Arjuna’s name not in the list of disciplic succession.
R. Dasa, India:
Dear Bhakta Dasa and Gurukripa prabhus, Hare Krishna. Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
I came to Krishna Consciousness at age 15 in 1975, and was 17 when I joined the nearest Temple, a couple of hours drive away. Then I ended up staying at the Vrindavan Krishna Balaram Temple in the fall of ’77, when I got to see Srila Prabhupada. While there I got to see you, Gurukrpa prabhu, and really admired you and your band of men. I am not sure all the stories about you were true, but we pretty much thought of you being like a transcendental Robin Hood.
Anyway, I really appreciated someone like you speaking up about the (mis)leadership and what happened. I left ISKCON after Srila Prabhupada’s antya lila and had a preaching center for a few years, but mostly just preaching to my parents over the years. They have, as have I, noticed that many things are wrong in the state of affairs: repeated scandals, book changes, poor circulation of BTG, sannyasis condoning homosexuality /crazy artwork / watching sports / rubber stamped gurus / so-called devotees (female and male) criticizing Srila Prabhupada — AND NO ONE (in the institution) CORRECTS THEM, etc.
Now, here is my concern: when Srila Prabhupada was on this planet, he agreed to initiate people without meeting them, and simply on the basis of the recommendation of his senior disciples. PLEASE NOTE THAT THESE DEVOTEES WHO GOT INITIATED IN THIS MANNER NEVER HAD THE FORTUNE OF HAVING SRILA PRABHUPADA COOK FOR THEM, OR RIDE IN THE SAME CAR, OR ANY PHYSICAL INTERACTION.
Then just a few months (four) before departing, he agreed to formalize the ritvik system and never placed a time restriction on that. Sure, he wanted his disciples to be gurus, but that doesn’t mean they have to become diksa gurus, at least not inside the institution he founded. For example, in the Bhagavad-gita As It Is, Srila Prabhupada states in the introduction:
“…Here the Lord clearly tells Arjuna that He is making him the first receiver of a new parampara (disciplic succession) because the old succession was broken. It was the Lord’s wish, therefore, to establish another parampara in the same line of thought that was coming down from the sun-god to others, and it was His wish that His teaching be distributed anew by Arjuna. He wanted Arjuna to become the authority ….”
Even though it is stated that the Lord wanted to make Arjuna the first receiver of a new parampara, and an “authority”, we never find Arjuna’s name in the list of disciplic succession. In other words, one can still be guru / authority in the parampara, without becoming a diksa guru.
Now in the case of my parents, they do not have absolute faith in anyone except Srila Prabhupada. SO, IF PEOPLE IN THE PAST COULD GET INITIATED FROM SRILA PRABHUPADA WITHOUT MEETING HIM, WHY SHOULD WE DEPRIVE PEOPLE LIKE MY PARENTS FROM THE SAME OPPORTUNITY?
After all, as Srila Prabhupada himself said, the real initiation is in the heart, and the ceremony is just a formality. He also told V… prabhu that just by reading his books, people are initiated. Even IF the ritvik system goes against tradition (and that is very debatable), why deprive people in Kali yuga from getting initiated by the greatest Acarya ever known in the history of Vaishnavism, who carried the seeds of bhakti across the globe, and whose appearance was predicted in the scriptures?
Did not Ramanujacarya, out of compassion, go up on the roof and start shouting out the mantra that could liberate the common man, even though he was told not to do so?
Sincerely, R Dasa
R. Dasa, India:
Dear Bhakta Dasa and Gurukripa prabhus, Hare Krishna. Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada.
I came to Krishna Consciousness at age 15 in 1975, and was 17 when I joined the nearest Temple, a couple of hours drive away. Then I ended up staying at the Vrindavan Krishna Balaram Temple in the fall of ’77, when I got to see Srila Prabhupada. While there I got to see you, Gurukrpa prabhu, and really admired you and your band of men. I am not sure all the stories about you were true, but we pretty much thought of you being like a transcendental Robin Hood.
Anyway, I really appreciated someone like you speaking up about the (mis)leadership and what happened. I left ISKCON after Srila Prabhupada’s antya lila and had a preaching center for a few years, but mostly just preaching to my parents over the years. They have, as have I, noticed that many things are wrong in the state of affairs: repeated scandals, book changes, poor circulation of BTG, sannyasis condoning homosexuality /crazy artwork / watching sports / rubber stamped gurus / so-called devotees (female and male) criticizing Srila Prabhupada — AND NO ONE (in the institution) CORRECTS THEM, etc.
Now, here is my concern: when Srila Prabhupada was on this planet, he agreed to initiate people without meeting them, and simply on the basis of the recommendation of his senior disciples. PLEASE NOTE THAT THESE DEVOTEES WHO GOT INITIATED IN THIS MANNER NEVER HAD THE FORTUNE OF HAVING SRILA PRABHUPADA COOK FOR THEM, OR RIDE IN THE SAME CAR, OR ANY PHYSICAL INTERACTION.
Then just a few months (four) before departing, he agreed to formalize the ritvik system and never placed a time restriction on that. Sure, he wanted his disciples to be gurus, but that doesn’t mean they have to become diksa gurus, at least not inside the institution he founded. For example, in the Bhagavad-gita As It Is, Srila Prabhupada states in the introduction:
“…Here the Lord clearly tells Arjuna that He is making him the first receiver of a new parampara (disciplic succession) because the old succession was broken. It was the Lord’s wish, therefore, to establish another parampara in the same line of thought that was coming down from the sun-god to others, and it was His wish that His teaching be distributed anew by Arjuna. He wanted Arjuna to become the authority ….”
Even though it is stated that the Lord wanted to make Arjuna the first receiver of a new parampara, and an “authority”, we never find Arjuna’s name in the list of disciplic succession. In other words, one can still be guru / authority in the parampara, without becoming a diksa guru.
Now in the case of my parents, they do not have absolute faith in anyone except Srila Prabhupada. SO, IF PEOPLE IN THE PAST COULD GET INITIATED FROM SRILA PRABHUPADA WITHOUT MEETING HIM, WHY SHOULD WE DEPRIVE PEOPLE LIKE MY PARENTS FROM THE SAME OPPORTUNITY?
After all, as Srila Prabhupada himself said, the real initiation is in the heart, and the ceremony is just a formality. He also told V… prabhu that just by reading his books, people are initiated. Even IF the ritvik system goes against tradition (and that is very debatable), why deprive people in Kali yuga from getting initiated by the greatest Acarya ever known in the history of Vaishnavism, who carried the seeds of bhakti across the globe, and whose appearance was predicted in the scriptures?
Did not Ramanujacarya, out of compassion, go up on the roof and start shouting out the mantra that could liberate the common man, even though he was told not to do so?
Sincerely, R Dasa
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