Srila Prabhupada: Vani VS Vapuh 11 23 23

Krishna's message to us -- is eternal.

angel108b@yahoo.com

SRILA PRABHUPADA: VANI SEVA: 

"The disciple must stick to whatever the spiritual master orders. Simply by following on that line, one sees the Supreme Personality of Godhead. As explained before, this means meeting the Supreme Personality of Godhead in the instruction of the spiritual master.”

"This is technically called vani-seva. Srila Visvanatha Cakravarti Thakura states in his Bhagavad-gita commentary on the verse vyavasayatmika buddhir ekeha kuru-nandana (Bg. 2.41) that one should serve the words of the spiritual master.” (SB 28.47-52)

"The disciple and spiritual master are never separated because the spiritual master always keeps company with the disciple as long as the disciple follows strictly the instructions of the spiritual master. This is called the association of vani (words). Physical presence is called vapuh. As long as the spiritual master is physically present, the disciple should serve the physical body of the spiritual master, and when the spiritual master is no longer physically existing, the disciple should serve the instructions of the spiritual master. (SB 4.28.47)

There are two ways of association – by vani and by vapuh. Vani means words and vapuh means physical presence. Physical presence is sometimes appreciable and sometimes not, but Vani continues to exist eternally.

Therefore, one must take advantage of the Vani, not the physical presence. (CC, Antya 5 Conclusion)

Srila Prabhupada on Vapuh Versus Vani

Srila Prabhupada: Therefore we should take advantage of the Vani, not the physical presence. Although according to material vision His Divine Grace Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarsavati Thakura Prabhupada passed away from this material world on the last day of December 1936, I still consider his Divine Grace to be always present with me by his vani, his words.

There are two ways of association – by vani and by vapuh. Vani means words and vapuh means physical presence. Physical presence is sometimes appreciable and sometimes not, but Vani continues to exist eternally. Therefore, one must take advantage of the Vani, not the physical presence. (CC, Antya 5 Conclusion)
Therefore we should take advantage of the Vani, not the physical presence. (Letter to Suci Devi Dasi, 4/11/75)

I shall remain your personal guidance, physically present or not physically present, as I am getting guidance from my Guru Maharaja. (Room Conversation, Vrindavan, 14/7/77)

Physical presence is immaterial. Presence of the transcendental sound received from the Spiritual Master should be the guidance of life. That will make our spiritual life successful. If you feel very strongly about my absence you may place my pictures on my sitting places and this will be source of inspiration for you. (Letter to Brahmananda and other students, 19/1/67)

But always remember that I am always with you. As you are always thinking of me, I am always thinking of you also. Although physically we are not together, we are not separated spiritually. So we should be concerned only with this spiritual connection. (Letter to Gaurasundara, 13/11/69)

So we should associate by vibration, and not by the physical presence. That is real association. (Lectures SB, 68/08/18)

There are two conceptions, the physical conception and the vibrational conception. The physical conception is temporary. The vibrational conception is eternal.[…] When we feel separation from Krsna or the Spirirual Master, we should just try to remember their words or instructions, and we will no longer feel that separation. Such association with Krsna and the Spiritual Master should be association by vibration not physical presence. That is real association. (Elevation to Krsna Consciousness,(BBT 1973), Page 57)

It is sometimes misunderstood that if one has to associate with persons engaged in devotional service, he will not be able to solve the economic problem. To answer this argument, it is described here that one has to associate with liberated persons not directly, physically, but by understanding, through philosophy and logic, the problems of life. (SB 3:31:48)

I am always with you. Never mind if I am physically absent. (Letter to Jayananda, 16/9/67)

Paramananda: We’re always feeling your presence very strongly, Srila Prabhupada, simply by your teachings and your instructions. We’re always meditating on your instructions.

Srila Prabhupada: Thank you. That is the real presence. Physical presence is not important. (Room Conversation, Vrndavana, 6/10/77)

You write that you have desire to avail of my association again, but why do you forget that you are always in association with me? When you are helping my missionary activities I am always thinking of you, and you are always thinking of me . That is real association. Just like I am always thinking of my Guru Maharaja at every moment, although he is not physically present, and because I am trying to serve him to my best capacity, I am sure he is helping me by his spiritual blessings. So there are two kinds of association: physical and preceptorial. Physical association is not so important as preceptorial association. (Letter to Govinda Dasi, 18/8/69)

As far as my blessing is concerned, it does not require my physical presence. If you are chanting Hare Krsna there, and following my instructions, reading the books, taking only Krsna prasadam etc., then there is no question of your not receiving the blessings of Lord Caitanya, whose mission I am humbly trying to push on. (Letter to Bala Krsna, 30/6/74)

‘Anyone who has developed unflinching faith in the Lord and the Spiritual Master can understand the revealed scripture unfolding before him’. So continue your present aptitude and you will be successful in your spiritual progress. I am sure that even if I am not physically present before you, still you will be able to execute all spiritual duties in the matter of Krsna Consciousness, if you follow the above principles. (Letter to Subala, 29/9/67)

So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the Spiritual Master, vibration. What we have heard from the Spiritual Master, that is living. (General lectures, 69/01/13)
Devotee: …so sometimes the Spiritual Master is far away. He may be in Los Angeles. Somebody is coming to Hamburg Temple. He thinks ‘How will the Spiritual Master be pleased?’

