ISKCON Senior Men Syndrome // GHQ Pt. 2 // 06 23 26

You cannot have fun on your own, 

without inviting Me to the party.  

SPIRITUAL LIFE OR JUST RELIGION? THE TEST IS NOT WHO YOU KNOW.

(with PADA edits)  

In our ISKCON circles we have devotion of closeness to Srila Prabhupada. Or closeness to his "top devotees" or "spiritually advanced senior devotees" This abounds in ISKCON: one admires "who was with Srila Prabhupada," and "who was with who was with him." We are constantly liking the anecdotes and memories of fifty years ago, the inherited closeness. But our actual tradition calls for something much more demanding, closeness to the guru's vani or instructions.

Physical proximity is not the real connection. Srila Prabhupāda taught that there is association by vapu (presence) and by vani (his instructions), and that the vani seva -- following and continuing his mission — is what really binds us to him and his mission. Obviously, so many of the "troubles" that plague ISKCON spring from neglecting his orders, if not -- totally changing his orders -- into something that often does not even fit basic mundane moral principles. 

For example, protecting women and children is the first rule during the sinking of the Titanic. Whereas in ISKCON -- women and children are often left abandoned to fend for themselves, are left on the sinking ship to drown, and are really not well taken care of. Yet the elite men GBC guru rulers are given an opulent prince's castle lifestyle. And somehow or other, most of the senior men do not seem to understand how this is not Vedic society.

Just being around 50 years ago doesn't qualify one's spiritual status. Living and delivering the message does. Because spiritual life is no longer a religion made of being somewhere, or belonging to a group, or performing some dry ritual, or feeling of being with the old timers and seniors. It's a verifiable transformation of the heart. And the Bhagavatam gives proof, that it is not sectarian but mostly empirical:

"sa vai pumsam paro dharmo yato bhaktir adhokṣaje, ahaituky apratihatā yayātmā suprasīdati." Ritual without awakened love is just empty shell of service, often ending in spiritual and even material fatigue: srama eva hi kevalam" (SB 1.2. And thus the genuine follower is recognized by his spiritual character, not by credentials. 

In one who has pure devotion all the good qualities manifest themselves automatically (SB 5.18.12). Therefore the ācārya teaches by example: "What the great person does, others follow" (BG 3.21). This doesn't point at anyone who just has "senior status." There is a mirror for all. The question is not who you met, or when, or how old you are, or what position you held before, or hold now. It is: Do You Love Krishna More? Do you envy less? Will you taste the holy name? Do you serve without asking for anything in return?

Do we cultivate spiritual life, or just a comfortable religion made of good memories? But bad current life? Unfortunately, many or most of the ISKCON seniors helped steer the ISKCON Titantic into the iceberg. And then they either helped the elites save themselves by getting the best lifeboats, but not the women and children passengers. Or most of the seniors just abandoned ship and started to fight over the leftover life boat assets, leaving the women and children -- to drown in the water. 

The people who steered the boat wrongly, or abandoned ship, are not senior devotees. They are senior deviatiors. They abandoned the instructions of their guru, and should not thus be considered as "senior men." They did not perform their basic task to protect the society, its citizens, the good name of the mission etc. 

And anything of value that was not nailed down was stolen by the same people who were the drunken captains of the ship, as mostly the seniors looked on doing nothing to save the ship, the passengers, or the valued objects on the ship. They allowed all that to drown, so they could later on bask in the glory of "being the senior men" who helped all this ISKCON catastrophe happen. 

They never understood the vani, and thus their duty to guru, to the ISKCON ship, to the passengers, to the women and children, or even to the books that they allowed to be changed radically. Their duty to protect their guru and their guru's mission was never realized. They are not senior at anything, except going to sleep when the battle started.      

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6l-82zK2jTM

=================

IRAN VS USA

PADA: I think that USA is in a doom loop here. We cannot fail our end -- or they close it. As expected -- our end fails. They close it. We negotiate again. They open it again. We fail again. It is closed again -- ad infinitum. 

We seem to be unable to stop this ground hog day / deja vu all over again recurring. Meanwhile, we need millions and billions more dollars to keep our military over there, keeping an eye on all the anchored ships going nowhere. 

Iran is finally making a condition, all the negotiations have to be made in writing from those authorized as agents to negotiate. They are not going to negotiate with memes, midnight texts that were never agreed to in the original MOU, and random statements made by various people unrelated to the MOU. 

Good luck with that USA!

ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com

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GHQ PT. 2

I have already asked him (Drutakarma) and he hedged. So I doubt that you will get a positive response.
(Text 1737636) ———————————————

Text 1741718 (44 lines)
From: Krishna Kirti (das) HDG (Baltimore – USA)
Date: 03-Oct-98 19:53 +0000
Refernce: Text 1741212 by Rasananda Swami (USA)
To: GHQ [138]
Subject: DIS Core Strategy
————————————————————
2) Terminating the present Woman’s Ministry.

