The Books Won’t Help You
Written by Dhira Govinda dasa
Recently I had a conversation with a follower of Gaura Govinda Maharaja. More than a dozen years after Gaura Govinda Maharaja passed away, this devotee continues to experience profound grief due to the disappearance of his beloved spiritual guide. Personally I was touched by the sincere emotion of this devotee, and reflected that my attachment for Srila Prabhupada isn’t a drop compared to the ocean of affection that this devotee has for Gaura Govinda Maharaja.
This encounter moved me to consider various postings, over the past two years or so, on the Prominent Link Conference, related to Gaura Govinda Maharaja. Some of these postings relate to Gaura Govinda Maharaja expressing that sabda-brahma will never descend through Srila Prabhupada’s books and tapes. In another Maharaja states "'Oh I have read their books, I have their association.’ That won't help you…. You are thinking, ‘We need only to read books. There is no need of association with a sadhu who is physically present….’”
My understanding is that Gaura Govinda Maharaja is not saying that Srila Prabhupada’s books are not spiritual, or transcendental. He is asserting that, essentially, it won’t help his followers, or by extension, any of the followers of direct disciples of Srila Prabhupada, to read Srila Prabhupada’s books. They (we) won’t understand Srila Prabhupada’s meaning. They need Gaura Govinda Maharaja as the intermediary in order to comprehend Srila Prabhupada’s meaning. To directly approach Srila Prabhupada through his, Srila Prabhupada’s, books, won’t be helpful.
PADA: Correct. In 1986 GGM was "voted in" to the GBC's illicit sex with men, women and children guru parampara, a program that has been -- banning, beating, molesting, suing and assassinating Vaisnavas. Also well known at the time, the GBC "reinstated" or re-certified a known homosexual predator who was making a huge pedophile camp in India -- and their parampara guru was having oral sex with taxi drivers in the dham etc. So GGM has had to compromise with this illicit sex acharya's group to get his guru certificate. And these are the people he was promoting as ISKCON's living guidance.
I appreciate hearing this viewpoint stated in such a direct manner. It is refreshingly distinct from covert, slippery approaches that we are accustomed to hear, couched in phraseology such as “Well, Srila Prabhupada is your preeminent siksa guru,” “Of course Srila Prabhupada is the founder / acarya, and he can give siksa, but not really diksa…” (In this regard see the Terms of Relegation chapter in Srila Prabhupada: The Prominent Link). Gaura Govinda Maharaja, from what I perceive, is directly asserting “I am your guru. Srila Prabhupada is my guru. You understand him, including his books, through me.”
I understand Srila Prabhupada as essentially making a similar statement, with regard to our relationship with Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati. We understand Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati through him, Srila Prabhupada. That doesn’t mean that it’s not permissible to sometimes directly read a book by Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati. Still, we basically understand Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati through Srila Prabhupada. And, according to Gaura Govinda Maharaja, we understand Srila Prabhupada, including Srila Prabhupada’s books, through Gaura Govinda Maharaja.
The Prominent Link (PL) Model is diametrically opposed to this stance expressed by Gaura Govinda Maharaja. In fact this conversation illustrates the defining characteristic of the PL Model. The relationship of anyone who connects with Srila Prabhupada’s movement, regardless of when they joined, with Srila Prabhupada, is that Srila Prabhupada is their direct and current link to the parampara.
One of the ways that manifests is that there is no limit or restriction to the extent to which a follower of Srila Prabhupada, whenever they may have contacted his movement, should be encouraged to directly read Srila Prabhupada’s books and hear his tapes. The more the better. Our role, and that of all aspiring followers of Srila Prabhupada, is to facilitate others in their direct connection with Srila Prabhupada.
It is not that the role of Srila Prabhupada’s followers is to be the link through which others relate with Srila Prabhupada. Rather it is to inspire them to directly link with Srila Prabhupada. Of course our direct and personal relationship will naturally be enhanced by the association of other Vaisnavas who are sincerely dedicated to Srila Prabhupada’s mission.
I don’t claim to understand the nuances of Gaura Govinda Maharaja’s meaning in the references above, nor do I know anything about Gaura Govinda Maharaja’s relationship with or service to Srila Prabhupada or Krsna. And again, I do appreciate what I perceive to be the clarity of his standpoint, which sharply contrasts the smoke and mirrors we often get from others advocating a “physical presence” position.
While acknowledging that his point of view may be effective for some, my view is that this position, as enunciated by Gaura Govinda Maharaja, is essentially harmful for Srila Prabhupada’s movement. Considering my friend mentioned at the start of this text, I wonder how inspired he could ever become to closely study Srila Prabhupada’s books, if the person he trusts most, Gaura Govinda Maharaja, has stated that Srila Prabhupada’s books “…won’t help you”.
