Friday, May 29, 2015

Easier Said Than Done? by Rocana das

Easier Said Than Done


This is in response to the continuing inquiries of a number of Sun readers, who have asked various questions about how qualified a diksa guru has to be, and where to find such a person in ISKCON.

[PADA: Rocana just wrote his "ISKCON constitution" -- wherein he saying that he agrees with the current GBC's "guru system," that their gurus will be -- "2/3 show of hands" voted in, and then their "gurus" can be -- corrected, censured, monitored, suspended, fixed and repaired, removed etc. -- all of which is not found anywhere in the Vedas?

Meanwhile, Rocana argues that his above ecclesiastical guru program is "following the tradition." Where is this tradition followed? -- (A) The acharyas are subordinated to a managerial body. However (B) weren't we taught that acharyas are subordinated to Krishna, not a managing committee? And what exactly is an acharya managerial committee? 

Q: Which previous acharyas were managed by Rocana's guru committee program idea? 
A: None, ever.

It is also self evident that Rocana has "no confidence" in his own diksha gurus because -- 

As soon as Rocana's program "2/3 show of hands" votes in their diksha guru, they then make an IMMEDIATE plan to provide a back door system to remove that person -- should he turn out to be an excessive deviant. Of course this plan has not worked very well so far? 

In fact "suspending and removing the guru" rarely works at all under the Rocana scheme. Then again -- adding deviant gurus to -- and then removing deviant gurus from -- the parampara -- is not something mentioned in the Vedas? Where is Rocana's system found in the Vedas? By what authority does Rocana add deviants (who need correcting) to the parampara in the first place?

Thus -- many of Rocana's previously "voted in" acharyas like for example -- Bhavananda, Hari Sauri (aka Prabhupada Kripa Maharaja), Prabhavishnu, Satsvarupa, Mahanidhi and many others -- they still enjoy some sort of ongoing elite status, if not continued guru glory -- despite their total failure to maintain the basics of their sannyasa regimen. Never mind folks like Prabhavishnu's confidential associate who was complaining that PVS likes to listen to Pink Floyd music etc. 

Then again Rocana cannot explain what is a suspended acharya in the first place? And why is Rocana placing Pink Floyd music fans in his Vyasa-asana seats in the first place? The good news is that Suhotra's associate found only a box full of 1940s Humphrey Bogart "detective noir" movies in Suhotra's baggage, and not worse videos (yep one "sannyasa guru" was caught with porno movies). Why does Rocana's / GBC's program keep mixing up Pink Floyd, Humphrey Bogart, Timothy Leary, gambling in Reno, machine guns, LSD, porno movies, and who knows what else -- to God's successors and acharyas?    

Rocana's program has "a tradition" of selecting Humphey Bogart fans for their messiahs.

The fact that Rocana has to reform, censure, suspend, (if not remove) many of his diksha gurus -- is actually Rocana's vote of "no confidence" in his acharyas. "Yes, the car we are selling you has a ten years warranty, ooops maybe a month, ooops maybe a day, ooops maybe two minutes, ooops, at least we do hope it drives itself off the lot." Who will buy such a car? Rocana cannot even guarantee that his acharyas are following even the basics of sadhana process, at the time he votes them in?   

Yes, Rocana is still saying his acharyas will continue to fall down and engage in deviations, and require reform, censure and even removal. There is really no difference between Rocana's diksha guru process and the GBC's "voted in" diksha guru process. The first and most glaring problem for these folks is -- there is no history of any acharyas being subordinated to a Governing Body (as Rocana details in his "constitution") especially one that makes so many constant chronic mistakes like this one does? 

Yes, there is no such thing in the Vedas as:

Acharyas who need Rocana's "guru reforms,"
Acharays who need correcting by the votes of a committee, 
Acharyas who are deviating, 
Acharyas who are being censured, 
Acharyas who are being monitored (to make sure they chant their rounds?)
Acharyas who are being suspended,
Acharyas who are having illicit sex in the holy dham, 
Acharyas who are being excommunicated etc.? 

Rocana admits he has no confidence in his own voted in gurus, but if we express that same sentiment, we are purged and banished? And since Rocana's program needs to make a back door system to remove his messiahs for deviations, then why is he voting in such defective people as his acharyas in the first place? And isn't his whole system a concoction born out of mental speculation?

Rocana says he has "no confidence" in the people he is voting in as God's successors?

And what happens if for example Rocana's rubber stamped gurus engage in criminal actions, or orchestrate murders and so on? How can this be fixed after the fact? Can Rocana bring the victims back from the dead? Rocana says he wants to start to fix some of the damage being done by his false gurus, really, he can bring people back from the dead? 

