pada -- angel108b@yahoo.com
Svarga's program
Laxmimoni in white, bald, center.
Akuti, far right, in rust-colored shirt, sitting on steps.
Svarga next to her in harinama chaddar.
Sesa's wife in pink on steps with cardigan.
Shara Watson leaning on Sesa's wife, Madhumati.
From top center, Syamamayi, Mahamaya, Rucira, Vegavati between Laxmimoni and Rucira.
D Dasi Please feel free to add in any names I've omitted.
D Dasi Please feel free to add in any names I've omitted.
SD: Kirtida, top row in blue.
Is this the Svarga mentioned in another post connected to abuse of students? Apparently there are two Svargas, just trying to discern who's who.
D Dasi: Apparently it's the same Svarga who severely mistreated children.
SD: This Svarga is the same woman that made my life ... and the lives of other children ... HELL in Dallas Gurukul. Her name is Swarga and she was my ashram teacher in Dallas. She doesn't deserve be teacher or a parent. But KARMA will definitely take care of her!!!!!!
'She [Svarga] used to beat me and lock me in the boiler room which was covered in fiberglass insulation and made me sleep there all night. When my mom first left me there ... she left me with all our family pictures and letters and Swarga tore them up and threw them away.
AD: Wow. So sad to read this. Have you reported her to the Child Protection Office ISKCON North America? Were you the only one that she beat? Do you know if anyone else will speak up against her?
Rucira Devi Dasi: Do you now tell all of us who we have friendship with? As far as I am concerned these three days were very Krsna conscious and she is a good friend of mine. It was a women’s retreat, private! You making offenses will not help you in your Krsna consciousness.
If I felt like our movement was moving toward managing our lives right down to our friends I would have to leave. Please for your own sake, I know you mean well but so did Prthu maharaja when he was doing his 100 yajnas for the sake of his citizens. But when Lord Brahma asked him to stop for a higher purpose he did. Please read this part of the Bhagavatam and consider your actions.
I would be glad to personally speak to you on this matter.
PADA: Thanks but you ISKCON guys have known about PADA's complaining about the child abuse process all along. And your eternal pal Adikarta tells people I am making lies and exaggerations. Umm no, your program really beats and rapes children.
If you wanted to talk to me personally, you would have decades ago. Adikarta ilk says that there are no examples of worshiping pure devotees found in shastra, so he has a pocketful of illicit sex with men, women and children deviants for your children to worship instead. Then they make pretend they have no idea why there has been a mass child molesting process. Worshiping a child beater and anal reconstructive surgery epidemic program will produce more of same, that is simple common sense. And Rucira and Adikarta ilk have been enablers, apologists and cheer leaders for that regime the whole time.
D Dasi: Rucira Devi Dasi you're obviously welcome to be friends with whomever you like. We're eternally individual spirit souls with our own particular likes and dislikes. When the friendship with an inveterate abuser is glorified in a public space, however, it naturally invites a response which may not always be to one's liking. May I ask: Did you ever think to question the hurtful actions towards our Vaikuntha children of your good friend, in public or in private?
Are you comparing yourself to Lord Brahma, instructing me to keep quiet for a higher purpose and if so, what is that higher purpose? Perhaps we could start there.
PADA: Yep, heard this thousands of times. Who are you to object to our mass child beating and children rapes program? You are an offender, and if you don't watch out, we will have you killed -- just like we had Sulochana and others killed. And the Rucira program killed Sulochana and would have killed me if the FBI had not come to my assistance.
The FBI said to me "you were hours away from getting taken to your grave." So you guys mistreat everyone, not only children. Anyone who objects to your child beatings and child rapes program, can end up dead. Yeah, we all know who your friends are and what their agenda is.
Rucira Devi Dasi: Do you personally know any of these women or any of the Vaikuntha children that you are talking about?
PADA: Yep, we know hundreds -- perhaps thousands -- of ex-ISKCON Vaikuntha children who avoid ISKCON like the plague to avoid Rucira's child beating and rapes process. Some of them eat meat, some of them hate Krishna, and -- who could blame them after they were mistreated so badly by the Adikarta and Rucira process of worship of homosexuals, pedophiles and child beaters messiah's program? Of course, again -- same program also kills dissenters and would have killed me without FBI intervention.