From: AS .ru
Sent: Tuesday, January 23, 2024 10:05 AM
Subject: Myth 29_Audio recordings do not contain spiritual sound energy sabda brahma
The next essay on vapuvada is a review of the argument that sabda brahma is supposedly absent in audio recordings, even those of Srila Prabhupada, as per Gour Govinda Swami's opinion that is still being quoted by some people:
Myth: One should hear instructions and initiation mantras only from lotus lips of the guru, we can't just read books or hear tapes since audio tapes do not contain spiritual sound energy sabda-brahma.
Truth: Srila Prabhupada used his audio tapes for initiating into Gayatri mantra, for producing his books, etc., since his books and tapes fully contain sabda-brahma.
From "Myth-busters: The Guru and initiation myth" (Back to Prabhupada #5, Autumn 2004):
MYTH: "We must hear the gayatri mantra, and spiritual knowledge in general, from the lips of the spiritual master. Therefore the Guru must be physically present in order to initiate disciples."
BUSTED: This idea comes from quotes such as the following:
"When one's knowledge of mantras is received from the lips of the bona fide spiritual master, one's mantra is considered pure…"
(Hrdyananda dasa Goswami's translation and purport, Srimad Bhagavatam 11.21)
As we saw Srila Prabhupada instruct above: "First of all you must secure one tape of me reciting Gayatri mantra." [SP Letter to: Danavir — Nairobi, 27 September, 1971]
So, whilst no one is denying that hearing directly from the lips of a pure devotee would be good, we can also conclude that listening to a tape must be sufficiently potent, or else why would Srila Prabhupada have sanctioned this as part of general initiation procedure within ISKCON?
Srila Prabhupada also placed great emphasis on the distribution of his books, and equated "reading" such books with "hearing" directly from the spiritual master:
"Reading or hearing from the realized person there is no difference…"
(Srila Prabhupada Letter to Punjabi Premanand, 16th April, 1976)
"These are not ordinary books. It is recorded chanting. Anyone who reads, he is hearing."
(Srila Prabhupada Letter to Rupanuga Das, 19th October, 1974)
(End of quote from BTP)
Is there sabda-brahma in Srila Prabhupada's audio recordings?
Maya - ISKCON guru Gour Govinda Swami has repeatedly stated (several quotes will be analyzed below) that sabda-brahma (spiritual sound, or spiritual energy in sound) allegedly isn't there in audio recordings, including those of Srila Prabhupada, and at the same time his own words were recorded on audio tape, and books of Gour Govinda himself were published and are still being published by his followers on the basis of these audio recordings.
Srila Prabhupada never taught such an idea and in practice acted in the opposite way of what GGS said on this topic: Srila Prabhupada recorded his kirtans, bhajans, lectures, he initiated many disciples at a distance with an audio recording of the Gayatri mantra, and even dictated his books on a tape recorder during translation. Moreover, unlike Gour Govinda, who simply kept repeating his idea of the alleged ineffectiveness of audio recordings, without giving it philosophical reasoning, Srila Prabhupada explained:
"As stated previously by Nārada before Vyāsadeva (Bhāg. 1.5.20), idaṁ hi viśvaṁ bhagavān ivetaraḥ: this unmanifested world is the self-same Personality of Godhead, but it appears to be something else beyond or besides the Lord. It appears so because of its being separated from the Lord by means of kāla. It is something like the tape-recorded voice of a person who is now separated from the voice. As the tape recording is situated on the tape, so the whole cosmic manifestation is situated on the material energy and appears separate by means of kāla." (SBhag. 3.10.12 purport)
Prabhupāda: The same thing, bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ, mixing together, brick or stone or cement, if it is used for Kṛṣṇa, then it is yukta-vairāgya... So our philosophy is that. Although this material world, bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ [Bg. 7.4], they are separated from Kṛṣṇa, we can use it for Kṛṣṇa. Just like the same example: The tape recorder, it is material, but it can be used for Kṛṣṇa's purpose.
We are writing books, recording in the tape recorder. That nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe yuktaṁ vairāgyam ucyate. There is no need of giving up this bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ, as the Māyāvādī philosopher says. You can utilize. After all, it is Kṛṣṇa's energy. This is the best philosophy, that one man's property should be used for the proprietor. That is the best use.