The feminism movement started with slow steps and now is becoming fast. I suggest we should be fast in our objectives, but we should not try to get all that we want right now. To try to terminate the WM would be too much at the moment. We should not be seen as women haters. Somebody suggested to put the WM under care of grhasthas. I prefer this suggestion.

Somehow or other the women’s ministry has to go. Putting it under care of grihasthas seems the easiest to accomplish.

PADA: Why shouldn't women have their own designated representation ministry, or GBC type committee to protect the well being of women in ISKCON? Pretty obvious why they should NOT have ANY representation -- many women have been exploited and employed as cash cows to support the opulent swamis and gurus. If they form a protective workers union, that would be bad for their task master gurus.

Often, when these women get older, or sometimes disabled, they are purged out of ISKCON with no benefits or support. A woman told me when she hurt her foot falling off a bus, she was kicked out of the temple by Mahanidhi swami. 

"We don't need cripples here." However, Mahanidhi was always eagerly on hand when she came back to the temple with her money collections, but he abandoned her when her cash hand outs stopped due to being injured. The temple did not take care of her injury either. And there are thousands of other stories like this one, often much worse. So yeah, women need and deserve a say in their fate in the ISKCON society. 

4) Feminist philosophy to be banned as materialistic, atheistic and mayavada. (We have to demonstrate this.) Any person advocating or propagating feminism in any way, shape, or form to be considered as seriously deviating from Srila Prabhupada teachings, Vaisnava siddhanta, and Vedic culture. They must resign all positions in ISKCON, and leave the movement. They can only return if it can be demonstrated that they are no longer infected with this pernicious disease. (This could be demonstrated by writing a paper refuting feminism, and preaching vigorously against feminism.)

PADA: OK well some of the advocates allegedly for women's uplifting are still leaders and gurus in ISKCON and none of them were removed. Of course, the theoretical expanded roles women would have -- are only partially uplifted -- because the male "women's advocate" swamis still have the main control. The women would be given some big official titles, on paper, but not much official actual control over anything of substance. 

The fundamental assumption of feminists (ISKCON or otherwise) is based on the “haves and have nots” idea of equality. As long as they do not enjoy all the perks of the priviledged, they see themselves as exploited. Or, they have desires to be exploiters.

PADA: Well yah, the swamis have all the perks and benefits and the peons, especially the women, do not. That is correct. Lots of women ended up with no shelter, some ended up retired in very crummy condition old folks homes, and no health care / retirement funds and etc. while the big swamis have servants, health care, travel expenses paid, opulent dwellings, nice vehicles, computers etc. 

Haves and have nots, exactly. One ex-book distributor collector woman here had no money or health care when she got stage 3 cancer, so I had to get her all signed up for SSI, Medicaid, hospital check ups and etc. Fortunately, we got her into a very nice hospital.

She would have otherwise died on the street with no help and nothing to support her situation. And when I visited her in the hospital, no GBC people or other officials, or even rank and file, ever visited her. They got their cash from their cash cow, and that was the end of the transaction. Bye!   

Our fundamental defense is that according to the Vedic tradition, a male is supposed to be obedient to guru and shastra, therefore his so-called dominence cannot be taken as exploitation. I think this should be our needle, but I can’t see how it is going to get smaller than a missile. Even if we only present this much, the feminists are going to scream bloody murder. As such, we might as well grab for all we can. That’s what they are doing, and they have made progress.

Your servant, Krishna-kirti das
(Text 1741718) ———————————————

PADA: But the male dominated society of ISKCON is not protecting many or most these women. Self evidently.

Text 1742107 (46 lines)
From: Shyamasundara (das) ACBSP (Florida Vedic College – USA)
Date: 04-Oct-98 01:03 +0000
Refernce: Text 1741212 by Rasananda Swami (USA)
To: GHQ [154]
Subject: DIS More strategy
————————————————————
2) Terminating the present Woman’s Ministry.

The whole reason that we are simultaneaously getting support from other influencial devotees is so that we can do a lot on the first blow. Not that we just show up with a paper. We will have powerful backing from GBC, TPs, Sannyasis and senior devotees. It will be these devotees who will give us the weight and momentum to do more than move in slow steps. 

They moved in slow steps because they had no backing. We can get backing quickly. They are creating it for us by alienating many devotees. So we just organize those devotees, let them know we are together, give them the philosophy to use and viola things happen faster than with the feminists when they started.

Other devotees see it that way too. Those in the middle we educate by distributing what we come with (papers) en-masse. We don’t want to be timid in our approach. We have to go for the rhinocirous. If we are too timid then this will give time to reorganize and counterattack from a stronger position. They are bound to counterattack but better if we can weaken their position as much as possible.

We can’t compromise on the truth.

PADA: Yeah the truth is that an illicit sex with men, women and children messiah's club is a toxic bio-hazard to women and children. And that is why they are no longer participating en masse. ys pd