Oh I forgot you prance around Brighton like you are a big man. Now I suggest you crawl back into your cave and drag your missus around by her hair. Ok! !!!!
And loctus, I have fronted you to your face before now. And all you could do was go red. Maybe you should sort your own house out before judging a situation you know sweet fa about.
Janardan Das: Change of our old and new TP, its a political stunt. Fact remains that TP always has been the same policy, no change.
Elaine Saunders: Yes totally Jason khoo. Shame so many sheeples exist and are deaf dumb and blind.
Matty Dread: Yes Lochan Das Thakur Das you are missing the point because this has given devotees a chance to speak truths about wrongs that have been done to them, but they have obviously been too scared to speak out publicly before against a dogmatic regime, and they are all devotees like you who are also busy holding programmes, distributing books, sharing prasadam and chanting and dancing together.
Janardan Das: Devotees do not leave ISKCON. ISKCON is eternal and springs from the spiritual world. Devotee always remains in ISKCON. However, there is a difference between the real ISKCON and an imitation one as pure devotional life is free from contamination. Nama and svarup is non different.
Therefore, ISKCON and Krsna is non different.......they who are in their own league of controlling can do what they wish but others cannot which is simply hypocrisy (rightly so full of them in Kali Yuga). This is so transparent even but so many decided to turn a blind eye as they are too afraid to uphold the truth. Afraid to be without the majority. Afraid not to have so called friends. Afraid to be snubbed, the list goes on. Anyway, everyone will only see where they are at the moment. Sri Sri Guru and Gauranga has the plan.
Sakhya Prema: I just read quite a few posts but there is no mention of taking this issue to the local GBC secretary. It strikes me as odd that he isn't mentioned. If not him (Praghosa Dasa), then it could be presented to the Euro GBC who is Prahladananda Swami or even higher. ISKCON has a lawbook to protect its members rights and can be referred too. All these issues are covered there with laws and by-laws endorsed by the GBC body.
Nobody within this institution is bigger than the ISKCON judicial system. If members are out of order they can be brought to undergo reformatory measures via this system. Every bhakta has a right to ISKCON justice and those who transgress will have to face the consequences for their wrong behavioural attitude or wrongdoings. I have personally undergone this system in the past and respect it and expect other revered members to uphold and honour it.
[PADA: The guru needs to be rectified by the GBC judicial committee?]
Sajjanasraya Das: Most disturbing prabhuji. In the end:"Satyam vijayate!"
Sakhya Prema: Well said Haridasa Thakura prabhu. There are six principle impurities (anarthas) in the heart. Three are visible and three invisible. The human nature will naturally promote the three visible anarthas as overcome and conceal the three subtle ones from public scrutiny. In Sanskrit this is sometimes called 'hrda daurbalyam' and more directly 'Vipralipsa'. Looking good and being good are often two completely separate items.
Jasoda Dasi: yes avoid offenses, kick the merchants out of the temple and stand against the false prophet...thats a lot to do by lunchtime..but hey ho..!
Matty Dread: What is the point of going to local GBC about this issue when they are more than aware of this situation, and Praghosa dasa is best buddies with Syamasundara dasa? Or even taken it higher? Autumn leaves lie as thick as thieves. We reported this matter to the police when it first happened and to me that's higher than the two previous sources mentioned by Sahkya Prema?
Elaine Saunders: The real problem here is that why report it in house? We tried that and we're lied to about that. Then 3 days later the shop was taken away from me. It doesn't take a genius to see what is going on. I am happy in my life. i have no axe to grind. Neither does my lovely husband. But I will always speak out against wrong doings. This thread has given devotees a chance to come forward. And that as a professional healer is amazing. Truths need to be spoken.
And abuses of power should not exist. It takes people to feel supported and loved to do that. Me and matty live in an atmosphere of love compassion and gratefulness. I am blessed to have such a sweet husband. We have been married for a long time. A lot longer than most devotees. Love and light.
Jasoda Dasi: Just listening to a whistleblower who uses auditing of accounts to detect fraud and malpractice... interesting she says it usually accompanies rape and even murder of mostly women to keep things under wraps ....perhaps time we had public viewing of accounts ... stand against the false prophet in Prabhupads temple still holds Radhe Shyama Das .... the issue in this time and place is that we have lost a standard and we must admit it in the temple...This is the heart of Prahbupada's mission not the bus terminus.
Matty Dread: Hi Matty Prabhu. So I'm following your thread. I'm not sure whether I sent this info to you. It was the letter I wrote to the woofer head quarters on the day we were talking on the phone and you told me about it. I've deleted my name and email from it. In the end I received a phone call from them and a reply which you can see below. They told me on the phone that police investigations would be sought. I also asked Syamasundara Pr face to face about it, after you told me on the phone that time. He told me that there was going to be investigations also, and that the woofer girl had left.