So we do not neglect this bhūmir āpaḥ..., although it is separated energy, but when we reconnect in the service of the Lord, it becomes spiritual. It requires little time to understand. And the example, as we have given many times, that you put one iron rod in the fire. It becomes warm, warmer, warmer, warmer. Then, when it is red-hot, it is no longer iron rod, but it is fire. Similarly, everything in this material world, bhūmir āpo 'nalo vāyuḥ [Bg. 7.4], although it is separated from Kṛṣṇa, if you engage it in the service of Kṛṣṇa, it is no more material. It is spiritual. This is the philosophy of Vaiṣṇavas. Nirbandhaḥ kṛṣṇa-sambandhe yuktaṁ vairāgyam ucyate. (Bhagavad-gītā 7.4 class — Vṛndāvana, August 10, 1974)
An episode from Srimad Bhagavatam should be recalled here. Lord Brahma, having appeared in this world, heard the sound "tapa" (perform austerities), without seeing anyone, but he followed this instruction and achieved success in self-realization. Srila Prabhupada writes in his purport, "Lord Brahmā heard the occult sound tapa, but he did not see the person who vibrated the sound.
And still he accepted the instruction as beneficial for him, and therefore he engaged himself in meditation for one thousand celestial years. One celestial year is equal to 6 x 30 x 12 x 1000 of our years. His acceptance of the sound was due to his pure vision of the absolute nature of the Lord. And due to his correct vision, he made no distinction between the Lord and the Lord's instruction. There is no difference between the Lord and sound vibration coming from Him, even though He is not personally present.
The best way of understanding is to accept such divine instruction, and Brahmā, the prime spiritual master of everyone, is the living example of this process of receiving transcendental knowledge. The potency of transcendental sound is never minimized because the vibrator is apparently absent. Therefore Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam or Bhagavad-gītā or any revealed scripture in the world is never to be accepted as an ordinary mundane sound without transcendental potency." (SBhag. 2.9.8 purport)
Thus, sabda means sound, and brahma means spiritual energy. There is no doubt that sound comes from Srila Prabhupada's audio recordings; we, with our senses, perceive his words that convey the absolute message coming down the disciplic succession. Therefore, this sound is spiritual, that is, sabda-brahma. Moreover, from the point of view of Lord Krishna, everything is His energies; whether they are spiritual or material depends on our level of perception.
A devotee of the Lord of highest order, uttama-adhikari, does not perceive anything as material, as existing apart from Krishna. All energies, according to the philosophy formulated by Lord Caitanya, are always inextricably linked with the source of all energy, Lord Krishna. In case of Srila Prabhupada's instructions, it's easy to understand that his instructions are directly related to Krishna, are dedicated to preaching His glory, and encourage listeners to devote their inclination to love and serve the object of their love to Krishna.
It's self-evident that Srila Prabhupada's instructions, even recorded on tape, have tremendous spiritual power: they evoke spiritual emotions, they convince people to surrender to Krishna, text transcriptions of his instructions were made from dictations on tape, which were published and are being published in the form of books that effectively convince and persuade people all over the world to become devotees of the Lord. The spiritual potential that exists in them is obvious. Hence, if audio recordings of Srila Prabhupada's lectures produce sound that carries the Absolute Truth and possesses spiritual energy, then it's definitely sabda-brahma.
A few quotes from Srila Prabhupada on reading his books:
"Regarding Sankirtana and book distribution, book distribution is also chanting. Anyone who reads the books that is also chanting and hearing. Why distinguish between chanting and book distribution? These books I have recorded and chanted, and they are transcribed. It is spoken kirtanas. So book distribution is also chanting." (SP Letter to: Rupanuga: — Mayapur 19 October, 1974)
"So I am always emphasizing book distribution. It is the better kirtana. It is better than chanting. Of course chanting should not stop, but book distribution is the best kirtana." (SP Letter to: Srutadeva: — Mayapur 24 October, 1974)
"So those who have joined this Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement, my request is they follow the regulative principles, as instructed by Rūpa Gosvāmī, with enthusiasm, read books and distribute books. And that is a very great service. I'll speak something, you may forget, but if you read from the book, you will get good opportunity to understand the philosophy. So our principle is to study the books as well as to distribute the books. People will be benefited and their life will be successful. This is Kṛṣṇa consciousness movement." (Arrival — Honolulu, May 3, 1976)
If the transmission of transcendental knowledge is effective in case of the acarya's books, then this is especially true of audio recordings that Srila Prabhupada himself started to make since the beginning of his first visit to America, and this continued until his departure in Vrindavana in 1977:
