ISKCON Splintering / Iran / Children? / Madhyam Guru / Rupanuga 09 07 26

PADA: ISKCON is splintering and disintegrating, even they are mentioning more and more. ys pd

PADA: Who knew? How about all the military experts in the previous administrations -- who said attacking Iran would be a disaster for the USA, and the world. The MAGA people just removed and fired anyone who does not agree with the actual military analysis of the experts. 

Now we have all sorts of food safety recalls going on left and right -- including my favorite frozen berries -- because the food safety people were all fired. And health services Robert Kennedy is announcing he is closing thousands of old age homes, because the Medicaid is only supposed to cover 100 days and most of them are living over 100 days. 

He said they are not dying fast enough. So lets make them homeless, and die on the street? So all this collectively looks like -- mis-managing, and it is no small amount of dangerous and cruel too. 

When the government says, our citizens are not dying fast enough, that sort of sounds like diabolical Orwellian novel writing? So the MAGA people don't like those calling them out on these things, hey just like ISKCON does not like those of us calling them out on their things! But this is always the same process with these neo-cons, we are going to carpet bomb Iran, Iraq, Gaza, Lebanon, Syria, Afghanistan etc. and "win." Win what? 

ys pd 

angel108b@yahoo.com   

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WHAT ABOUT THE CHILDREN?

At the largest Hare Krishna community in North America, on one of the largest holidays - Anapayini Jakupko spoke about the children of ISKCON. The survivors of the past, the current "children" who are all grown up, and the children she has, sees, and works with everyday at her school. She asked some hard questions and I am incredibly grateful; and hopeful that our society keeps this conversation at the forefront.

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MADYAM GURU UPDATE

​ @Hasya-rati Yes, Srila Prabhupada said all of us would eventually initiate our own disciples, but he never implemented that. We do not know if they would have been ritviks or what? It was never done. Nor was a Madhyam guru implemented.

He said a lot of things, including that the Madhyam is insufficient guidance, he has to be careful (because he can fail), has no brahmana tejyas, he is a potential asura etc. So we are sticking with worship of the uttama, and we are not going to worship the GBC and Kailasa potential asuras.

I find it rather odd that the GBC announced that Kailasa wrote their Madhyam guru paper, and ever since then the Kailasa people want me to distribute the same writings the GBC is promoting. The Kailasa people have no idea, I am not hand in glove with the GBC?

The answer to the question is simple, he said a lot of things, and he also said the guru must be an uttama, resident of Krishna loka, Krishna lingita vigraha, a personal associate of Krishna, and thousands of similar quotes. But yeah, Kailasa wants us to worship a potential asura, and so does the GBC.

Meanwhile Kailasa cannot name his alleged Madhyam, so he is literally arguing about the non existing nothingness, which is mayavada. He does not even have a name for this guru, which means he is arguing about the non-existing nothingness, which is mayavada.

At least the ritviks have an actual name for their actual guru and they do not promote worship of no one and nothing. Worship of no one and nothing is not our system and it is amazing Kailasa does not know that. All glories to nothing is mayavada. Why is Kailasa telling our people to stop worship of the pure devotee, and worship -- nothing? ys pd

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I already cited Srila Prahbupada, he said the Madhyam is insufficient guidance, he cannot take sins, he does not have brahmana tejyas, he might become an asura, etc.. That is what he says. And it is self evident Kailasa wants to promote people who can become asuras as gurus, because the GBC circulates his papers. You keep asking me to cite Srila Prabhupada and I have over and over.

Agreed. A person who can become an asura has not fallen yet, but he can, the potential is there. So Kailasa wants people to gamble that maybe his Madhyam will not fail, maybe he will, this is called speculation. The premise is that a Madhyam is not recommended and the Nectar of Instruction says we should only accept an uttama. OK that means do not accept Kailsa's idea that we should worship potential asuras and follow the Kailasa writings distributed by the GBC. 

I have no idea why you want us to follow the writings distributed by the GBC, we are not their followers? Srila Prabhupada says the guru must be a resident of Krishna loka, a potential asura is not a resident of Krishna loka. Why don't you know these things?

Even our basic bhaktas know, a person who can become an asura should not be worshiped when they are already worshiping and utttama. Why do you want them to stop worship of the uttama and worship potential asuras? And don't you see how much trouble you cause with this idea?