And what happens if Rocana's acharyas make some of their female disciples pregnant (as has happened with some of Rocana's voted in gurus). Is he going to pay child support for their babies? And why doesn't Rocana's constitution tell us how all this fallen behavior applies to the parampara? Why doesn't Rocana ever detail exactly how all these matters will be addressed, fixed, and so on, rather he avoids or at least skimps on all these important issues?]

RD: I have given this a great deal of thought over the years, and tried to address the issue properly in the Constitution, which focuses on the most essential points of principle underlying the initiation issue. The Constitution quotes sastra and cites Srila Prabhupada's comments on the subject but even so, the complexity and seeming contradictions make it a challenging subject for devotees.

[PADA: Sorry Rocana, you failed to quote Srila Prabhupada, at all. He never discusses your concoction of "2/3 show of hands" guru voting, and subsequent reformed gurus, deviating gurus, gurus being censured, monitored, removed, excommunicated and so on and so forth. You have not quoted any shastra whatsoever on these issues. 

Worse, none of Rocana's ideas were ever done in the Vaishnava guru tradition. Nor is any of this discussed by Srila Prabhupada or shastra, nor by any previous acharyas. Instead, Srila Prabhupada says ecclessiastical guru voting is bogus and is rejected by the acharyas. For example Rupa Goswami, the acharyas, the shastra, they all reject -- voted in gurus, falling down gurus etc. all these are considered as concocted, manufactured and offensive ideas. 

Moreover the GBC was never designated as the SUPERIOR monitor for the guru, the GBC is supposed to be the subordinate agent of the guru etc. Rocana is the person creating all this complexity and contradiction, when there is normally none.]

RD: Krsna consciousness is a science. It's very practical, and not mysterious. You simply have to try and comprehend your own personal circumstances, and the circumstances we are now trying to make spiritual advancement in. I've touched on this before and it's a recurring theme: that we exist right now in a very unique circumstance relative to the lila of His Divine Grace A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada.

[PADA: Right, and your personal circumstance is that you are placing the the GBC's guru voting, guru censuring (et al.) process into your constitution -- because you are a follower of the GBC's guru system, so your system is a carbon copy of theirs. Sorry you have failed to show where this acharya system was ever followed by the previous acharyas, nor does it make any sense that conditioned beings ever were acharyas in the first place? The whole Rocana program is "rubber stamp of guru."]

Rocana's police cheif of the Guru Resources Committee -- Guru Correctional Committee -- etc. This is the police chief who monitors and arrests Rocana's acharyas? He has not yet arrested Pink Floyd pada? Prahladananda swami also says, in the absence of a pure devotee, anyone can be a diksha guru, even the most neophyte devotees. Again, where is this found in the Vedas, that the most neophyte devotees can be worshiped as "nikunja yuno rati keli siddha" parampara members and accept sins like Jesus? Is this not sahajiya, to make conditioned souls into acharyas?

RD: Who are the pure devotees in ISKCON today that are on the level a bona fide spiritual master must be on, according to sastra? Devotees in ISKCON and in other mathas or situations may have determined that their guru is on that platform, and the leader himself may have indicated that he is indeed on that level, and others are not. 

I'm not going to comment on the individual gurus who are making these claims because in most cases, I have not personally experienced them. I can only go by my own intelligence and by the results I see in the people who have surrendered to these individuals, thinking them to be extremely advanced. And frankly, I'm just not moved or impressed by what I see.

[PADA: Rocana says we need to keep rubber stamping a big bunch of gurus, but he is not impressed with the ones his program has rubber stamped already? This is ALSO the same statement we hear from some of the highest placed people in ISKCON, including sometimes GBC men and gurus, they have confided in PADA over the years, yes, the GBC has many gurus, but personally they would never accept any of them as their own guru. 

So Rocana favors the GBC's guru system FOR OTHERS, so they can be cheated, but he has not been impressed with any of them himself. This is called cheating, You'll have to accept their counterfeit money, but they won't take it themselves. Which is why JAYADVAITA SWAMI writes -- that when it comes to the GBC's gurus its "buyer beware" (same as the fine print of a used car contract).]

RD: The only individuals that most ISKCON devotees accept as being on that advanced platform are the Sampradaya Acaryas, particularly Srila Bhaktivinoda, Srila Bhaktisiddhanta and Srila Bhaktivedanta Thakurs, and acaryas such as Gaura Kishor dasa Babaji and Jagannatha dasa Babaji who they have recognized and classified as being maha-bhagavats.