So, at that point i felt satisfied that I had done my duty by informing the relevant authorities outside, who then told me they were conducting investigations. My take is zero tolerance. But a person can only do what they are able to do. But, as you can see in my letter to the woofers below, I will try to notify the right people if i hear of a problem. ~ anonymous
****** wrote:
Hello. I'm a regular visitor and friend of the Bhaktivedanta Manor Community
Temple in Hertfordshire. Over the last few days, several volunteers have been
making it known publicly that one of your female Woofers from France who was staying and volunteering here - was actually drugged and raped by two other wwoofers. She was then sent home quickly before any police investigation began, and apparently the issue has been covered up by management of the Temple.
I'm am hoping that some investigation will be undertaken by you in order to establish the truth behind this matter, and, alert the police. If you do or do not do this - someone will since this shocking event is now exposed. I hope the truth can be established and the victim given due care. Obviously any perpetrators should be immediately deal with. Thanks for reading. ~ anonymous
Srila Prabhupada ~ 1974 Correspondence. Letter to Mahadeva -- Mayapur 3 March, 1974: We will present our program at Bhaktivedanta Manor exactly in the line of Lord Caitanya, by kirtana, prasadam distribution and speaking from Bhagavad-gita. We cannot deviate even an inch in order to attract the followers of the ecology philosophy or any other materialistic, utopian movement. You say you know a number of influential leaders of this group, but what is the use of knowing them, since you yourself found them deficient and left them? Our ideal Vedic community will attract everyone on its own merit, and we shall be glad to welcome and accept everyone who comes without our compromising in order to attract them.
As far as your plan to convince Prince Charles, heir to the throne, about Krsna Consciousness, this is another utopian idea. Do not work at it. I request you to live with your God brothers as a regular brahmacari and prosecute our standard practices for spreading Krsna Consciousness by book distribution, distribution of prasadam and preaching to interested people.
I think you should stay in India. Our Mayapur temple is better than any temple in the U.S. and Europe, and everyone is appreciating it as very gorgeous. So there is a full program here and I request you to take on duties here and do not go wandering around. I have heard of the report of your stealing from the temples, and Mukunda has requested that you do not go back there. Therefore I recommend as the best thing that you make a fresh start and stay here in India where there is such a great need. You English boys have good facility here, not having the visa trouble that the U.S. devotees have, so take advantage of this and cooperate with me in this way. That is my request.
Jasoda Dasi: Wow thank you for that valve release... We've all suffered the hypocrisy, lies and even aggression, and being shunned. And you have given us closure. Keep up your position of integrity ..We can say that Prabhupada's mission was not in vain .. tear. ALGTSP!
Emma: Hi matt, always there is good and bad. Seems where you've loved to be going has many many bads. Such a shame when you have enjoyed this since late teenage years. It's disgraceful how they have treated you and lainey. You're closer to the truth than there comfortable with. But to call you thieves after all lainey does and you're unpaid work.
You were both coming as devotees, it's never for gain. I don't blame you for not going again. But it's such a shame that although you've done no wrong, you have lost out on what you both enjoyed doing. I thought the one true places to go for peace and truth were them of faith. It seems there corrupt too. And that poor, poor lady going through rape, people knowing of it and doing nothing. Shame on them. As you said, this could be a relative of there's! I pray she finds help and is not suffering any more.
Its very hurtful and it shows many lessons are still to be learnt no matter what age you are. Sometimes the people we trust the most, are hiding to many injustices, secrets and really have a dark heart and mind. I hope the truth comes out and you're innocence is made public as no one wants that hung over their heads. It's too Jack and nory to me, they could say nothing eise about you both so have gone for theft, as we know that crime is taking seriously within the temple and anywhere especially when a tight knit if people, within what's trying to build togetherness, love, peace community spirit and he honnesty. I bet lainey beside herself. I think you're both dealing with it very gracefully as mature adults. As it must hurt you alot. Be patient as the truth does come out in the end, it's a shame you have now got to change you're routine, doing something you enjoyed because others are not who they made out to be. Very naughty. Praise that you have each other. Much love
Nanda Gopal Swami: I'm very glad to hear it, as we have the same, but worse situation on New Govardhan, Australia. Only, it's a young French army escapee whose taken over, and no one can oppose him, only me(40 years service, 2m collected). He just killed our biggest book distributor by banning him, and I'm putting the lot of them up for murder, beginning with Prabhupads. I'm sure George is pleased with you for coming forward, I've always felt this about the Manor.
Michael: Well ... here we are in January 2019. Shyamasudara was finally interviewed by the police 2018. Shyamasudara admitted to 3 counts of sexual harassment.. The ladies involved didn't want to take it further.. However shyamasudara has been put on a sex offender's register. The police team dealing with the case apologized ...they said more should have been done at the time.
As for the honey ...it was Acharya sevak das who took it...he admitted it to a friend of mine. Were the management cooperative ... not at the time ... but once the police got involved ... they were obliged to cooperate. Please remember ...
Shyamasudara das was part of the management team that was pressuring the Bhaktivedanta Manor devotees to sign a Confidentiality Agreement wherein they can be banned and legally prosecuted should anyone divulge any information without the blessings of the management.
Ys m
Narayan: Yikes Prabhus,!!! You are always welcome here, Krishna Cow Sanctuary!
Ralph: Hare Krishna all Glories to Srila Prabhupada and to George Hari son.