"Śrīla Prabhupāda's resolve is evidenced by the purchase of his first tape recorder, a major expenditure for him. He started recording his classes, kīrtanas and bhajanas. He wrote in his Journal: "There was no response of the visitors invited to come and join Hari Kirtan this evening at 7/30 pm. But I alone executed the Kirtan ceremony with my T.R. till 10 pm." Śrīla Prabhupāda's prescience in preserving his spoken word has resulted in a permanent legacy of over two thousand hours of invaluable tape recordings." (The Beginning, The 1966 New York Journal, Introduction)
Sometimes Srila Prabhupada said that spiritual science should be heard from the lips of pure devotees, not from professionals, not from a gramophone. For example:
"Then how I shall make progress?" Now, namanta eva san-mukharitāṁ bhavadīya-vārtām. "Just hear the message of God." "From whom?" San-mukharitām: "through the mouth of the devotees." Not professional, not gramophone—through the mouth of, through the lips of real devotee." (SBhag. 6.1.24 class — Chicago, July 8, 1975)
This quote is referred to by followers of Gour Govinda Swami, but it does not prove that sabda-brahma "cannot be recorded". Sometimes Srila Prabhupada spoke negatively about listening to gramophone in the context of hearing sahajiyas or materialists/nondevotees who just professionally record certain audio performances without engaging in real devotional service. And it's not recommended to listen to these categories of people directly, face to face. When it came to recording the words of the pure devotee (Srila Prabhupada), he used gramophone:
"I am making here a series of lecture on K.C. yoga system. They are tape recorded. If Mr. Kallman wants to make some gramophone records on this series of lectures, he can do so at least in those long time records. Please talk with him and let me know if he is agreeable." (SP Letter to: Brahmananda — San Francisco 21 December, 1967)
"As promised by me previously I am sending herewith the Gramophone Record of my Kirtana and short speech thereof. I hope you will enjoy it." (SP Letter to: Sri Krishna Panditji — New York 15 April, 1967)
"The suggestion of Mr. Kallman of Krishna Consciousness Kit is very nice. Please try to fructify this idea as soon as possible. As there is still time to get Bhagavad-gita ready published by MacMillan Co., Mr. Kallman may not come to S.F. so quickly. I am expecting to return to N.Y. by the end of March or beginning of April. At that time, he may take the recording of Krishna Consciousness speech in 3 gramophone records." (SP Letter to: Brahmananda — Los Angeles 16 January, 1968)
A few more quotes from Srila Prabhupada that show how he approved of audio and video recordings:
"I am in due receipt of your letter of January 13, 1969 along with the kirtana tapes and pictures of Buffalo temple. I cannot tell you how very much I enjoyed listening to this wonderful tape recording. All of the super-excellent qualities of kirtana were present on this tape and it was thus a great joy to hear it. On this tape Rupanuga has set an example for all householders because there was singing on this of Hare Krishna by all of his family members. It was all sounding very nicely, and I am going to show this tape to the Sankirtana Party which is here in Los Angeles so they may take example from such nice kirtana." (SP Letter to: Bhurijana — Los Angeles 18 January, 1969)
"Your idea for utilizing video tape recording systems to broadcast our activities is very nice. It will be very good if you can convince the television stations to carry our program on a regular basis and this equipment if it can be used for this purpose will be very useful. So discuss this matter with the GBC how it can be practically implemented." (SP Letter to: Ranadhira — Bombay 5 January, 1972)
"Dhoop arati may be performed in the morning if there is unusually great complaining, but it is better to hold full arati, but quietly, as in Bombay they play a tape-recording of myself singing arati softly and hold full arati. We should not try to diminish our standard of deity worship once it has reached a certain program, and it is especially nice to wake up Radha and Krishna with full arati with everyone dancing, but quietly." (SP Letter to: Upendra — Calcutta 19 February, 1972)
"Your proposal for making records is very nice program. As for your essay on drugs and KC, do it. You may transcribe the Ajamila tapes and produce a very nice book. You may send the manuscript to Jayadvaita or Hayagriva for editing and printing with Dai Nippon. So far making tapes of Ajamila series, I have told Los Angeles tape-making operation that they should distribute to our devotees at cost price—to nondevotee that is another thing. We should not make exorbitant profit by exploiting each other in the matter of vital Krishna Consciousness paraphernalia such as books, tapes, etc. which are vital for our preaching work and for the devotees' personal advancement in Krishna Consciousness." (SP Letter to: Hamsaduta — Jaipur 20 January, 1972)
In late 1960s and early 1970s, ISKCON's 'Back to Godhead' magazine regularly published a note "WHAT IS THE INTERNATIONAL SOCIETY FOR KRISHNA CONSCIOUSNESS?" that stated:
"By books, literature and records, the Society is dedicated to awakening the worldwide public to the normal, ecstatic state of Krsna consciousness, so that all may regain their eternal position of favorably serving the will of Krsna." (BTG #38, 1970, pg. 2)
Exactly the same phrase is also there in the original 'On Chanting Hare Krsna' booklet (pg. 2).