[PADA: Correct. Rocana's living guru program seems to be dying on the vine more every day, and our idea, to take shelter of the bona fide acharya Srila Prabhupada, is expanding.]

RD: He spared only a few, such as devotees like Arjuna and the Pandavas. Recognizing the true spiritual identities and pastimes of such personalities requires a very high degree of advancement. Similarly, recognizing someone to be on the uttama, madhyama or even ruci platform before accepting them as a diksa guru is a somewhat academic exercise. In a sense, it's even something of a copout. It can be a way to avoid surrendering.

[PADA: Surrendering to whom? Rocana never tells us who this person is? Is this not a cop out? Fine, we should surrender to a person who is claiming to be a mahabhagavata in ISKCON, because if we do not this is "a cop out"? Meanwhile, Rocana has already copped out, he has no confidence in the people he is promoting as maha bhagavatas and gurus in current ISKCON? 

We should not engage in the "academic exercise" of discriminating who is a guru, because this is a cop out, a way of avoiding surrender. This is blind following then? Meanwhile Rocana himself is "not impressed" with the current crop of alleged maha bhagavatas. Read: OTHERS should NOT discriminate, others should just surrender and not be a cop out, whereas ONLY Rocana is allowed to discriminate, and he is "not impressed" with the current crop of gurus ISKCON is offering. We are not allowed to think, only Rocana is?   

Apart from that, should not the senior devotees conduct the "academic exercise" of determining who is the maha bhagavata, instead of leaving this to the brand new bhaktas -- which Rocana says is the process in his constitution? The brand new guys off the street get to determine who is the acharya, not the senior devotees. How is that working out?]

What, me worry?

RD: Since the time I became a devotee -- and I think this applies to almost everyone -- we are always imagining or hoping that Krsna consciousness is a lot easier than it actually is. We were looking for excuses, really, to not surrender. We wanted to maintain the hope that, if I don't really surrender to what I know I have to surrender to, then I'm still going to make spiritual advancement… Krsna consciousness is just so easy. Just chant Hare Krsna and take prasada. In the early days we thought we'd just eat our way back to Godhead, but in due course we found that really wasn't the case.
Prasada certainly got us off eating other non-offered foodstuffs, but then we had to go on to the next level. 

[PADA: Except Rocana says we should have no more prasadam? He says we cannot have initiated brahmanas anymore, because there is no longer a system to initiate them? Worse, he has created a system where ISKCON people are offering their bhogha to Rocana's illicit sex gurus, and that means their prasadam is not at all prasadam, it is now contaminated by offering bhogha to illicit sex debauchees. 

His bhogha now has the qualities of illicit behavior by offering it to deviants. This is the same reason the Satanists offer their food to Satan, it takes on the qualities of Satan. Why does Rocana think that offering bhogha to kanisthas, illicit sex gurus, or even mini-Satan's, is now prasadam? Rocana does not even know what prasadam is? Its bhogha that is EXCLUSIVELY offered to the pure devotee.] 

RD: You had to chant the Holy Names, and so on, and chant attentively, without offenses. You found out how difficult that actually was, being totally absorbed in chanting even 16 rounds. And then maintaining the sadhana, the principles, etc. Everything sounds simple.  

[PADA: Right, Rocana's messiahs have even been "censured" for "not chanting their rounds." Rocana cannot even promote basic level sadhakas as his gurus.]

RD: So what to do, if you find yourself in the circumstance of looking for a guru in ISKCON today? Or if you're one of the many ISKCON devotees who've decided that your guru isn't qualified, or that it's almost dangerous to follow them if one wants to make spiritual advancement?

[PADA: Wow! Rocana admits that following his voted in gurus can be dangerous! Yes, the false gurus go to the lower regions -- and so do their followers! And so do their supporters (OK Rocana). This is also another admission from ROCANA, most of his gurus are no longer accepted as gurus by MANY / most of the people in ISKCON because they are not qualified to be gurus! Why does Rocana keep insisting people have to accept his gurus, when he knows already that many (ok most) people in ISKCON doubt the qualification of his gurus, hence the temples are almost empty?] 

RD: Well, it varies from individual to individual, but we all know that every day, if we just sit down and think of all the things we should or could be surrendering to that are available - chanting the Holy Names is always available, and the philosophy as it's expounded by all the Acaryas is available to be read and studied.

[PADA: Unforunately as soon as someone concludes that Rocana's voted in debauchee guru program is bogus, one is then banned, beaten, and maybe killed for opposing Rocana's dangerous personality guru cults. Its pretty amazing that Rocana admits he is creating "dangerous" personality guru cults that ban, beat, molest and kill others. Instead of fixing this problem by worshiping the pure devotee, Rocana tells us to "just chant and be happy" -- sort of like Bhajahari Murphy's program, just mellow out and chant -- as you and your friends are banned, beat, molested, and assassinated! And this instruction is the message of -- the Bhagavad Gita?]  