Rasika: Matty Dread ... Prabhu please activate a share button. As I'm very active and outspoken with regards to cow protection, I do feel it necessary to share and expose this. Devotees dont know about the hidden character of our economy GBC minister for ISKCON cow protection. The more that they know, the better for us succeeding in doing Varnashram and Prabhupada's desire justice. Thank you for revealing the facts.
PADA: What about the ISKCON cows that were sold for slaughter and Prithu went to try to save, them but they were already gone. And they were sold because the cowherd devotee said he could no longer stand seeing them starving and suffering with no funds to keep them alive? Meanwhile, there is a spare $20,000,0000 on hand to sue the India devotees in the Delhi Supreme Court who want to worship Prabhupada? ys pd
Bhrigu Pandit: hare krishna
Sila: Years ago a nice professional couple were taking a lot of interest in Kc Some 'devotees' stayed at their house whilst they did 'sankirtan'. There was an issue with misappropriation of takings and the couple reported to then TP Akandhadi dasa to hand the matter over to the police, but he refused saying it would be dealt with as usual, in-house. The couple left in disgust and did not return. I could write a book, but so could most of us.Has anyone else heard of the practice of taking any 'disruptive' bhaktas to the local mental hospital to get them on sedatives? So many broken hearts and disrupted spiritual lives...
Michael: Akandadhi now sells booze at Bukland Hall in Wales.
PADA: Yes, the family of the 11 year old girl who was being touched for a week by Lokanath swami was told not to go to the police, because the GBC was going to remove Lokanath as a guru and make sure he never has a post of authority in ISKCON. So the family held off going to the police, but a few months later, the family saw that Lokanath swami was right back to getting his guru pooja again as if nothing ever happened and the GBC was promoting him as "the sum total of the demigods" guru. This happens all over the place, it not simply a problem in UK. This girl is now a woman and is a friend of mine, and she is still totally mortified at the way she was treated. ys pd
Robert Duke Maha Bhuja Acbsp, here comes all the negativity, Akandadi sells booze in Wales, but if it hadn't been for Akandadi now we wouldn't have the Manor, and Michaell, Don't keep on about taking a bath, you were always heavy at the Manor when I first met you.
Michael: Robert Duke..you are an embarrassment to yourself ... you have no idea how delusional you are. Neither do have any idea what Akandadhi got up to...
Jane: I'm sickened to the core to hear that cows were sent to slaughter by supposed devotees from the manor how could that ever happen.
Sila: Once at the Manor i and a group of friends and others, witnessed two louts trying to get a ring through an oxen's nose, by one forcing his nose through a metal grid, to hold him still- and the other pushing the ring through his nostrils. The poor animal was struggling and its eyes rolling in fear and pain. I reported this to an authority standing close by, but they gave a kind of helpless shrug and did nothing. Is this common practice i wonder at the hell--on-earth the Manor has become? It would have broken George Harrison's heart. He had already commented on the deterioration he was witnessing there.
Kevin: With all due respect to you both Matty and Lainey I hope I remain your friends because I respect both of you. Although we have rarely ever met or spoken to each other I feel I have got to know you both through Facebook to a certain extent and I have always enjoyed with interest both of your postings. I read the letter above with interest and you have raised many valid points and much of it is certainly an eye opener. I used to live at Bhaktivedanta manor many years ago in the late seventies and early eighties and seen many changes over the years and heard of some incidents that would raise eyebrows, but some of them would pale in comparison to what you have written about in your letter. Anyway Prabhus I hope I remain your friends and still keep you as friends on Facebook. Please accept my humble Obeisances.
Dhira Bhakta Dasa: Robert Duke Sri Krishna is non different either in the home or temple, this Sri Krishna himself makes clear, his manifestation is down to the person's own sincerity and humbleness. The Manor has sadly banned individuals either by dubious stories or because they are questioning why Srila Prabhupada instructions aren't being followed; it may be the European headquarters of ISKCON but also the headquarters of some rather strange goings on Sadly.
The pay roll at the Manor eclipses that of some care agencies here in Wales, and Sava is done only for laxmi reward this I've seen. But seriously check out what Sri Krishna states about himself before making comment on how he manifests
Matty Dread: I'm just seeing all these comments now that have been posted from Friday 11th January 2019 onwards. I'm only just seeing them on my wife's timeline from when I tagged her in my original post back in 2014. The confusing world of Facebook! Just going to read the recent comments now.
William: Well done for standing up for yourself and Lainey Matty.
Stephen: Love you Matty......
Matty Dread: Emma Dear cousin you speak the truth. You know that this all happpend five years ago right? xXx
Matty Dread: Sila Prabhu, maybe we should all combine our stories and write a book? anda Gopal Swami Thank you for your kind words Maharaja. Jane Not sure that the cows were sold for slaughter from the manor but I could be wrong????
PADA: No the cows that were sold was here in USA, but many other USA farm cows were not treated well, some were frozen to death, not given medical care and so on and so forth. Of course same things were going on in the gurukula, various children reported they were not being fed properly, could not get soap, blankets, medical help etc. Basically the leaders kicked out all sorts of people left, right and center and then there was almost no one left to care for the cows, the temples, the deities, the children and etc. ys pd
Sila: Matty Dread Love the book idea, but would anyone believe it?