Srila Prabhupada: Just follow his order, Spiritual Master is along with you by his words. Just like my Spiritual Master is not physically present, but I am associating with him by his words. (SB Lectures, 71/08/18)

Just like I am working, so my Guru Maharaja is there, Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati. Physically he may not be, but in every action he is there. To serve master’s word is more important than to serve physically. (Room Conversation, Vrindavan, 2/5/77)

So that is called prakata, physically present. And there is another phrase, which is called aprakata, not physically present. But that does not mean, Krsna is dead or God is dead. That does not mean, prakata or aprakata, physically present or not present, it does not matter. (Lectures SB 73/12/11)

So, spiritually, there is no question of separation, even physically we may be in far distant place. (Letter to Syama Dasi, 30/08/68)

I went to your country for spreading this information of Krsna Consciousness and you are helping me in my mission, although I am not physically present there but spiritually I am always with you. (Letter to Nandarani, Krsna Devi and Subala, 3/10/67)

We are not separated actually. There are two – Vani or Vapuh – so Vapu is physical presence and Vani is presence by the vibration, but they are all the same. (Letter to Hamsadutta, 22/6/70)

So in the absence of physical presentation of the spiritual master, the Vaniseva is more important. My Spiritual Master Sarsavati Goswami, may appear to be physically not present, but still because I try to serve his instruction, I never feel separated from him. (Letter to Karandhara, 22/8/70)

I also do not feel separation from my Guru Maharaja. When I am engaged in his service, his pictures give me sufficient strength. To serve master’s word is more important than to serve him physically. (Letter to Syamasundara, 19/7/70)
SB 4.28.47

The disciple and spiritual master are never separated because the spiritual master always keeps company with the disciple as long as the disciple follows strictly the instructions of the spiritual master. This is called the association of vani (words). Physical presence is called vapuh. As long as the spiritual master is physically present, the disciple should serve the physical body of the spiritual master, and when the spiritual master is no longer physically existing, the disciple should serve the instructions of the spiritual master.

SB 4.28.51

In conclusion, if a disciple is very serious to execute the mission of the spiritual master, he immediately associates with the Supreme Personality of Godhead by vani or vapuh. This is the only secret of success in seeing the Supreme Personality of Godhead. Instead of being eager to see the Lord in some bush of Vrndavana while at the same time engaging in sense gratification, if one instead sticks to the principle of following the words of the spiritual master, he will see the Supreme Lord without difficulty.

770517ar.vrn Conversations

Prabhupada: So I cannot speak. I am feeling very weak. I was to go to other places like Chandigarh program, but I cancelled the program because the condition of my health is very deteriorating. So I preferred to come to Vrndavana. If death takes place, let it take here. So there is nothing to be said new. Whatever I have to speak, I have spoken in my books. Now you try to understand it and continue your endeavor. Whether I am present or not present, it doesn’t matter.

As Krsna is living eternally, similarly, living being also lives eternally. But KIRTIR YASYA SA JIVATI: “ONE WHO HAS DONE SERVICE TO THE LORD LIVES FOREVER.” So you have been taught to serve Krsna, and with Krsna we’ll live eternally. Our life is eternal. Na hanyate hanyamane sarire. A temporary disappearance of this body, it doesn’t matter. Body is meant for disappearance. Tatha dehantara-praptih. So live forever by serving Krsna.

Thank you very much.

Reporter: Who will succeed you when you die?
Srila Prabhupada: I will never die!
Devotees: Jaya! Haribol!
Srila Prabhupada: I will live forever from my books and you will utilise.
– Srila Prabhupada Interview, Berkley, July 17, 1975

Devotee: Srila Prabhupada when you’re not present with us, how is it possible to receive instructions? For example in questions that may arise…
SRILA PRABHUPADA: Well the questions are answ… answers are there in my books.
(Morning Walk, Los Angeles, 13/5/73)

So utilise whatever time you find to make a thorough study of my books. Then all your questions will be answered. (Letter to Upendra, 7/1/76)

Every one of you must regularly read our books at least twice, in the morning and evening, and automatically all questions will be answered. ( Letter to Randhira, 24/01/70)
770517ar.vrn Conversations

Prabhupada: ….. So there is nothing to be said new. Whatever I have to speak, I have spoken in my books. Now you try to understand it and continue your endeavor. Whether I am present or not present, it doesn’t matter.
Srila Prabhupada: “So although a physical body is not present, the vibration should be accepted as the presence of the Spiritual Master, vibration. What we have heard from the Spiritual Master, that is living.”