RD: The opportunity to follow the sadhana program is always there… one can always be stricter, more attentive, more offenseless, regardless of whatever else your mind comes up with as being an impediment, such as not finding a qualified guru, or having an unqualified guru.

[PADA: Wrong! People who do not worship Rocana's bogus gurus are often shunned, banned, removed and exiled -- where they most likely have to work long hours at "karmi" jobs. Then they no longer have facility for chanting, deity worship, harinama etc. One ex-kuli (who was one of the first to be initiated by Srila Prabhupada) says, nowadays he pretty much only has time to chant ONE round a day, because then he has to scoot off to work long hours in a karmi job. Sorry, making these false gurus destroys the INFRASTRUCTURE of chanting established by the acharya.] 

RD: As Caitanya das also recently mentioned, caitya-guru is always there within the heart, and He will surely put you together with a more qualified personality as to serve as your guru, when you're ready. When you are in that kind of need, it will be satisfied spiritually.

[PADA: That is not what happened in the Gaudiya Matha? Their false gurus kicked almost everyone out, and then the mission was stunted and even halted, and many of the Gaudiya followers ended up "sitting in tea shops reading newspapers." Rocana keeps giving us a post dated check that someday he will manifest the real Mc Coy guru, but we never see that happening? Meanwhile the ISKCON program deteriorates monkeying around with a pile of voted in gurus from the Rocana program, who are siphoning off the little bit of assets left.] 

RD: So getting upset about not having the right association with qualified gurus in ISKCON is somewhat beside the point. For the most part, they don't have asramas where their disciples can come live and associate with them.

[PADA: Good point, Rocana's program has destroyed the temple ashram program by removing all the devotees who were managing these programs. A new bhakta wrote to tell us his temple has no one there to train him, he is pretty much wandering around the building on his own all day long, its a ghost town. The temple president shows up for an hour once in awhile, the program is essentially dead. He says he is going to go out and get a job now because he does not feel secure in this situation.]

RD: We see most of the gurus are not surrendered to following the footsteps of Srila Prabhupada. They are also trying to take the easy way out. They are trying to pretend to themselves that going to meetings, Ratha yatras and events is more important than just preaching and having their disciples become pure, blissful and enthusiastic to spread Krsna consciousness. That's the sign of how advanced the gurus are.

[PADA: Right, Rocana's gurus have kicked out the preachers and harinama devotees and replaced that with "attending meetings." They have become mundane managers, of course Satsvarupa was living at Howard Johnson motels watching TV and having an affair with his therapist, and we all had to leave so this program could be facilitated.]

RD: We didn't appreciate Srila Prabhupada for being as advanced as he was, and that's true of thousands of disciples around the world. In fact, thousands of them gave Srila Prabhupada up… this golden opportunity, this inconceivable mercy was casually discarded.

[PADA: Most of the original devotees were purged out by Rocana's bogus gurus. Hansadutta's temple had only three Prabhupada devotees left by 1984, one was gay, one was a bank robber, and the other was -- Hansadutta. The Rocana living gurus removed the Prabhupada devotees. They did not give up on Prabhupada, they were forcibly exiled from his movement by Rocana's living gurus.]

RD: And among those who are Srila Prabhupada's disciples and are actively trying to be Krsna consciousness, many or most of them are struggling just to fulfill the basics of what Srila Prabhupada introduced. So we all really have no excuse. We have to try to purge from our consciousness this whole notion that Krsna consciousness is easy, or you can do it casually, or you can do it part-time, or you can do it when you're older. That's just the mind, it's Maya playing tricks on us. The fact is that it is the most serious, the most important, the most significant aspect of our life, and it requires day-to-day surrender. We have to follow… and when we're working on the Constitution and preaching, we have to repeat what we've heard from sastra in terms of the Spiritual Master being on a particular level.

[PADA: Rocana is simply promoting the GBC's guru constitution program, which is what has made the temples empty.] 

RD: The whole concept of religiosity, and Krsna consciousness becoming a religion instead of a spiritual movement, is all based on this same principle -- it's just laziness. These leaders, who I don't envy in the least, cannot surrender. They cannot become pure enough to qualify to be leaders of a spiritual movement. They don't motivate people. They can't maintain constantly a high level of consciousness.