I also said I agree 100% with Kailasa, the people who promote persons who can fail and fall are called sahajiyas. They do not worship the liberated uttama, and that is why they are sahajiyas. He is right. ys pd

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LAST LETTER FROM RUPANUGA PRABHU

The last letter that I received from Rupanuga, who disappeared two days back, was a message that he mailed a few months ago to all the devotees in his e-group. I do not have that that letter any longer, but in it he was objecting to the unique "dancing" form of Shrimati Radha at Columbus "ISKCON," whose dancing pose appears (also to me) somewhat bent or awkward.

I was the TP of Columbus for a few months in 1971 after the sankirtan accident that killed Jananivas, who founded the original temple, and which left me paralyzed for a time. Naturally, I congratulate the Indian congregation there in Columbus for progressing Prabhupada's movement. However, it appears to be a totally Hinduized socio-religious enterprise. Of course, it would be too much to ask any member there to show any interest in the history and struggle of how the temple came to be originally.

As expected of the Indians in the West, they seem absolutely incapable of following Prabhupada's example of convincing Westerners -- white, black, or Hispanic -- of the message of Bhagavad-gita As It Is as Guru Maharaja convinced us. From the website, it appears that ISKCON Columbus has unapologetically morphed into another center of Hinduized "Krishna consciousness" where "I'm OK and you're OK" as long as we bob and wiggle our heads, smiling in friendly agreement.

Was Rupanuga's criticism of the dancing Radha correct? Malati wrote on the thread that she strongly disagreed with him. Please share your thoughts in the comments. ISKCON Columbus website:
https://youtu.be/CVTxh2sRKcs?is=RwBu8wlBwAPZGJBn

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Srila Prabhupada beloved disciple, RUPANUGA PRABHU has left this earth.

A great soul has departed.

My humble obeisances to feet of Rupanuga prabhuji.

I appreciate sincerity of his dedicated services, love over 60 years, initial GBC member, to spread Srila Prabhupada Hare Krishna movement. If he decides to come back on this Earth to protect Srila Prabhupada movement, I love to be his servant & dedicate my entire life to help him. Radha Shayamsunderji has plan for this pure Vaishnava.

Please listen his interview video. He cried few times just remembering Srila Prabhupada. He answered very serious questions very politely & precisely.
Watching become emotional towards eternity. Love shall be bonded between Srila Prabhupada & us. All Glories to Srila Prabhupada Hare Krishna

G Dasi 

A Dasi

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BOOK CHANGES

John Yadunandan Das: "Adopting the revised books has involved a choice to accept some official decree as if Srila Prabhupada's works are some mundane scholarship like the continually updated Oxford English Dictionary. Imagine having a great work of architecture and then changing it to suit a preference of style, such as modernizing a Gothic structure until it looks like a warehouse, all while claiming it to be the design of the original architect. In the publishing world it is not acceptable to rewrite a book while calling it the same book. 

Such an act is ludicrous. An annotated edition can leave the text untouched. To eliminate paintings is further unacceptable. The posthumous editing amounts to viewing oneself as a sort of co-author, equal to the author, and entitled to make changes."
I have posted about Rupanuga Prabhu's departure, He was against the post humous book changes. I received a first-class comment from Yadunandan Prabhu. No slander, name calling, demonizing, etc... He nails it and demonstrtes that those who are against the post humous book changers don't have to resort to ad hominems. Well done Yadunandan Prabhu! ~ Gaura dasa
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Rupanuga Prabhu covers many topics in this monumental discussion. 

He reads from his essay entitled: A LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE OF THE WORLD TODAY Rupanuga das, ACBSP. A LOOK AT THE BIG PICTURE OF THE WORLD TODAY According to Srila Prabhupada-vani, “At present, this world is being managed by the Raksasas. The Raksasas are man-eaters who eat their own sons (p. 41 Raja-Vidhya)," and "At present, especially on this planet earth, the influence of Lord Brahma has decreased considerably and the representatives of Hiranyakasipu—the Raksasas and demons –have taken charge. 

"Therefore there is no protection of brahminical culture and cows, which are the basic prerequisites for all kinds of good fortune. This age is very dangerous because society is being managed by demons and Raksasas (SB 7.3.13, end of purport).” 

