Chandrashekhar / Cyril Wohrer / "Wearing Pants." 04 07 26

 

HIS REPLY:

CYRIL WOHRER to PADA:

Hey, since you called my argument, “Lame,“ then perhaps I can request you not to write to me again, since a man convinced against his will as of the same opinion still. And I don’t know how long it’s been since you’ve been to Los Angeles, but you are a little bit behind the times to say the least. All the best. Please don’t write back.

PADA: Various supporters of the Auschwitz for kids pedophile messiah's program regularly block me, since 1978. Nothing surprises me these days. I am not behind the times, Los Angeles temple still promotes Jayapataka, founder father of the Auschwitz for kids project. 

The LA temple just did a Vyasa pooja for JPS recently -- and I posted the photos. And you are claiming the Lokanath fan club's dress codes is dangerous, when the Lokanath guy you cite is promoting Lokanath, a pedophile messiah. Promoting pedophiles as messiahs is not the problem, because in their program children are found being starved, beaten and raped, and dissenters are being banned, beaten, sued and killed, pants are the problem! Told ya!

Yeah you do not have any explanation, that is fine. We will explain it for you.

 ys pd 

Chandrashekhar Cyril Wohrer, also known as Cyril Wohrer, is a public intellectual and Bhakti yoga teacher with a Master's in Religion from Oxford. He has been actively involved in discussions regarding ISKCON's adaptation to Western culture and has criticized the movement for its perceived lack of inclusivity and management practices. Wohrer has been vocal about the challenges faced by ISKCON in the West, emphasizing the need for societal adjustments to facilitate better integration and participation among its members.

PADA: This Cyril Wohrer fellow got off to a bad start with PADA when he told me "I have no idea who you are and I don't want to know." Well of course, he hangs out with Hrdayananda ilk and the other leaders of their Auschwitz for kids / homosexual and pedophile messiahs club. And he writes all the time about how we should allow people to wear pants in ISKCON -- if we want to attract people back to the society and re-populate the empty temples, which is Hrdayananda's main idea. Pants ki-jaya sir!

OK but his mentor Hrdayananda is the main person who orchestrated making the temples emptied out -- by forcing the society to worship their "illicit sex with men, women and children as acharyas" project. Hrdayandanda is also worldwide famous for helping re-instate Bhavananda as "Vishnupada" in 1986, at the same time it was well known Bhavananda was having oral sex with taxi drivers IN THE DHAM -- and he has been the main kingpin organizer of the Auschwitz for kids project especially in Mayapur. 

Hrdayananda's program simultaneously in 1986 excommunicated and demonized Sulochana (and me too de facto) which made Sulochana a target for assassination, and he was assassinated. And I too would have been assassinated by the Hrdayananda guru's fan club -- without help from the FEDS. And later I was in Los Angeles suing the Hrdayananda program for $400,000,000 while he was giving me the evil stink eye and avoiding me, and only talking to his lawyer pals all the time on Watseka. 

And they were getting the temple bouncers to follow me around and intimidate me. And that is why the LAPD police officers told me to AVOID WATSEKA, because these [Hrdayananda] people WANT TO KILL YOU. But it is all about pants, honest! 

OK their program demonizes anyone who is not promoting their homosexual and pedophile messiah's club. And they have us "dissenters" banned, beaten, sued and maybe killed -- and that chases people away in droves. And that is why the temples are empty and dissenters do not participate, they are not allowed to. Nor do they want to participate.

So a guy like Hrdayananda, whose program has to be sued for for $400,000,000 for orchestrating mass child abuse "in every nook and cranny of ISKCON" according to some victims, is now telling people the whole problem is - we do not allow people to wear pants in the temples. But there are almost no people in the temples of any stripe, either wearing pants, dhotis or any other national dress because -- the mass of people already rejected their homosexual and pedophile messiah's Auschwitz for kids program a long time ago and they jettisoned coming to ISKCON. 

OK a few Hindus might show up at the ISKCON temples on Sunday. And the Hindu men who come there mainly dress in pants for the most part. So the pants program is already accepted and allowed. But wearing pants is not -- and never was -- the issue. 

Some new age couple at the health food store said to me -- it is obvious why we can never attend ISKCON. It is self evidently a haven for criminals, pedophiles, and violent thug people. OK like Los Angeles' temple thug enforcer Ratnabushana etc. and the other pedophile messiah's enforcers -- those who support and protect the pedophile messiah's project. But none of this has caused the mass exodus from ISKCON? 

Then Chandrashekhar says Krishna Chaitanya swami is making a dangerous dress code for ISKCON, and that is the problem. OK except Krishna Chaitanya swami is always associated with, and promoting, Lokanath swami, a known pedophile who aggressed a 11 years old girl. In other words they are promoting pedophile's worship, which is not acceptable in human society. But dressing members of the pedophile messiah's project in dhotis or pants is the whole "dangerous issue." 

Sorry! No one cares if the pedophile messiah's society wear pants, dhotis or polka dot bikinis, no one wants to go there. Notice, Chandrashekhar is worried about the dangers of not wearing pants, and not the dangers of their program's worshiping pedophiles as messiahs, which subsequently bans, beats, molests, sues and kills Vaishnavas.