There are many similar statements in 'Back to Godhead'. E.g.:
"Link-up to the most important spiritual master in the world today. As it's said, hearing is the beginning of understanding. Now, with a Golden Avatar tape subscription, you can hear the message of Krsna consciousness directly from a bona fide spiritual master, a pure devotee of Krsna – His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada. Each week, you'll receive lectures, interviews, classes and intimate conversations with His Divine Grace, all recorded only a few days before. You'll find that listening to these transcendental sounds is a wonderful way to make advancement on the path toward spiritual perfection." (BTG #2, 1975, pg. 14)
"Hear the timeless wisdom of Krsna Consciousness. Tape Ministry Subscription: Each week you'll receive intriguing cassettes of lectures, interviews, intimate conversations, and classes given by His Divine Grace A. C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Prabhupada – a pure devotee of God and the foremost spiritual leader of the modern age. These tapes will keep you in touch with his profound teachings, provide you with his transcendental guidance, and help you advance on the path towards spiritual perfection." (BTG #6, 1977, pg. 14)
Srila Prabhupada clearly said, "Just like I am speaking, it is being recorded, recorded. But in my absence, if the record is played, it will exactly vibrate the same sound." (Bhagavad-gita 7.4 class — Nairobi, October 31, 1975)
From "Pariprasna: The Process Of Inquiry" (book composed of GGS recorded teachings):
Devotee: Sometimes preaching seems contrary to humility. How can we preach in the mood of humility?
Gour Govinda Swami: Unless you develop humility how can you preach? You cannot. Your preaching will never be effective. It will be like a voice on a tape recorder. Just the alphabet, it will not be sabda-brahma. One must hear directly coming from the lips of a person. That is sabda-brahma.
Devotee: You said that Srila Bhaktisiddhanta would not have allowed tape recorders.
Gour Govinda Swami: Yes, at that time they were not there. But if they were present he would never allow their use. One must hear from the person, directly from the lips. That is sabda-brahma. Not a recorded voice on a gramophone record. (Bhubaneswara India 22 August 1995)
This clearly does not correspond to the instructions and practice of Srila Prabhupada who recorded his kirtans, lectures, Gayatri mantra and even books on tape and never said they did not contain sabda-brahma. Some questions arise in this regard:
1. Does it follow from GGS' words that Srila Prabhupada did what Srila Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati Thakur would not allow him to do?
2. GGS regularly recorded his words on a tape recorder, but he believed that Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati would be against such recordings?
3. And finally, why do disciples and followers of Gour Govinda Swami continue to listen to recordings of his classes, publish them in the form of books, quotes, etc. and distribute them (even among people who never met GGS), if he has already left the body and if there is no spiritual sound sabda-brahma in his recordings and books, and if GGS emphasis was on the idea that one "must hear from the person, directly from the lips"?
A quote from a website of GGS followers: "Srila Gour Govinda Swami explained to listening disciples at Heathrow airport in 1995, "You see, Srila Prabhupada came to the western world, he went to America. He went to Tompkons Square Park. HE chanted Hare Krishna with karatalas. So many hippies were rolling there intoxicated with very strong drugs, half naked boys and girls.
As soon as they heard this transcendental sound, they immediately woke up. Alright, now you should go there to Tompkins Square Park with a tape recorder playing Prabhupada's voice. We'll see if they will wake up and come. Then I will understand, 'Yes, it is giving sabda'. This is the test." (http://www.gourgovindaswami.org/page7.htm)
I am convinced that if sincere devotees come to this park and arrange everything properly, then outsiders will "wake up" and approach the devotees who will turn on the audio recording of Srila Prabhupada's kirtan. What did GGS try to say- that Srila Prabhupada's kirtan recordings are material sounds devoid of spiritual energy?? Why, then, did Srila Prabhupada record his kirtans and bhajans starting since 1966 (such as the Happening album "Krishna Consciousness" which then was widely distributed) and up to 1976?
A highly authoritative test has already been conducted many times, and this test was mentioned by Srila Prabhupada himself- initiation into the Gayatri mantra by listening to an audio recording of Srila Prabhupada reciting this mantra. Another authoritative test is the numerous people who have awakened to spiritual life by reading Srila Prabhupada's books. His books and audio recordings of kirtans and lectures awaken spiritual feelings, many devotees can attest to this. No one has ever felt any fundamental difference between listening to lecture recordings and listening to "live" lectures.