Years ago, in college student days, having read a popular “underground” book, entitled “None Dare Call It Conspiracy,” which in essence indicated that the world was being controlled and manipulated by a few extremely wealthy and powerful families, and having later read the above quote in Srila Prabhupada’s Raja-vidya, two devotees approached Srila Prabhupada (circa 1974) at his quarters in Mayapur Dham. 

Some of the names mentioned in “None Dare Call It Conspiracy” were still very much influential in the world, and he was asked if the these were the Raksasas he was referring to? Srila Prabhupada replied, “Yes.” These Raksasas are not passive. Their well-evolved matrix or infrastructure of control covers the whole planet and their minions are involved in every aspect of modern societies and nations, including political, scientific, legal, educational, economic, military, etc. --endeavors all around the world—an international, very deep state. 

Absolute control, mastership, over whatever they survey, is the goal of the Raksasa agenda, at any cost, and their seemingly unlimited financial strength is a means to that end. “Now great regimes have been created to smash so many people for the satisfaction the Raksasa’s senses (p.41).” 

And this smashing is coming in so many ways besides war, and it will come to that also, if what’s described below continues. The current global chaos is being revealed or unfolded as an epic story of karma and the laws of material nature. Since the time of Lord Buddha, 2600 years ago, who appeared primarily to stop (ahimsa) cow killing in an India much greater in size than today, those slaughterhouses have now covered the globe. In addition, facilities have been constructed for billions of innocent land animals and sea creatures to be slaughtered annually. 

Over the centuries, the world has become a killing field. The free-will of human beings has brought all this about simply for the satisfaction of the human tongue. The propaganda that one must eat meat or flesh, including fish and eggs, in order to be strong and healthy, is contradicted in nature. 

The strongest animals on earth, namely the gorilla, the elephant, the hippopotamus and the giraffe are all vegetarians. (One video demonstrated how a giraffe easily kicked a pursuing lion high in the air!) The killing field includes human abortions. It may be uncertain which of the many human abortions are abortions of those who themselves caused abortions in the past, like parents or surgeons, who are getting their just karma. In any case, Srilla Prabhupada comments (L.A., 5/26/72 lecture SB 2.3.9): “…that one chance given that it will get a body and come out, and may be able to come to Krishna consciousness, that opportunity is lost … he’s being killed within the womb.” 

Undoubtedly, much karma is coming upon the people of the world for the millions upon millions of abortions each year. Another thing is certain: the dairy cows and all the other animals and sea creatures being slaughtered every moment are innocent! It is not their karma. Dairy cows are meant to take birth in their next life as human beings in the mode of goodness. In Vedic culture, the cow and bull are considered one’s mother and father. And as Lord Chaitanya criticized the Kazi, “What is this religion that allows killing of the father and mother?” 

In a real sense, is not killing and eating such a father and mother another cannibalism? So much free-will killing of children and innocent creatures has not been sanctioned, what to speak of the many offenses to mother nature, in the name of progress and industrialization? It’s over. The karmic pay-back is here. The modes of material nature rule, and “As ye sow, so shall ye reap.” Devotees are in the karma and vikarma world, but not of it. During a lecture in Hawaii, 1/23/74, SB 11.16.26-30, Srila Prabhupada explained, “Trying to avoid offenses, that is namabhas. 

Namabhas means not actually pure name, but almost pure…In namabhas stage, not pure, marginal, between pure and offensive, there is mukti, you become mukta, liberated from material bondage.” This means beyond the control of the karmas which control the general population and pseudo devotees. He goes on to explain that such a sincere chanter, although sometimes a little mechanical, by force, still he is not a showbottle. This means such a devotee is beyond the pale of the present karmic interactions, actors and demands. 

He / she must use intelligence regarding one’s own health, as Srila Prabhupada once said, “The duration of life is our most precious possession.” Since Raksasas are in control according to Srila Prabhupada, therefore, anything being promoted by those in charge of communications or programs as being for the greater good, well being, or benefit of anyone should simply be seen as the opposite of the truth. 