Rucira Devi Dasi: I am not instructing you to do anything other than to read our scriptures and try to do a little introspection on your own. I am not so proud as to think that I know everything. I personally do know a lot of these young women and have talked with them. This material world is not black and white. I do not mind at all if you want to drag my name through the mud, but I have problems with you doing this to any of my God sisters who have done and continue to do more service to Srila Prabhupada than I can ever dream to do.
PADA: Being cheer leaders for a child beating and child rape bogus guru cult is not "serving Krishna." And to say it is, misrepresents Krishna, which is why some of your victims hate Hare Krishna. You false propaganda is causing people to hate Krishna.
Rucira Devi Dasi: Whatever brings you closer to your eternal relationship with the lord please continue.
PADA: Umm, yep, making a child beating and child rapes program, which bans, beats, sues and kills dissenters, is going to bring you closer to the Lord. Who knew!
CF: You didn’t answer her question Did you / do you ever think about the children she abused? Has she ever demonstrated accountability for what she did to these children to you and others you know? And let me add my main question: is your own bliss more important than accountability and repair for the children who were abused by her?
DK: Laxmi Moni did make some written apologies to some of her victims so yes, she took some responsibility. I think the main problem is that this picture should not have been made public and been kept in a private collection for those who appreciated the retreat.. LM should warn her friends , where ever she goes to not publish pics that include her, just as a thoughtful gesture to the victims.
PADA: Why would anyone want to have a private / or public festival to glorify child mistreatment folks like Laxmi Moni and Svarga and others in any case? And someone complained that a GBC site requires you to sign up to see the content. What is the big need to hide things -- unless you have something to hide? OK the fact you are cheer leaders for a child beating and child rapes regime is something you want hidden. That means -- you are ashamed to show your faces because you know your program will be considered demoniac.
AD: Rucira Devi Dasi you are asking that DD reconsider the repercussions of her actions... Have you ever stopped to consider the unintended consequences for the victims, when you choose to show friendship, comradery, support and endorsement to known child abusers? Do you think they feel offended? How do Laxmimoni's victims feel when they see photos of you lovingly hugging their tormenter?
Have you stopped to think about what are the wider societal implications when you "senior devotees" act as if the abuse of Vaishnava children is not a big deal? You can act as you wish, but your actions have consequences.
DK: Rucira Devi Dasi ... some pictures are meant to be kept in private collections.
Rucira Devi Dasi: I didn’t post it, but you are right!
PADA: Yep, sweep all the child beatings and rapes process under the carpet, and ban, beat, sue and kill dissenters and voila, the problem will go away.
MJ: Rucira Devi Dasi ... it is already not private.
SSD: What is the point of this post? It just lists names of devotees including Laxmimoni who had a CPO case and judgement. Are they breaking any CPO stipulations?
D Dasi: I'm not sure whether they're breaking any CPO regulations as I'm not an expert in Iskcon law. However, in my opinion what they are doing is glorifying a woman who by her words and deeds systematically destroyed the emotional and spiritual lives of a generation of vaishnavi children.
Is openly being friends with Ghislaine Maxwell and praising her in public breaking any laws? Maybe not. Is it morally acceptable? You be the judge of that.
DK: Victims are revictimized when their abusers are publicly glorified. Even if these ladies had their gathering together privately no problem. The mistake in my eyes it to make it public. I think most victims would be satisfied if their abusers would go to the forest and live out their lives in quiet solitude.
But seeing them publicly honored only reopens the abused child's wound.
PADA: Yeah but it is good that we know that they support the child beaters and child rapers program, so we can warn others about these folks.
CF: If I can add this: I understand the discomfort with names being named. I don’t think it’s the best strategy in this case. But why is there so much intensity in the particular group? I teach my students in my Social Justice class that reconciliation of harm does not happen without the attempt to repair that harm.
Reconciliation without reparation is not actual reconciliation. If anything it just perpetuates the harm that has already occurred and creates new harm. The people in this group, myself included, are deeply heartbroken and frustrated when we see so many devotees either unaware of the harm that devotees like Laxmimoni have caused or want to gloss it over in the name of forgiveness.