Kevin: Wow I'm shocked matty and lainey ... feel for you both ... its difficult pill to swallow about manor ... some rotten apples in the barrel ... that surely need to be sorted out some how ... it reminds me of a corrupt police force with officers on the take ..or a goverment that lies ... politicians always avoid a direct question to a simple .. yes or no etc ..this has really put me off going to manor in the future.. i gotta know that i can trust the leaders etc ..i wanted to help in my own little way to do service and made a donation to a devotee for a sponsored walk to help raise laxmi to help build the new place at manor ..i dont know how that donation was used..feel angry and sad about it all really x HARE Krishna
Sila: Sadly not just the Manor, the whole organisation corrupted and broken from within, as Srila Prabhupada predicted could happen. Re donations: leaders- supposed to be renunciates- are having marble apartments built in India. I've seen videos of them standing in front of these 'palaces' advertising them, like any estate agent would. And that is only the tip of the iceberg..
Kevin: Thank you for this ..oh what to do .. feel powerlessness .. im a karmi of sorts chant a round a day .. where will i put any donations in k.c ? Im thinking of helping the animals out ..but prabhupada said to try to give to continue service to him and devotees. Yes that is why these forums can be so helpful. Re donations, if you are interested in distributing Srila Prabhupada's original (unchanged) books, you could contact Ramya Ros Murphy, who with her son Mukunda (Mikey), run a small business ..
***** I think ISKCON is undergoing a grass roots outside revolution.
Krish: Ignore and move on to the next service, it is what service The Lord him self wants you do next that is benefitting and rewarding for all devotees. Hare Krishna.
Jasoda Dasi: Just dont shoot the messenger! Matty and Lainy are in fact in the role of whistleblowers... and this is a service not to be appraised by those whose seva is different ... Hari Bol!! I got my story too ... of being held at arms length when applying to gurukul .... and fobbed off repeatedly as not from the 'in crowd' .... and given the scullery maid treatment as assumed to be a newbie .... so I developed a new adendum to 'humbler than a blade of grass ... not so humble as you get eaten by the goat!..
Elaine: Krish this is a serious matter and it's that keep your mouth shut attitude that allows such misjustices to continue. It has to stop, and I am engaged in service always have been. i serve my fellow humans by helping them heal. The Manor isn't the centre of my universe. theres a whole wide world out here. I am so proud of everyone that is speaking out. Truth is truth.
Jasoda Dasi: and the attitude that devotees must tolerate above the call of duty towards the truth. My Gem also doesn't want to go back there anymore, and Lewis who had hoped to learn bullock training with Matty is saying here he doesn't want to come there either... I am telling him that Prabhupad had said that 5 miles radius of the temple no one goes hungry... so all included....it is the people's temple.. There is another big bad story on a teacher who was given marching orders after years of voluntary teaching .... I will ask the detail and post it up too.....time to ring the changes..
Matty Dread: Didn't Srila Prabhupada say that the only way that ISKCON could become corrupted was from the inside? Looks like the cookie has really started to crumble?
Jasoda Dasi: When there is a big enough number of us, I vote we march in and occupy Iskcon with continous kirtan....and not settlle for the existing management continueing unless complete change of practice and accountability starts....
Matty Dread Just a little reminder of who this guy is, if he gets voted in as the new temple president of Bhaktivedanta Manor.....http://www.watfordobserver.co.uk/.../4010104.Temple.../
Former temple leader continues paid work despite child abuse verdict
WATFORDOBSERVER.CO.UK
Judy: Deary deary me, this is really not good.
Jasoda Dasi: Its time us beleagered devotees with clear cb checks came for some paid work ....
Parividha Das: To be wronged is nothing unless you continue to remember it.
~ Confucius
Jasoda Dasi: This time no dirt is going under the carpet! Commemorate the gurukul heros and heroines and keep their stories alive ...
Ros Ramya Murphy: Sorry to hear about all this, you two. Unfortunately the Manor bears absolutely no resemblance now to how it used to be. Neither does Iskcon, come to that.
Matty Dread: Parividha Das to be wronged on any level is wrong. As I have said before. If people do not speak up against injustice, especially on these matters regarding so called `men of God` who should know better. These men are nothing more than politicians dressed as saints. Faced with what is right, to leave it undone shows a lack of courage.~ Confucius
Srila Prabhupada also said. "A sincere sweeper in the street is far better than the charlatan meditator who meditates only for the sake of making a living."
Thank you Ros, We are well and truly over it, just needed to make devotees and the public aware of our situation. I`m sure that Srila Prabhupada wouldn't`t be happy with what is going on there. I feel sad for him that the manor bares his name at the beginning of it.
Janardan Das: It's not only at the manor. It's everywhere that falls within the umbrella of this movement. Truth should be known but don't let this eat you up. I've moved on, learned more in a short time than all my time at this corporation. Devotion does not depend on the environment or on the dealing of others. It is ahaituky apratihata. Nothing can obscure that flow except our own ego - Srila Bhakti Rakshak Sridhar Dev Goswami.