The Raksasas identified by His Divine Grace, are cannibals eating their own sons, and doubtless the sons of others when they ran out of their own. Policies implemented by these predators and their followers must be ignored as conspiracies and circumvented. Research concerning the truthfulness or falsity of circumstances surrounding Covid-19 is correct, if it leads to exposure of the sinister agenda of the Raksasas. In other words, if the sinister agenda of the Raksasa’s operating principle is behind everything-- according to Srila Prabhupada-- then the world-wide implementation of the inoculations is sinister, since nothing that extensive could be beyond the Rakshasa’s control. 

Common sense. Therefore, devotees are beyond any proposed universal obligation to accept inoculations. Never mind the claims of politicians and professionals who insist otherwise, because they are leaders blind to messages of Srila Prabhupada intended for everyone’s benefit. And devotees advising against this explanation should be avoided. 

The Raksasas and their minions believe they are in control, but actually they themselves are under the control of the modes of material nature. They are behaving as expected, and simultaneously acting as delivery systems for global karma. In effect, there is a cleansing process going on world-wide to prepare or clear the path for Lord Caitanya’s Movement, in this year 535 Gaurabda, the Golden Age. At the same time, there is a “boiling of the milk” going forward within that Movement, a boiling which Srila Prabhupada began prior to his disappearance. 

As long as the slaughterhouses remain open, the cleansing and “culling” of the general population will continue. The “boiling of the milk” will also continue as needed. Hare Krishna. All glories to Srila Prabhupada, the World Acarya. Your servant, Rupanuga das (ACBSP’66). Please forward to interested parties. Thank you. 

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With regards to completing the Bhagavatam, I remembered that Pradyumna prabhu said Srila Prabhupada asked Pradyumna prabhu to complete the Bhagavatam , in his absence, and if he had any questions, to take the guidance of BR Sridhara deva Maharaja: Pradyumna Prabhu: Prabhupada called me in when he was getting a mas- sage. He asked me, “So, in my absence, you can complete the Srimad-Bhagavatam?” I said, “Yes, Prabhupada I’ll try to do that.” “Yes,” he said, “Okay, good.” I said, “If I have questions, I could ask Sridhar Maharaj?” 

He said, “Yes, you can ask him questions, yes, that’s good.” I was right there in the Krishna-Balaram Temple in Vrindavan, but I wasn’t around Prabhupada too much in the final weeks, because for the final part of the Bhagavatam, Prabhupada asked me to do the verse translations, and that took all my time. I would read all the commentaries, translate the verse, do the synonyms, and then read it to Prabhupada. 

Then we would hold the microphone to his lips, and he would dictate the purport. That’s how the last volume was produced, and that kept me occupied because I had to have everything ready to read. It would take a lot to make sure it was right. After I read it I would go back to my room to work on the next verses. 

Anytime Prabhupada was ready to do more, I had to be ready. I couldn’t say, “I’m not ready,” because that would mean a Bhagavatam verse and purport that people wouldn’t have. So for the last weeks, that’s basically what I was doing. I was in the compound, but I was always translating as fast as I could. Read more: https://vanipedia.org/wiki/Pradyumna_das_Remembers_Srila_Prabhupada#ixzz7MgOd558a

PADA: To PADA it looks like the rakshasa man eating, children exploiting etc. society is the GBC gurus process : Which Rupanuga supported against me and Sulochana. 

They are asking for donations for his funeral, at least it looks like he separated himself from ISKCON later on and the GBC is not funding his ending ceremony. I think he partially came to the right idea, but he just could not admit that Srila Prabhuada IS THE ACHARYA for all of us, and for everyone else. 

It is not a special senior devotee club, which is rapidly heading toward the graveyard. Srila Prabhupada should have been the acharya us and for the newcomers, and we wasted several generations not making him the acharya. ys pd   

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PADA VS RUPANUGA DASA: 

The next problem is with Rupanuga, he now says formal initiation is no longer required. Don't even worry about it! Everybody should accept that Srila Prabhupada is the the SHIKSHA guru of ISKCON, and now we do not need to worry about for example, having trained up Brahmanas to conduct deity worship, there won't be any more trained up Brahmanas, because the whole process of initiating [as required for deity pooja] stops.