For example, were the devotees at the Bhakti Center aware of Dhanurdhara Swami’s horrific record of abuse before they gave him a prominent platform within that community? If they didn’t know, to an extent that’s understandable. To their credit they have backed off associating publicly with him.
But if they did know, did they decide to forgive and forget so they could take whatever they wanted from his association? Did they forgive and forget so he could take as much benefit as possible from being associated with one of the most “progressive” temples in the USA? I lived in New Vrindavan for a few years. I could definitely sense there was a desire to forget what happened in the 1980’s.
I wouldn’t say there was a lot of forgiveness. What happened there was perhaps the worst, most cult-ish manifestation of KC. People that some of us took initiation of can be credibly accused of enabling and supporting murder along with the various other crimes people were charged with. Has there ever actually been any repair of the damage that happened there?
People like myself do find out what their gurus were up to then. It’s not a secret. It causes serious loss of faith. But it’s always very easily glossed over so the bliss keeps flowing. And that’s the issue we have. What right do you have to your own bliss when so many people have suffered because of the people you are taking your bliss from?
It is REALLY REALLY EASY to forgive and forget and justify it to yourself that your not being “offensive” like all the rabble-rousers in this group. But your not better. We’re not trying to be better than you either. People have been SERIOUSLY harmed and exploited and continue to be harmed and exploited within devotee communities.
We are asking for accountability. We are asking for awareness. We are asking for a commitment to REPAIR If you’re going to look the other way you’re going to have to face your own complicity at some point. It is not something you can avoid.
S Dasi: Agree. Question: how much repair / reconciliation before there is forgiveness, forgiveness from the individuals and the community? Personally, I would think that, if they were serious, they would make it their life's work, not just lip service.
D Dasi: Thank you for articulating this so much better than I could.
PADA: Many of the ex-kulis around here tell me -- no one knows who we are, where we are, what our circumstances are, whether we were harmed in their gurukula or not, whether the treatment we got makes severe problems of dysfunction for us now, or even -- if we are alive or dead. They did not care for us then, and they don't care now.
They only care about themselves and their false "feel good" society, and that is all they ever cared about. We victims are merely justified collateral damage for the "greater good" of making their false society. If the victims are not even being consulted, acknowledged, or approached in person begging for forgiveness, and maybe given some compensation, then where is the remorse?
Did I forget to mention -- a lot of these ilk were angry and upset we made the lawsuit? ys pd
S Dasi: Very well said! Sadhu sadhu.
SF: I think large number of ISKCON devotees still, and majority old school ones, think it is a very positive thing NOT to be updated. Not to be in touch with secular society's reality. Our senior ladies -- as in any religion -- often tend to be set in their ways -- with narrow -- isolated focus that they are simply incapable of changing - so late in their life. Seniors do have trouble keeping up with drastic changes. Including new ISKCON 's long overdue whistle-blowing mood. All this evolvement and change can cause great distress to people in their old age.
It's sad, but maybe they should be left alone, in their clinging to preserve their old status - quo reality. As especially lately, I noticed so many of them are not interested in finding out what is all the new fuss about. They seemingly even more than before do not want to find out truth about their "sisters in arms " from early days.
(Or they simply cannot cope with all those layers of nice laquer being stripped off of these ersatz saintly - "Vaisnavis sangha" they considered astheir frends and role models all off their lives).
I choose to. attribute the mass indifference of cadre to suffering their best friends caused -- partially to their advanced age. The seniors might interpret any attempts to change as - malice. Especially if they already have some age related impairment issues. I 'm speaking from experience. Even when we want to introduce change for the better - the change itself might scare people of senior age with age related cognitive impairment.
Even some of younger generation of ISKCON, as they probably learned by example, tend to believe the best mood IS to be out of touch. Sadly, that includes some very important moral and ethical updated standards. Including what makes them - having abusers amongst their besties and old compatriots they cannot part with.
But, I think everyone who lived more then 15 years in Alachua probably could cope with comparing just few basic facts and names. Just juxtapose the fact that Laxmimoni operated and was endorsed buy Alachua Temple AUTHORITIES all these years, in couple of different different important roles.
