Krishna Kirtan Dasa: Addressing Hypocrisy 02 28 24 (ISKCON)

Krishna Kirtan dasa:

So you want to address hypocrisy? Might as well. It is indeed hard to deal with hypocrisy, so perhaps I can share the following.

I remember being involved one night in an intense spontaneous debate (it was somewhat civilized but very intense) somewhere in 1997 / 98 in someone’s apartment in Alachua, just around when the multimillion dollar lawsuit was taking off. The famous and known Minister of Education of ISKCON, Jagadish, was also present.

ABC News had just aired (or was about to air) that famous documentary on the subject, and Jagadish himself was one of the main persons interviewed in the documentary as a supporter of the lawsuit, criticizing ISKCON and putting blame not only on the organization ISKCON, but including direct blame onto Srila Prabhupada.

It was a heated debate with good points brought forward from both sides. There were many present; and it went on for quite sometime. Jagadish was present, was asked to speak, and he spoke. Pretty much the same rhetoric that was presented on the ABC documentary, heavier.

That night Jagadish himself was then trying to make a case against none other than Srila Prabhupada himself: how all the abuse was ultimately Srila Prabhupada’s fault for having created such an institution where the abuse occurred, and so on. [I hope he repented some of what he said.]

Myself being so young (20 at the time), it was hard to deal with so many emotions and attention. Most were in favor of the lawsuit and others were quiet. I remember there were quite a few people present. But I do remember managing to land the following argument:

EVEN if Srila Prabhupada was guilty of anything indirectly (or directly – prove it!), most of the abuse actually occurred AFTER Srila Prabhupada departed. Well, since Jagadish was himself the Minister of Education during these after years, by pure logical reasoning he ought to take AT LEAST 50% of the responsibility for the criminal events against the children, therefore making him not eligible to even speak at all on the subject, what to speak of being the chosen one to appear on nation wide Television on prime-time to represent the case against ISKCON.

To my surprise then, when I said that he appeared shocked and he actually agreed with the logic without saying anything else, and remained quiet for the rest of the night with nothing else to say after that. It had been the first time I had actually voiced my opinion on the subject and stopped someone of that stature on his tracks.

Please kindly don’t tell me about hypocrisy, Tim Lee. Remember that I am also one of those who suffered at the hands of incompetent Gurukula teachers.


PADA: Yes, we already agreed to that -- you and probably 2,000 other kids suffered at the hands of the gurukula, and then nearly none of the leaders or your parents ever reported any of it to the authorities. Even up to the present day. So that naturally makes the blame shift to the institution, or the founder of the institution. So yes, we already agreed, so many kids were molested, then 99% percent of the leaders and parents were silent, and that shifted the entire blame to the institution.

I already agreed to that a long time ago? You and many others were mistreated, and almost zero percent of the parents reported the issue. And Prahlad's friend Sanat said -- he too knew all of the kids in his Satsvarupa school were molested, and he did not report it to the authorities or even the parents. He should have had Satsvarupa arrested for running that operation, criminal negligence, but he wanted to defend the mother church, and his pedo cult guru. 

And then the parents told their kids "we are just following Prabhupada," by doing nothing about all the abuse. And that is how the elders trained their children to believe Prabhupada is to blame. We agreed to all this long ago? You gurukulis could have also made your own class action many years before all the suicides started, but none of you ever did. Even when we reported the suicides, none of you did anything. None of you did anything subsequently to the present. 

All I can say about myself is that I have interest in actual truth, not mixed or hypocritical presentations of the truth, and that my faith and personal protection resides only in my surrender to Lord Hari, who is the actual shelter of everyone.

PADA: That is what the parents kept telling me from 1978, do not report any of this to the authorities, keep it in house, and don't do anything effective. Then by 1997, their own kids were committing suicide, and suffering all sorts of trauma. And you guys told me not to fix that problem, because "Prabhupada wanted" these kids to continue to be molested -- and then die of suicide. The kids got these ideas, from you guys. And they just repeated that to Windle Turley.  

And hundreds of kids were pulled out of GBC schools because of the lawsuit, and people like Krishna Kirtan wanted those kids to stay in those schools, so they could be raped and abused all the more. Or what? So you guys wanted ongoing molesting and suicides to continue, and I did not, it is that simple. 

And when I asked you why you wanted more molesting and suicides, then you started to tell me I am an offender and all that, not answering the question. OK even the media people ask me about this all the time, and they agree, the parents and the victims not reporting all this then fell back to the institution.

And Matura Pati is the same way, he tells me over and over and over, I am wrong to stop children from being raped and committing suicide. So you guys are promoters of an Auschwitz for kids program, as your victims told me over and over and over. Whereas I am not in favor of your Auschwitz for kids process, so you attacked me. Victims told me -- you guys are supporting Auschwitz for kids, I heard this from your agenda's victims. So the hypocrisy is, we need to continue Auschwitz for kids, and make pretend we are helping kids.  

Krishna Kirtan

PS. And even beyond the Jagadish hypocrisy, the very tactic used by the lawyers was to attack ISKCON as an organization. RICO. That was their platform.