[PADA: Well yes, but Sridhara Maharaja should not support debauchees as his acharyas and then create dangerous personality cult road blocks on the spiritual path of others. Simply put, Sridhara Maharaja has no authority to support debauchees as his acharyas, which then ban, beat, molest, sue and kill Vaishnavas.]
Lila: Well people who want not to remember perhaps have a reason for it. No one acts in certain way unless they have a benefit. Sorry. You know Matty in the Manor they always made sure give protection to the "men" and completely ignored the women. They considered us to be just a problem.
Matty Dread: What ever happened to the philosophy that we are not the body?
Lochan Das Thakur Das: It's a shame Matty, you are venting your frustration at the whole 'society'. I am sure its just that you are upset but remember we are persons first. We have a personal philosophy. The manor isn't all 'ISKCON' in it's entirety. It seems this thread has become a typical venue for old axes to be ground and is in danger of distracting from some of the genuine issues you have raised.
Judy: Bhaktivedanta Manor administration and management does, however, majorly represent ISKCON. And what of the woman who was raped and allegedly mistreated further? I have no axe to grind but so far, we have not heard the other side to this saga from the other side, as it were but I am so disappointed to hear of this "management". So I agree, lets stick to this issue alone.
Lilavati: I heard from someone else, who is more in the temple than me, so it is true. And the new management will make it worst.
Nityalila Devi Dasi: Hare Krishna! PAMHO Dear Matty Dread and Dear Lainey's Love. What has happened to you both and how you have been treated is disgusting. However in some ways maybe you shouldn't take it personally.
[PADA Yep, they wanted to hi-jack the craft store so they would have booted out anyone else who was there.]
Matty Dread: It`s a shame Lochan Das Thakur Dasa that you do not fully understand the seriousness of what is going on right under your nose in the UK yatra, or like the majority are you happy and content just to sit back and ignore it? I am really, really not upset, but please try to understand that the girl who was raped at the manor is also a person too. What would you do if that was your wife, mother or sister?
You say that, "The manor isn't 'ISKCON' in it's entirety." Yet it still remains the head quarters for ISKCON UK. I in no way have detracted from my original post on my initial thread, only to point out who the new (old) TP at the manor will be. I have no axes to grind as I am done with it all. Yes Jude. Funny how no one else from `the other side` has piped up yet. I wonder why?
Elaine: Dearest Natalie Thank you for your love as always. The truth is that me and my lovely husband have been over the hurt for quite some time. But as seekers of truth I was getting sick and tired of devotees coming back to me telling me the rubbish that certain manager were saying about me. So Matty decided to go public with the real truth.
I am totally sick and tired of spineless people who know truths but are too dumb or brainwashed to speak out. People forget me and matty are not new comers we have been around for 30 years. I am happy to have been the sacrificial lamb to cover up a real crime and I would do it all again. Anyone who thinks it's on to cover up crimes against women are going to hell. My soul and my beliefs will not allow me to be part of a corrupt regime. A blind man can see what's happened here. Or are people really that sick in the head that they are so brain washed.
This is cultish behaviour. Last time I checked I was a free spirit with my own values and opinions. There are no axes being ground on this it's called TRUTH you spineless little man. SHAME ON YOU. How small minded and disgusting you actually are. There's nothing more toe curling than some idiot being artificially humble. While I'm thinking about it what service do you actually do? Oh I forgot you prance around Brighton like you are a big man. Now I suggest you crawl back into your cave and drag your missus around by her hair. Ok! !!!!
And loctus, I have fronted you to your face before now. And all you could do was go red. Maybe you should sort your own house out before judging a situation you know sweet fa about.
Janardan Das: Change of our old and new TP, its a political stunt. Fact remains that TP always has been the same policy, no change.
Elaine Saunders: Yes totally Jason khoo. Shame so many sheeples exist and are deaf dumb and blind.
Matty Dread: Yes Lochan Das Thakur Das you are missing the point because this has given devotees a chance to speak truths about wrongs that have been done to them, but they have obviously been too scared to speak out publicly before against a dogmatic regime, and they are all devotees like you who are also busy holding programmes, distributing books, sharing prasadam and chanting and dancing together.
Janardan Das: Devotees do not leave ISKCON. ISKCON is eternal and springs from the spiritual world. Devotee always remains in ISKCON. However, there is a difference between the real ISKCON and an imitation one as pure devotional life is free from contamination. Nama and svarup is non different.
Therefore, ISKCON and Krsna is non different.......they who are in their own league of controlling can do what they wish but others cannot which is simply hypocrisy (rightly so full of them in Kali Yuga). This is so transparent even but so many decided to turn a blind eye as they are too afraid to uphold the truth. Afraid to be without the majority. Afraid not to have so called friends. Afraid to be snubbed, the list goes on. Anyway, everyone will only see where they are at the moment. Sri Sri Guru and Gauranga has the plan.
Sakhya Prema: I just read quite a few posts but there is no mention of taking this issue to the local GBC secretary. It strikes me as odd that he isn't mentioned. If not him (Praghosa Dasa), then it could be presented to the Euro GBC who is Prahladananda Swami or even higher. ISKCON has a lawbook to protect its members rights and can be referred too. All these issues are covered there with laws and by-laws endorsed by the GBC body.