While simultaneously Gurus, Swamis, living and those who left us (not fallen) but passed away -- who did NOT harm children in any way -- nor were ever accused of doing so -- either were, or despite softening, still are regarded in exact same community - Alachua as "persona non grata". I think everyone who can bring themselves to be fully honest can recall examples, over the years, and name at least two Swamis, including those from very different sides of ISKCON 's political spectrum, who were "persona non grata" in Alachua.
Including culmination of animosity in officially written proclamations -full on bans that largely resembled restraining order; for.one of them (And while at it, simultaneously, those with actual admitting of pedophilia accusation who manage to evade Americans Laws for years such as LS ; also certain other Swamis with increasing erratic behavior, some known to have mental health-behavioral problems; as well as quite a few of Vaisnavas with "softer "history of accusation of "intereferences" with youth and women; even those on actual local State's SEX OFFENDER list; including female sex offenders; their kind was usually welcomed in Alachua.
I used to see some of them regularly in Temple in Alachua.
PADA: Umm, yep, Alachua is where they circled the wagons to hold on for the last battle, hee hee.
S Das: Knowing what so many of my God siblings and their children know about this whole matter and what has been said and left unsaid. I appreciate everyone speaking publicly and showing exactly where they stand. DS, what more could we ask for?
PADA: We really have not learned much in all this time have we? When one victim here saw one of the abusers being glorified at a West Coast temple, he went home and took his own life. The same people involved in that process were still glorifying the same abuser at another festival later on. That is why there are so many victims around here in the Bay Area who say, "they did not care about us then, and they do not care about us now."
And neither would I agree that glorifying abusers is "serving Krishna." It does not matter what the CPO ruling is or is not, we have to start to have more sympathy for the victims than the victimizers, or we have not made any progress. Did I forget to mention -- no small amount of "senior Vaishnava women" were on the side of the GBC's leaders -- making glares at me when I helped make the lawsuit. They were clearly upset that their regime was being challenged.
And even the local LAPD law enforcement used to pull me over on my bike, "if you value your life, do not go near Watseksa, don't you know what they did to your friend a few blocks from here?" Well yep, in fact I do know how their club operates. We should not need a CPO ruling to make us follow right from wrong. But yeah, it is a club and that is how come all this has been going on for decades, it is a mutual assistance association, and has been all along. The good ole boys club, and their good ole girls cheer leader's club. And that is why many victims are so traumatized and feeling like "no one cares," because the victims are right, they didn't care then -- and still don't care now, self evident. ys pd
DK: Right. Victims are being continually revictimized when their abusers are publicly glorified. Even if these ladies had their gathering together privately no problem. The mistake in my eyes it to make it public.
PADA: Why should we not know who are the cheer leader people behind the whole child abuse process for decades? Let us know who they are publicly.
DK: I think most victims would be satisfied if their abusers would go to the forest and live out their lives in quiet solitude. But seeing them publicly honored only reopens the abused child's wound.
SRD: I agree! There is something particularly disrespectful about the public flaunting of these friendships, essentially conveying the message that the pain of these children is not as important as their desire to tell the world that they're having a great time hanging out.
EB: I know that the one in white and rusty colour both came to Myanmar and were received as celebrities because they didn't know what these women have done to the kids. They are bringing in people ignorant of their past actions.
MM: What is the approximate date of this photo?
SD: 'Shara Watson is with Rucira Devi Dasi and 4 others. September 28 at 3:16 PM … feel so grateful to be able to be a part of this sanga. These women are my heroes! It is, as Rucira Devi Dasi calls it, the "Eat Treats Retreat"'
MM: I know that those ‘mataji’s’ are good and sincere souls. I just wonder if Murlivadika came to Alachua ,how they’d react if a bunch of men hung out with him and looked so blissed out to be in his association.
AD: It's amazing how difficult it is for people to empathize and really understand the suffering of others...Especially when it demands that we give up something we like. When IDS was galvanizing around the world, parading Dharmatma as his good friend, many ladies flipped out and took immediate and decisive actions to put an end to IDS's public endorsement of a known sex offender... But when they're the ones doing the same, we'll then they ask you to stop making offences and read some more Bhagavatam...
PADA: They empathize with the child beating and rapes project and not the victims.