PADA: The lawyers saved many children by getting hundreds of them pulled out of GBC schools, and the suicides also almost stopped. And your Sanat and Mukunda guys told me, and the court, that we should have these children killed, chopped up and fed to dogs. So your platform is to allow child rapes and child suicides. 

Whereas! The karmi courts and lawyers are against child rapes and suicides, so they did what they could. It was not perfect, but it was better than your plan to continue Auschwitz for kids. Sulochana said the people who oppose us are "tossing children into a wood chipper." And you guys are upset we dried up your supply of children to toss in there, and that is all this about from square one. 

Instead of suing and addressing the perpetrators of the abuse and their leaders, the whole institution was attacked instead, causing harm to the entire institution, and even to all innocent mass of devotees who are part of ISKCON, and who had nothing to do with any of it. In other words, it was a stealthy contrived plan to destroy Srila Prabhupada’s legacy, person, and what he built: namely all his property, institution and everything associated with it.

PADA: So why didn't you gurukulis make your own lawsuit and sue the perps? And why have you guys not done that even by now? You guys are the people who have to make a legal criminal complaint, not me, or even Windle Turley. The victims have to file a complaint, and you guys didn't, and you guys still don't and won't.

There was no plan to destroy ISKCON of any sort. The children were being raped and committing suicide and we wanted that stopped, and you guys wanted that to continue. The lawyers wanted to stop the ongoing molesting and suicides, that was all they mainly intended, and they did that. 

The institution suffered, because the parents / gurukula victims did not place any criminal charges on the perps and leaders a long time ago. Therefore, the institution looked collectively faulty and guilty. Same as the Catholic Church, it got sued because the leaders and parents were not acting properly, so the institution was blamed collectively. That is how these legal things operate.

Therefore the Gurukuli lawsuit was actually an attack on the entire of ISKCON and Srila Prabhupada DIRECTLY by putting blame on HIM, all craftly designed and aimed primarily at destruction. In the end it offered very little return of financial significance for any of the victims, and worse yet: did not punish any of the actual singled out perpetrators actually responsible, including Jagadish, the hypocritical public voice for the lawsuit at the time.

In sum, the lawsuit should not in any way be used as some kind of platform of victorious deeds. 

PADA: Well yes, we all went over this before, you guys wanted to have more child rapes and child suicides continue, and not have your Auschwitz program fixed, and you think that is virtue. And that is why ex-children tell me you guys are a sadistic Satanic child sacrifice cult. 

The gurukulis did not file any criminal complaints, their parents also did not, so the institution became a target. Same things happen in the Church. If the parents and victims do not make criminal cases, and it gets covered up, then later the whole organization suffers. That happens all the time. 

And then Mathura Pati came along and he said he agrees with you, he wants to be the German Army Officer Generalfeldmarshall of your child rapes and suicides Auschwitz for kids program. He never says a word about why he wants rapes and suicides of children to continue, because he is -- according to some of the victims here -- a sadistic death camp general. They told me, he takes delight in seeing kids tortured and die. That is the impression he is creating. That is not my fault, it is his. 

Then you ran off to promote this whacko guy, Bhāgavat Dharma Samāj. Wait a minute? Didn't he say in 1980 there was a lot of abuse going on in the gurukulas? And what did he do? He resigned and wandered off and did nothing about it. 

And that is why you worship him, he is another bogus sadhu like many others in Vrndavana who knew about the abuse and did nothing. And there are sadhus TODAY who know about an abuser swami in Vrndavana now, and they are doing nothing. So you guys want to allow rapes and suicides to go on, and I believe your victims, you are a Satanic child abuse and suicide cult. When you guys do nothing, then the institution suffers, happens every day. 

And now Prabhupadanuga EU is promoting you followers of this whacko sadhu, who says only people born in the dham can become pure. You are a bunch of racists. Srila Prabhupada says these "born in India" sadhus are on the bodily platform and we should avoid them. The very first thing Prabhupada says is, we are not this body, and your guru does not even know the basic points. 

And Krishna Kirtan says the ritviks are bogus, we need to worship people in mundane bodily consciousness, and Prabhupadanuga EU is helping advertise this mundane bodily foolishness, which is another example of their hypocrisy.  

And many victims thanked me for getting some money from the lawsuit, they said without that money they would have been starving and homeless, they at least got a car, or something to get going in life. So that is another thing, you Auschwitz for kids fans also like to make children starving, penniless and homeless, it all fits with your sadistic plans for children. Your agenda wanted them to be raped and die of suicide, or be starving and homeless, and you are just mad we cut off your supply of children to toss into your wood chipper. That is what even the media folks told me is the real issue here.

Oh boo hoo, we cut off Krishna Kirtan's supply of children to toss into his wood chipper program, and torture them in his Auschwitz for kids program, hoping they will get discouraged enough to die. Or what? I say the victims are right, you guys are a Satanic child sacrifice cult, and many media folks agree as well. And that is why we have to expose you, and we are.

ys pd

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