Srila Prabhupada's books and classes cannot be considered as material objects devoid of spiritual energy. Thus, it can be easily proved on many levels that reading/listening to Srila Prabhupada's books and audio recordings is effective, and that the concept they do not contain sabda-brahma is an erroneous idea that has no serious basis.
Questions & Answers with Srila Gour Govinda Swami Maharaja
Published in The Worship of Sri Guru, chapter 3
Devotee 1: Sabda-brahma is Krsna in sound vibration?
Srīla Gour Govinda Swami: Yes. One has to hear. It is not that, “All right, tapes are there, I’ll hear the recorded tapes.” Sabda-brahma will never descend.
Devotee 2: It doesn’t descend through transmission of tape?
Śrīla Gour Govinda Swami: No, no.
Devotee 2: Only when you are personally sitting there with a pure Vaiṣṇava?
Srila Gour Govinda Swami: Yes. Now in this material scientific age so many techniques are there. People, say, “No more teachers are required. We’ll teach through television.” Nonsense, sabda-brahma will never descend.
Comments by Puranjana das: "This is false. Almost all of Srila Prabhupada's books were originally tape recorded and then transcribed. Most of the people who became devotees in the 1970s only heard Srila Prabhupada by reading his books and listening to his tapes. His tapes were always being played in the ISKCON temples in the 1970s, and we listened to the tapes all the time. And we still do! Moreover, distributing the books (made from the tapes) was the number one method of making new devotees.
To say that the audio taped speaking of a pure devotee (i.e. his books and recorded speech) is not "sabda brahma" is very foolish. Again for clarity, Srila Prabhupada FIRST of all tape recorded most of his books on audio tapes, and then the AUDIO TAPES were later transcribed into his books. How can we say these taped recordings and subsequent books are not sabda brahma (Krishna's sound vibration)?
The whole process arranged by Srila Prabhupada was and still is -- to have his vani / tapes / books given to people now and for future generations of people. Srila Prabhupada first of all made audio tapes of his books, and now Gaura Govinda maharaja says, there is no sabda brahma in these books, because they are originally tape recorded? This defies the entire structure of (A) audio tapes and (B) subsequent books set up by Srila Prabhupada. Srila Prabhupada also said: "I will live forever from my books and you will utilize," so that is HIS program, we will get his association from his books which were originally TAPE RECORDED." (End)
"An analysis of the recent nexus.
Dear devotees, if I may, I would like to philosophically examine the recently compared statements of Srila Prabhupada and Srila Gour Govinda Maharaja on the nature of tape recordings. For your convenience the statements are:
HH Gour Govinda Swami, ‘Q&A', The Worship of Sri Guru, Chapter 3:
"One has to hear. It is not that, "All right, tapes are there, I'll hear the recorded tapes." sabda-brahma will never descend. […] You should be greedy. Physical contact is required. You must hear directly, not just by listening to tapes. Sabda-brahma will never descend through a tape. One must hear from a physically present Sri Guru."
Srila Prabhupada Letter, November 13th, 1975:
"The potency of transcendental sound is never minimised because the vibrator is apparently absent." [Srimad-Bhagavatam, 2.9.8, purport] "You should have a fire sacrifice and the second initiates should hear through the right ear the mantra on my recorded tape."
In Reference of the Statement of HH Gour Govinda Maharaj: Any attempts to draw similarities between the statements can only be strained and ultimately artificial. There is clearly a disparity. The first states "sadba brahma will never descend", and the second "the potency of transcendental sound (sabda-brahma) is never minimized". Thus the statements are polar opposites. "Sabda-brahma will never descend" is a highly perplexing assertion. It seeks to place limitations upon sabda-brahma.
Ultimately, sabda-brahma is non-different from the All Pervasive Supreme Personality of Godhead. Are we to agree that Supreme Person in transcendental sound is somehow limited in His ability to manifest in the material sphere? When a tape of Srila Prabhupada is played, then we certainly hear the sound. If the sound is devoid of sabda-brahma as per the perplexing assertion, then are we to understand that we are listening to material sound? If the sound is pure glorification of the Supreme Lord, then how can it not be sabda-brahma?