Srila Prabhupada: ”So in the absence of physical presentation of the spiritual master, the Vaniseva is more important. My Spiritual Master Sarsavati Goswami, may appear to be physically not present, but still because I try to serve his instruction, I never feel separated from him.” (Srila Prabhupada, letter to Karandhara, 22/8/70)

Srila Prabhupada: “However, the disciple and spiritual master are never separated because the spiritual master always keeps company with the disciple as long as the disciple follows strictly the instructions of the spiritual master. This is called the association of vani (words). Physical presence is called vapuh. As long as the spiritual master is physically present, the disciple should serve the physical body of the spiritual master, and when the spiritual master is no longer physically existing, the disciple should serve the instructions of the spiritual master.” (Purport Srimad-Bhagavatam 4.28.47)

“I shall remain your personal guidance, physically present or not physically, as I am getting personal guidance from my guru maharaja” (Srila Prabhupada to Tamal Krishna, 14 July 1977)

73-11-25. Letter: Cidananda

I should be returning to Los Angeles the last week of November and I should be more than happy to see you there. Please always try to remember me by my teachings and we shall always be together.

If I depart there is no cause for lamentation. I will always be with you through my books and orders. I will always remain with you in that way. (BTG 13:1-2, December 1977)

Srila Prabhupada Ki Jay!

Srila Prabhupada has given us everything that we need to make spiritual advancement. He lives eternally in his books, and we can utilize his books, read them, and remain in direct association with Srila Prabhupada. What is the difficulty? Therefore, the reading of Srila Prabhupada’s books, especially of the Srimad-Bhagavatam, is of primary importance so that we can make spiritual advancement and remain in contact with Srila Prabhupada. The reading of Srila Prabhupada’s books is extremely vital. We can have a direct relationship with Srila Prabhupada simply by reading his books.

We are still serving the vapu and the vani

We are still serving the vapu and the vani, but the vapu-vadi baboon brains still cannot understand this. They still can not understand the ABC of what Srila Prabhupada has taught.

The Vapu of the acarya is still there in his murti and in his picture.

Srila Prabhupada: “Yes, the spiritual master is also present in his picture, though more importantly he is present in his teachings.” (SPL 01.19.1973)

Brahmānanda: His question… You stated that a statue of yourself is not the same as you, and yet in some of our temples, such as Vṛndāvana, the mūrti of Your Divine Grace has been installed and they are offering prasādam. So is it the same, that the prasādam is accepted by the guru?

Prabhupāda: Yes. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstraiḥ. Guru is nondifferent from Kṛṣṇa. That is accepted by all the śāstra. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta śāstraiḥ. Sākṣād-dharitvena samasta-śāstrair uktaḥ

It is said, “tathā bhāvyata eva sadbhiḥ,” and those who are advanced devotees, they accept it like that.”Kintu prabhor yaḥ priya eva tasya:” But the guru’s position is the most confidential servant.” So guru is the servant God, and Kṛṣṇa is the master God. Both of them are God, servant God and master God. Guru kṛṣṇa kṛpāya pāya bhakti-latā-bīja [Cc. Madhya 19.151].

So we have to serve both the servant and the master. Through the servant, we go to the master. Any other question? Chant Hare Kṛṣṇa. (Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam 3.28.18)

Nairobi, October 27, 1975

PADA: Thanks JD. Yes, the "living guru" folks need to figure out why their temples are always empty ghost towns. When they approach people who are already worshiping Jesus or Prabhupada -- and tell them they need to stop worship of their "post mortem" pure devotees -- and instead worship a "living" conditioned soul who might become an asura -- that is simply not attractive to the average person. 

And that is why their programs are always small and continually dwindling. They are always struggling to find poojaris and cooks here on the West coast temples, and for the past 40 years. And over here they are also making their temples into ashtanga yoga classes, mundane motivational speaker classes, and of course Hindu weddings, Hindu car blessings, Hindu funerals, and last year they even invited some mundane Hindu Bhagavat Sapta guy to go to various ISKCON temples so they could milk the Hindus for donations. 

In sum, worship of the post mortem is making their entire operation post mortem. Whereas we are getting more and more people interested in worshiping the pure devotee on a regular basis. Even people inside ISKCON are writing to tell me, they are done with worship of conditioned souls and they are embracing our Prabhupadanuga program. Yep, a post mortem guru program will make their whole program post mortem, you become what you worship. I just got a nice letter from a devotee who is copying our Prabhupadanuga sites and translating into Russian etc. ys pd