[PADA: Great so Rocana is voting in people who are lazy, lack leadership, and cannot motivate others. Why is he voting these people in as his gurus? And when we start a program in Vancouver that is doing great, and its motivating people to hear and chant, Rocana shuns our program and says we are worshiping a post mortem person (Srila Prabhupada). He does not start any program, he just attacks ours.]

RD: So instead, an institution provides them with an opportunity to just accept a position: 'I'm a GBC, or I'm a Sannyasi, or I'm a Guru'. And therefore, just based on the fact that I'm in this institution, I've been approved, I've been sanctioned, I've been recognized as being advanced because I hold this position. And therefore, you are obliged, according to sastra, to treat me in a certain reverential way, with adoration and respect. You're supposed to believe everything I say is true, and hold my every word sacred, and serve me very nicely. That's what religions provide.

[PADA: Right Rocana's program is a mundane program making a mundane position for mundane people.]

RD: The sastra, whether it's the pastimes of Lord Caitanya Mahaprabhu and His associates fromCaitanya-caritamrta or Chaitanya Bhagavat, gives us so many examples of how real advanced devotees avoid at all costs being put in such positions. They avoid being in a position where people are worshipping them. The most golden rule, the most highly sought after principle of Krsna consciousness is trinad api sunichena… humble as the straw in the street. How is that possible when you're not actually, internally absorbed in that consciousness and people are constantly worshiping you?

[PADA: Good point. Rocana ALREADY knows that placing his first wave of neophytes into Vyasa seats made most of them go crazy with ego, money, women, power, followers and so on. Sridhara Maharaja himself said that, his acharyas are going mad after money, women and followers. 

And that is why Rocana wants to vote in many more false acharyas, so he can see more of his voted in gurus falling into major tail spins, bad publicity, and all the associated banning, beating, and murders etc. going on with his first wave of messiahs -- which is what he already created by his support of his first wave of gurus. He wants more of the same madness and associated bad publicity for ISKCON, and he knows his bogus guru program is creating this program in spades.]

RD: So this is the phenomenon, as I see it. I hope someday I will be able to associate with and appreciate, and recognize someone on the highest level of Krsna consciousness, other than recognizing and appreciating the great Acaryas who are clearly identified by Krsna as being on that level. In the meantime, whether or not there's someone present on this planet who is qualified, and who, due to my neophyte nature and lack of surrender I simply don't recognize, that's another story. That may be my own suffering and inability, lack of surrender. But that's my situation.

I can honestly say that I haven't been travelling around the world from matha to matha. I haven't spent my time and money doing that, searching for qualified diksa gurus.

[PADA: Oh great, Rocana wants us to vote in a bunch of gurus -- using his 2/3 show of hands vote process -- to be the acharyas of ISKCON, but he has not even bothered yet to see if anyone is actually qualified to be voted into that post? "I want you to vote in my jewelry as top most diamonds, but I have never tried to figure out if I only have colored glass or actual diamonds to sell"? Rocana insists on making many more guru with his guru voting program, but he has no interest in seeing if anyone is a guru in the first place! Then, when people are suffering from his cheating, he blames the victims, you wanted to be cheated. Nope, you set us a false guru voting program and you cheated us!] 

RD: I do what I'm doing… preaching through the Sampradaya Sun and writing, and supporting myself. I have not initiated disciples, but am instead trying to live as simple a life as I can, without distractions. But I do have faith that if such an advanced personality exists, and caitya-guruwishes to give me the blessing of associating with such a devotee, then He'll arrange it. And hopefully I'll be capable of surrendering to it when He does. But in the meantime, we have to live our day-do-day lives. Every day, we have to try to find the time and energy, enthusiasm and focus to do what we know, clearly, without any ambiguity or mental agitation, we are supposed to do. We've got to do these things for Krsna, for Srila Prabhupada.

[PADA: Right, Rocana's day to day life is to write a constitution that says exactly what the bogus GBC says, we need more of his dangerous voted in hokey illicit sex acharyas, which are banning, beating, molesting and assassinating the vaishnavas, and saying that our worship of the pure devotee is the posthumous, post mortem program. 

Rocana just cannot face the fact that his living gurus program has ruined his guru's mission and his hands are full of the karma of promoting this program. He is in denial about the Frankenstein monster he has co-created. Rocana was one of the biggest cheer leaders of the GBC gurus after 1977, then he was their 1986 guru reformer, which simply spread the guru disease by voting in over a hundred more. This is his co-creation, and now that his bogus voted in messiah's program has ruined / is still ruining ISKCON, he is perplexed how to fix his creation, which he himself says -- is dangerous. 

ys pd]

No comments:

Post a Comment

Note: Only a member of this blog may post a comment.