Nobody within this institution is bigger than the ISKCON judicial system. If members are out of order they can be brought to undergo reformatory measures via this system. Every bhakta has a right to ISKCON justice and those who transgress will have to face the consequences for their wrong behavioural attitude or wrongdoings. I have personally undergone this system in the past and respect it and expect other revered members to uphold and honour it.
[PADA: The guru needs to be rectified by the GBC judicial committee?]
Sajjanasraya Das: Most disturbing prabhuji. In the end:"Satyam vijayate!"
Sakhya Prema: Well said Haridasa Thakura prabhu. There are six principle impurities (anarthas) in the heart. Three are visible and three invisible. The human nature will naturally promote the three visible anarthas as overcome and conceal the three subtle ones from public scrutiny. In Sanskrit this is sometimes called 'hrda daurbalyam' and more directly 'Vipralipsa'. Looking good and being good are often two completely separate items.
Jasoda Dasi: yes avoid offenses, kick the merchants out of the temple and stand against the false prophet...thats a lot to do by lunchtime..but hey ho..!
Matty Dread: What is the point of going to local GBC about this issue when they are more than aware of this situation, and Praghosa dasa is best buddies with Syamasundara dasa? Or even taken it higher? Autumn leaves lie as thick as thieves. We reported this matter to the police when it first happened and to me that's higher than the two previous sources mentioned by Sahkya Prema?
Elaine Saunders: The real problem here is that why report it in house? We tried that and we're lied to about that. Then 3 days later the shop was taken away from me. It doesn't take a genius to see what is going on. I am happy in my life. i have no axe to grind. Neither does my lovely husband. But I will always speak out against wrong doings. This thread has given devotees a chance to come forward. And that as a professional healer is amazing. Truths need to be spoken.
And abuses of power should not exist. It takes people to feel supported and loved to do that. Me and matty live in an atmosphere of love compassion and gratefulness. I am blessed to have such a sweet husband. We have been married for a long time. A lot longer than most devotees. Love and light.
Jasoda Dasi: Just listening to a whistleblower who uses auditing of accounts to detect fraud and malpractice... interesting she says it usually accompanies rape and even murder of mostly women to keep things under wraps ....perhaps time we had public viewing of accounts ... stand against the false prophet in Prabhupads temple still holds Radhe Shyama Das .... the issue in this time and place is that we have lost a standard and we must admit it in the temple...This is the heart of Prahbupada's mission not the bus terminus.
Matty Dread: Hi Matty Prabhu. So I'm following your thread. I'm not sure whether I sent this info to you. It was the letter I wrote to the woofer head quarters on the day we were talking on the phone and you told me about it. I've deleted my name and email from it. In the end I received a phone call from them and a reply which you can see below. They told me on the phone that police investigations would be sought. I also asked Syamasundara Pr face to face about it, after you told me on the phone that time. He told me that there was going to be investigations also, and that the woofer girl had left.
So, at that point i felt satisfied that I had done my duty by informing the relevant authorities outside, who then told me they were conducting investigations. My take is zero tolerance. But a person can only do what they are able to do. But, as you can see in my letter to the woofers below, I will try to notify the right people if i hear of a problem. ~ anonymous
****** wrote:
Hello. I'm a regular visitor and friend of the Bhaktivedanta Manor Community
Temple in Hertfordshire. Over the last few days, several volunteers have been
making it known publicly that one of your female Woofers from France who was staying and volunteering here - was actually drugged and raped by two other wwoofers. She was then sent home quickly before any police investigation began, and apparently the issue has been covered up by management of the Temple.
I'm am hoping that some investigation will be undertaken by you in order to establish the truth behind this matter, and, alert the police. If you do or do not do this - someone will since this shocking event is now exposed. I hope the truth can be established and the victim given due care. Obviously any perpetrators should be immediately deal with. Thanks for reading. ~ anonymous
Srila Prabhupada ~ 1974 Correspondence. Letter to Mahadeva -- Mayapur 3 March, 1974: We will present our program at Bhaktivedanta Manor exactly in the line of Lord Caitanya, by kirtana, prasadam distribution and speaking from Bhagavad-gita. We cannot deviate even an inch in order to attract the followers of the ecology philosophy or any other materialistic, utopian movement. You say you know a number of influential leaders of this group, but what is the use of knowing them, since you yourself found them deficient and left them? Our ideal Vedic community will attract everyone on its own merit, and we shall be glad to welcome and accept everyone who comes without our compromising in order to attract them.
As far as your plan to convince Prince Charles, heir to the throne, about Krsna Consciousness, this is another utopian idea. Do not work at it. I request you to live with your God brothers as a regular brahmacari and prosecute our standard practices for spreading Krsna Consciousness by book distribution, distribution of prasadam and preaching to interested people.
I think you should stay in India. Our Mayapur temple is better than any temple in the U.S. and Europe, and everyone is appreciating it as very gorgeous. So there is a full program here and I request you to take on duties here and do not go wandering around. I have heard of the report of your stealing from the temples, and Mukunda has requested that you do not go back there. Therefore I recommend as the best thing that you make a fresh start and stay here in India where there is such a great need. You English boys have good facility here, not having the visa trouble that the U.S. devotees have, so take advantage of this and cooperate with me in this way. That is my request.