How can glorification of the Supreme Lord be material? If the sound recorded by the tape player was initially sabda-brahma and then when the tape was played back was NOT sabda-brahma, then we are saying that the tape player has the potency to filter out the spiritual potency of the previous sabda-brahma. Thus the tape player is controlling and more powerful than sabda-brahma. Thus we assert that matter is more powerful than spirit. A basic tenet of Srila Rupa Goswami's yukta-vairagya philosophy is that material energy used in the service of the Lord becomes spiritualized. Thus in recording and playing back sabda-brahma the tape player must be admitted to be a transcendental entity.
Thus it is perfectly adequate to manifest the transcendental sabda-brahma. When we listen to a public lecture using microphone and speakers, then we are not getting sabda-brahma because some device made of the material energy is being employed? Are public lectures heard over microphone and speakers less potent for the usage of the amplification? Is there any fundamental difference between hearing a public lecture over microphone and speakers and hearing the same lecture later on a tape player? Has the potency been lost in time somehow? Thus again limiting the potency of sabda-brahma?
"Physical contact is required" is a loose statement. Perhaps it is meant as "physical presence is required" in the sense of proximity to the bodily form of the spiritual master. What is the suitable measurement of proximity to the body of the spiritual master? Is it one yard, or ten yards, or fifty yards? Does the potency decrease with material distance? If we accept "physical contact is required", then what is this "physical contact"? Lending one's vibrating eardrums to the tape is certainly "physical contact".
As far as the ear is concerned the "physical contact" of hearing from the tape player and hearing from the mouth of the guru is virtually the same… We are advised that of the two, vapu, bodily association, and vani, the words of Sri Guru, the vani of Sri Guru is the more important. The emphasis on "physical contact" runs in the face of this instruction. What if we receive the instruction of Sri Guru in written form in perhaps a letter that is fully potent sabda-brahma, as practiced for centuries by Vaisnavas?
If we receive the instruction of Sri Guru in tape form, is that not also fully potent? One might argue that receiving the tape and thus the vibrational sound of Sri Guru's voice is a fuller manifestation of Sri Guru than the written form of his words. Therefore, why should listening to the tapes of Sri Guru be denigrated in this way? "You must hear directly, not just by listening to tapes." This is a denigration of the recorded tapes of Sri Guru, according them a lesser status, and thus a highly ill-advised statement... "You must hear directly, not just by listening to tapes."
This statement creates the artificial, mundane and non-sastric distinction of hearing "directly" and hearing "indirectly" from Sri Guru. For the true transcendentalist this distinction is synthetic. For the devoted disciple, association with Sri Guru is absolute and transcendental, completely free from the illusory material dualities such as "direct" and "indirect". "Sabda-brahma will never descend through a tape."
This statement is, as discussed above, an attempt to place limitations upon the Absolute, Fully Potent sabda-brahma of the Supreme Lord. Its crass nature, devoid of any supportive sastric evidence, brings into question the depth of transcendental realization of the speaker. In Bhagavat Purana, 1.3.43, we find that Sri Krsna, having returned to His own abode, remains fully present in the Bhagavat Purana. Similarly, though Srila Prabhupada has entered the eternal pastimes of Sri Krsna, he remains in the form of his commentaries, books and tapes.
The order of Sri Guru is the Absolute Principle of Transcendental Life. Therefore if Sri Guru orders the method of initiation through a transcendental tape recording of his recitation of particular mantras, then that is to be accepted... as fully potent and bona fide.
Finally, we must glorify Srila Prabhupada for his brilliant perception of the transcendental usage of tape recordings, modern and new to his time. From his beginnings of ISKCON in New York, Srila Prabhupada pioneered the recording of his lectures. Nowadays, all Vaisnavas are using and receiving great benefit from hearing the fully potent sabda-brahma recordings and feeling absolute ecstatic association with Srila Prabhupada in this way, including no doubt the disciples of HH Gour Govinda Maharaja. May that sabda-brahma hearing continue eternally without any doubts as to the unlimited potency of such recordings." (Are Tape Recordings Sabda-brahma? By Rajiv Mohan Bhatta Goswami)
Mahabuddhi das: "Prabhupada was sitting on Vyasasana in Atlanta, and we were very close to him. And he was given mridanga to play. Prabhupada was playing mridanga. So he asked devotees, "Do you know Parama-koruna?" And we were kind of, "Yes, yes, yes, Prabhupada." And we'll sing along. So Prabhupada started the beat that no one knew. And I think that even now only Kardama Muni can sing it like that as Prabhupada did. And he would sing Parama-koruna, and then he said, "You follow", and no one could follow it, no one knew words.
There were like a hundred devotees but no one knew it, you know. So Prabhupada would sing through it and said, "Now are you ready to follow?" We said, "Yes". People were kind of ready to try and follow it. And so Prabhupada, as we were thinking, was ready to play. But Prabhupada sits up there and says, "Play the tape".