We no longer require initiated persons to conduct the deity program -- at all? Yep! No one needs to be initiated to do the function of deity pooja anymore! Srila Prabhupada installed all of these deities, with the idea that the Brahmanas who worshiped them would all die off and there would be no one to replace them? And that is what has happened, most USA temples have a severe shortage of deity personnel.     

What happens then, we put all the deities into boxes and warehouse storage?
I'm not sure where Srila Prabhupada said that the deity worship should no longer be conducted after he departs, or that it no longer requires trained up initiated Brahmanas to conduct the program? Rather, this seems like another eccentric concoction from these people. Worse, this makes it sound like Rupanuga really wants Krishna's worship to be STOPPED entirely. We will no longer have His worship or pooja going on? Where is this ordered?

First of all, Rupanuga said we need to take initiation from his 11 conditioned souls acharyas, like Kirtanananda swami. And Rupanuga adamantly supported the idea that these conditions souls can act as another Jesus - like sin absorbing Messiah. Did we forget to mention, that concocted scheme didn't seem to work out very well for Rupanuga and his pals?

And so now he's sour grapes, lets end all diksha, and he is changing his tune, by saying there is no need for any formal initiation process at all. So now, there is not going to be any source of "divyam jnanam which destroys sins" (diksha) in ISKCON. Then, how can people make progress, if there is no source of divyam jnanam which destroys their sins (diksha)? 

Never mind, we won't even have deity pooja going on anymore either, because we will chop off the whole process of initiating poojaris? And who will cook for the deity if there are no initiated people to do that? Krishna has to starve now?

Srila Prabhupada says that Jesus is accepting the sins of his followers even now, but Rupanuga says -- there's no need for people to have their sins absolved anymore. They'll just keep their sins, and, stay here in the material world? So it seems like Rupanuga simply wants to keep the mass of people stuck here, trapped here in the meshes of suffering, death and MAYA, with no escape plan.

How will people be liberated when we say they no longer need "knowledge which destroys sins," aka diksha? How is that going to work? How can we have a religion based on -- we are no longer going to give the knowledge which destroys sins (diksha)?

Look at any religion, they have a path to get knowledge (di -- divyam jnanam) to destroy the sins (ksha) for their followers. How can anyone approach God unless they are getting knowledge which destroys their sins? Rupanuga is making no sense at all, he has changed up the entire Vedic process.

The ACTUAL process for today, and forever actually, is to get knowledge which destroys sins. That is how we approach this issue, it cannot be changed. Worse, the next problem with Rupanuga is that he defies another of Srila Prabhupada's direct instructions, Srila Prabhupada says that neophytes CANNOT absorb sins like Jesus, but Rupanuga encouraged all sorts of his conditioned soul God brothers to take the post of diksha gurus and to ABSORB sins left, right and center.

A diksha guru has to be as qualified as Jesus, to absorb these sins. Rupanuga has never explained how or where Srila Prabhupada made this proclamation, that henceforward, neophytes could absorbs sins just like Jesus? When was this order given?

In fact, Srila Prabhupada said the exact opposite! He said that when we neophytes act as diksha gurus and absorb sins, we will be overwhelmed by these sins, and because of that, these neophytes will eventually fail, they will fall down, get sick or both, and of course if a person gets sick enough he DIES.

Rupanuga's plan to save his God brothers, and the world?

We find no indication that Rupanuga can substantiate his claim that our neophytes can absorb sins like Jesus? This "order" was never made by Srila Prabhupada. Isn't Rupanuga's encouraging neophytes to absorb sins killing his God brothers both spiritually and even materially?

Sorry! We only find evidence of the opposite instruction, that it is not feasible nor possible for neophytes to take up other's sins and dispose of them. Rather, they are going to fall down, get sick and / or DIE, it then seems like Rupanuga is harming if not KILLING his God brothers by telling them they are as qualified as Jesus. This is then causing these brothers to fail, if not die.

Now in the Christian religion they claim that their source of spiritual knowledge and the source of having one's sins washed away or absorbed is Jesus. Rupanuga says that in ISKCON we have no such source of this function, that's it, its all over now. The only good news is that he is admitting that his previous directive of telling neophyte people to take sins and act as diksha gurus was a BAD IDEA, and he has caused many people to get sick, fall down if not DIE, by encouraging them on the WRONG path.

When is Rupanuga just going to admit, his ideas are bogus and harmful?