Jasoda Dasi: Wow thank you for that valve release... We've all suffered the hypocrisy, lies and even aggression, and being shunned. And you have given us closure. Keep up your position of integrity ..We can say that Prabhupada's mission was not in vain .. tear. ALGTSP!
Emma: Hi matt, always there is good and bad. Seems where you've loved to be going has many many bads. Such a shame when you have enjoyed this since late teenage years. It's disgraceful how they have treated you and lainey. You're closer to the truth than there comfortable with. But to call you thieves after all lainey does and you're unpaid work.
You were both coming as devotees, it's never for gain. I don't blame you for not going again. But it's such a shame that although you've done no wrong, you have lost out on what you both enjoyed doing. I thought the one true places to go for peace and truth were them of faith. It seems there corrupt too. And that poor, poor lady going through rape, people knowing of it and doing nothing. Shame on them. As you said, this could be a relative of there's! I pray she finds help and is not suffering any more.
Its very hurtful and it shows many lessons are still to be learnt no matter what age you are. Sometimes the people we trust the most, are hiding to many injustices, secrets and really have a dark heart and mind. I hope the truth comes out and you're innocence is made public as no one wants that hung over their heads. It's too Jack and nory to me, they could say nothing eise about you both so have gone for theft, as we know that crime is taking seriously within the temple and anywhere especially when a tight knit if people, within what's trying to build togetherness, love, peace community spirit and he honnesty. I bet lainey beside herself. I think you're both dealing with it very gracefully as mature adults. As it must hurt you alot. Be patient as the truth does come out in the end, it's a shame you have now got to change you're routine, doing something you enjoyed because others are not who they made out to be. Very naughty. Praise that you have each other. Much love
Nanda Gopal Swami: I'm very glad to hear it, as we have the same, but worse situation on New Govardhan, Australia. Only, it's a young French army escapee whose taken over, and no one can oppose him, only me(40 years service, 2m collected). He just killed our biggest book distributor by banning him, and I'm putting the lot of them up for murder, beginning with Prabhupads. I'm sure George is pleased with you for coming forward, I've always felt this about the Manor.
Michael: Well ... here we are in January 2019. Shyamasudara was finally interviewed by the police 2018. Shyamasudara admitted to 3 counts of sexual harassment.. The ladies involved didn't want to take it further.. However shyamasudara has been put on a sex offender's register. The police team dealing with the case apologized ...they said more should have been done at the time.
As for the honey ...it was Acharya sevak das who took it...he admitted it to a friend of mine. Were the management cooperative ... not at the time ... but once the police got involved ... they were obliged to cooperate. Please remember ...
Shyamasudara das was part of the management team that was pressuring the Bhaktivedanta Manor devotees to sign a Confidentiality Agreement wherein they can be banned and legally prosecuted should anyone divulge any information without the blessings of the management.
Ys m
Narayan: Yikes Prabhus,!!! You are always welcome here, Krishna Cow Sanctuary!
Ralph: Hare Krishna all Glories to Srila Prabhupada and to George Hari son.
Rasika: Matty Dread ... Prabhu please activate a share button. As I'm very active and outspoken with regards to cow protection, I do feel it necessary to share and expose this. Devotees dont know about the hidden character of our economy GBC minister for ISKCON cow protection. The more that they know, the better for us succeeding in doing Varnashram and Prabhupada's desire justice. Thank you for revealing the facts.
PADA: What about the ISKCON cows that were sold for slaughter and Prithu went to try to save, them but they were already gone. And they were sold because the cowherd devotee said he could no longer stand seeing them starving and suffering with no funds to keep them alive? Meanwhile, there is a spare $20,000,0000 on hand to sue the India devotees in the Delhi Supreme Court who want to worship Prabhupada? ys pd
Bhrigu Pandit: hare krishna
Sila: Years ago a nice professional couple were taking a lot of interest in Kc Some 'devotees' stayed at their house whilst they did 'sankirtan'. There was an issue with misappropriation of takings and the couple reported to then TP Akandhadi dasa to hand the matter over to the police, but he refused saying it would be dealt with as usual, in-house. The couple left in disgust and did not return. I could write a book, but so could most of us.Has anyone else heard of the practice of taking any 'disruptive' bhaktas to the local mental hospital to get them on sedatives? So many broken hearts and disrupted spiritual lives...
Michael: Akandadhi now sells booze at Bukland Hall in Wales.
PADA: Yes, the family of the 11 year old girl who was being touched for a week by Lokanath swami was told not to go to the police, because the GBC was going to remove Lokanath as a guru and make sure he never has a post of authority in ISKCON. So the family held off going to the police, but a few months later, the family saw that Lokanath swami was right back to getting his guru pooja again as if nothing ever happened and the GBC was promoting him as "the sum total of the demigods" guru. This happens all over the place, it not simply a problem in UK. This girl is now a woman and is a friend of mine, and she is still totally mortified at the way she was treated. ys pd
Robert Duke Maha Bhuja Acbsp, here comes all the negativity, Akandadi sells booze in Wales, but if it hadn't been for Akandadi now we wouldn't have the Manor, and Michaell, Don't keep on about taking a bath, you were always heavy at the Manor when I first met you.