And so Prabhupada is sitting on the Vyasasana, and the tape is playing of Parama-koruna. And I was like, it was the first time when Prabhupada is there and his tape is playing now, and we were supposed to follow the tape. Then at that point he said, "Is there any difference? Between my tape and..." So he let us know that he is in his tape as much as he is speaking to us personally. So we can take great solace there.
His tapes have been recorded for the posterity. If we just listen to his tapes now, twenty years later, they are non-different than Prabhupada was speaking at that time. So when he spoke Bhagavatam classes, gave us darshans, he was speaking to millions of people throughout different generations to give them chance to hear these things." (Prabhupada Memories DVD 22, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLdN2dyfRQk)
Ex-guru of maya-ISKCON Rupanuga das, one of Srila Prabhupada's first disciples (but unfortunately he got captured by anti-ritvik illusions), also acknowledged, "Srila Prabhupada has completely invested himself in his books and lectures and I always tell others that hearing an audio from him is just as good as sitting in front of him at 26 Second Ave. There is absolutely (the right word) no difference, because I can attest to both experiences." (Letter from Rupanuga dasa to Dhira Govinda dasa, July 15, 2017)
In conclusion: It's well known that unauthorized maya-ISKCON guru Gour Govinda Swami, under the banner of sadhu-sanga (with emphasis on vapu-vada), associated with representatives of apa-sampradayas, such as Fakir Mohan, studied and quoted books of Fakir's guru Kanupriya Gosvami. The Gosvami was an open opponent of Bhaktisiddhanta Sarasvati and a jata gosai sahajiya, the author of a number of concocted ideas: Kalki-avatara would not come at the end of this Kali-yuga, "prema-yuga" would come in 1996, and then offences would disappear, etc.
Perhaps GGS got the idea that sabda-brahma is absent in Srila Prabhupada's audio recordings from such persons, or, being immersed in deep illusions regarding his position as pseudo-guru, he invented it himself. Anyway, the idea that Srila Prabhupada's audio recordings and books do not convey sabda-brahma, but instead the emphasis should only be on constant hearing from the mouth of a "living sadhu", is not only erroneous, but also very dangerous.
It leads to the conclusion that Srila Prabhupada is supposedly no longer the current acarya whose disciple one should become, that studying his books and audio/video recordings are not so important because there is supposedly no spiritual sound energy. This is fraught with deplorable consequences: devotees would lose interest in focusing on the books and lectures of Srila Prabhupada (which many in maya-ISKCON no longer have), that is, on obtaining genuine transcendental knowledge coming in bona fide sampradaya from the current acarya Srila Prabhupada.
They would not listen to his lectures, would not really know his books- "lawbooks for the next ten thousand years." Instead, they would seek out a "living guru", get to false gurus and fill their consciousness and the entire ISKCON with bogus ideas, thereby creating obstacles on the path of pure devotional service. This is what happens in maya-ISKCON.
KAILASA CHANDRA UPDATE:
Yes Henry is accurate, he is quoting you Kirtanananda guys like Kailasa who were -- and still are -- quoting Kirtanananda’s Berkeley followers. You are proving that you are Kirtanananda followers by saying we are drunks and sahajiyas, which is what Kirtanananda folks say, and you are his top followers since 1986.
And Sulochana said you would have him terminated by doing that. Why are you quoting and thus working with the bogus Jesus people? Yes Henry exposed what you were doing to get us terminated. We are agreeing with Henry on this, he said the Berkeley followers were calling us drunks and sahajiyas, and Sulochana said you guys did that to get him terminated, and you got him terminated just as he said you were doing.
We agree with Henry's book, he exposed how you guys got Sulochana terminated, you are Kirtanananda groupies, and you are still citing him now. No one else in the Bay Area is still citing Bhakti pedo pada-- you are the last hold outs. Why is Kailasa training his people to be puppets of -- and citers of -- Bhakti pedo pada?
And does that not prove that he is gloating that he helped trying to get us terminated, he is still citing the slogans he was using to get us terminated still today and now. Sulochana's mom says the people who are saying her son was an intoxicated sahajiya are gloating over contributing to his departure. Why is Kailasa gloating that he helps terminate Vaisnavas to save his pedo Jesus?
But even Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad / HKC Jaipur folks say we are drunk sahajiyas to save their pedo Jesus program. Does no one not notice, their pedo Jesus program is no longer accepted -- and they are basically trying to revive their old 1986 complaints against us, which no one accepts nowadays? ys pd
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