Michael: Robert Duke..you are an embarrassment to yourself ... you have no idea how delusional you are. Neither do have any idea what Akandadhi got up to...
Jane: I'm sickened to the core to hear that cows were sent to slaughter by supposed devotees from the manor how could that ever happen.
Sila: Once at the Manor i and a group of friends and others, witnessed two louts trying to get a ring through an oxen's nose, by one forcing his nose through a metal grid, to hold him still- and the other pushing the ring through his nostrils. The poor animal was struggling and its eyes rolling in fear and pain. I reported this to an authority standing close by, but they gave a kind of helpless shrug and did nothing. Is this common practice i wonder at the hell--on-earth the Manor has become? It would have broken George Harrison's heart. He had already commented on the deterioration he was witnessing there.
Kevin: With all due respect to you both Matty and Lainey I hope I remain your friends because I respect both of you. Although we have rarely ever met or spoken to each other I feel I have got to know you both through Facebook to a certain extent and I have always enjoyed with interest both of your postings. I read the letter above with interest and you have raised many valid points and much of it is certainly an eye opener. I used to live at Bhaktivedanta manor many years ago in the late seventies and early eighties and seen many changes over the years and heard of some incidents that would raise eyebrows, but some of them would pale in comparison to what you have written about in your letter. Anyway Prabhus I hope I remain your friends and still keep you as friends on Facebook. Please accept my humble Obeisances.
Dhira Bhakta Dasa: Robert Duke Sri Krishna is non different either in the home or temple, this Sri Krishna himself makes clear, his manifestation is down to the person's own sincerity and humbleness. The Manor has sadly banned individuals either by dubious stories or because they are questioning why Srila Prabhupada instructions aren't being followed; it may be the European headquarters of ISKCON but also the headquarters of some rather strange goings on Sadly.
The pay roll at the Manor eclipses that of some care agencies here in Wales, and Sava is done only for laxmi reward this I've seen. But seriously check out what Sri Krishna states about himself before making comment on how he manifests
Matty Dread: I'm just seeing all these comments now that have been posted from Friday 11th January 2019 onwards. I'm only just seeing them on my wife's timeline from when I tagged her in my original post back in 2014. The confusing world of Facebook! Just going to read the recent comments now.
William: Well done for standing up for yourself and Lainey Matty.
Stephen: Love you Matty......
Matty Dread: Emma Dear cousin you speak the truth. You know that this all happpend five years ago right? xXx
Matty Dread: Sila Prabhu, maybe we should all combine our stories and write a book? anda Gopal Swami Thank you for your kind words Maharaja. Jane Not sure that the cows were sold for slaughter from the manor but I could be wrong????
PADA: No the cows that were sold was here in USA, but many other USA farm cows were not treated well, some were frozen to death, not given medical care and so on and so forth. Of course same things were going on in the gurukula, various children reported they were not being fed properly, could not get soap, blankets, medical help etc. Basically the leaders kicked out all sorts of people left, right and center and then there was almost no one left to care for the cows, the temples, the deities, the children and etc. ys pd
Sila: Matty Dread Love the book idea, but would anyone believe it?
Kevin: Wow I'm shocked matty and lainey ... feel for you both ... its difficult pill to swallow about manor ... some rotten apples in the barrel ... that surely need to be sorted out some how ... it reminds me of a corrupt police force with officers on the take ..or a goverment that lies ... politicians always avoid a direct question to a simple .. yes or no etc ..this has really put me off going to manor in the future.. i gotta know that i can trust the leaders etc ..i wanted to help in my own little way to do service and made a donation to a devotee for a sponsored walk to help raise laxmi to help build the new place at manor ..i dont know how that donation was used..feel angry and sad about it all really x HARE Krishna
Sila: Sadly not just the Manor, the whole organisation corrupted and broken from within, as Srila Prabhupada predicted could happen. Re donations: leaders- supposed to be renunciates- are having marble apartments built in India. I've seen videos of them standing in front of these 'palaces' advertising them, like any estate agent would. And that is only the tip of the iceberg..
Kevin: Thank you for this ..oh what to do .. feel powerlessness .. im a karmi of sorts chant a round a day .. where will i put any donations in k.c ? Im thinking of helping the animals out ..but prabhupada said to try to give to continue service to him and devotees. Yes that is why these forums can be so helpful. Re donations, if you are interested in distributing Srila Prabhupada's original (unchanged) books, you could contact Ramya Ros Murphy, who with her son Mukunda (Mikey), run a small business ..
***** I think ISKCON is undergoing a grass roots outside revolution.
Nityalila Devi Dasi: Truth will always defend herself dear Matty Dread. I never doubted yourself and dear Elaine Saunders even though I still haven't met you in person I did reside at the Manor and so could understand your words to be the truth. You as a couple are full of so much love and would ever lie or cheat anyone. This is what I feel in my heart. I love you both.
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