Many people, probably hundreds, write my blog telling me how disgusting it is that ISKCON promotes known pedophiles as its acharyas, and helps bury their previous homosexual and / or pedophile acharyas in samadhis in the holy dham -- like Kirtanananda. 

Chandrashekhar seems to have no idea, a society that worships pedophiles as God's successors will fail to attract any sane, moral, normal, rational, and civilized human beings. Then Chandrashekhar says he is going to the Svavasa Los Angeles ISKCON temple, where the founder father of the homosexual and pedophile messiah's club -- Jayapataka -- is worshiped there as acharya -- and JPS is the main leader of the Auschwitz for kids project in Mayapur. 

When Jayapataka saw me at the LA temple he angrily ran across the street towards me -- yelling and grunting like a wounded animal "raaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhrrrrrrr." He cannot even speak one word of English to explain why he is promoting his homosexuals and pedophiles as acharya's process. And Chandrashekhar also got angry with me? Instead of saying, wow, this pedophile pooja is a bad idea, they get angry at their program being exposed. And then the vulture glares -- and maybe baseball bats -- eventually come out.

JPS is the main acharya of the LA temple, and the main head honcho of Auschwitz for kids. So the leader of their anal reconstructive surgery for kids epidemic messiah's club, Jayapataka, is worshiped there are God's successor. But that is not an issue, wearing pants is the issue. 

A guy like JPS who can only yell, shout and make animal grunting noises is the acharya of the Jagat, because we challenged his illicit sex with men, women and children guru program that is also famous as Auschwitz for kids. And that is why some ex-kid victims in LA were telling me, we were abused in Mayapur and the temple here WORSHIPS the leaders of the program that abused us. OK the victims, probably in the thousands, are not worried about wearing pants or dhotis, they are gone from the society. 

One of the victims came to the Los Angeles temple, saw how his child beater and abuser Dhanurdar was being worshiped and glorified at the LA temple, and he went home and took his life. Does this victim -- or any other victim -- care if Dhanurdara is dressed in dhoti, pants, or ballet tutu dress. Nope. 

And we know of a number of other cases of victims taking their lives, and some who are suffering near fatal ailments NOW from taking drugs and abusing their health due to all the trauma. Some are in an out of hospitals etc. when they are only maybe 40-50 years old. A number of these victims now have cancer etc. 

OK! Many of them are fried, toasted, upset, angry, traumatized, they get little to no help, they are taking their own lives, or their lives are ending prematurely from the trauma now giving them fatal health issues, and all that is because -- they cannot wear pants in the temple?  

Why are they not participating in ISKCON? Is it because they have to wear a dhoti? Nope. This is a bait and switch program, we made thousands of children victims of abuse, and in a number of cases beatings and rapes, and they are not in ISKCON now -- because they want to wear pants? This is minimizing the victim's suffering. 

And when people see guys like Chandrashekhar giving these lame minimizing and apologist excuses for why the temples are emprty, it simply pours vinegar on their wounds. It is trivializing their suffering as some sort of wearing pants problem, when their society of orchestrated starving, beating, molesting and raping children, and worshiping the founder fathers of that process has been -- and still is -- the REAL problem and has been all along. Not pants! 

There is one good news where we have to give Chandrashekhar credit. He cites this:           

“This should be strictly outlawed, no more sannyasis. And those sannyasis who have fallen, you get them married, live like a... No more this showbottle, cheating. It is very ludicrous. Even there is a promise that "We shall not fall down again," that is also not believable. What is the use? Better go and speak philosophy in your grihastha dress, not this dress [saffron robes], but you have nice coat, pants, gentleman. Who says no? I never said. Rather I shall be glad to see that up-to-date gentlemen with tilaka and sikha are speaking. That is very prestigious everywhere. Why this false dress? What is the wrong to become grihastha?” (Srila Prabhupada, Room Conversation, January 7, 1977) 

"This is what we want, to preach in American dress. We should be known as 'American Krishnas.' (Satsvarupa Goswami, quoted in "Prabhupada Nectar") 

"Those who, *even while remaining situated in their established social positions,* throw away the process of speculative knowledge and with their body, words and mind offer all respects to descriptions of Your personality and activities, dedicating their lives to these narrations, which are vibrated by You personally and by Your pure devotees, certainly conquer Your Lordship, although You are otherwise unconquerable by anyone within the three worlds. (Srimad Bhagavatam 10.14.3)

PADA: Yep, we can preach dressed in pants, dhotis, ballet tutus, Santa Claus costumes, or whatever we like. But when people are "preaching" that their homosexual and pedophile messiah's club is bona fide, no one cares what those preachers are wearing. They are preaching evil and Satanic ideas, which is causing no small amount of harm to children, and is destroying ISKCON in the process. 

And this is the real reason the temples are empty. Blaming pants on this situation is acting as an apologist for the situation, it is making things worse. Yep. You and / or your peers were starved, beaten and raped, and you are no longer in ISKCON, because -- you cannot wear pants? WTF? 

This is intentional gaslighting, diluting, covering up and making a mockery of the real problem. And this is how the problem was covered up the whole time, and still is now, causing extreme peril to all the children on planet earth. 

Sulochana said -- "it does not matter how much sugar you add to the sweet rice. Once you put a piece of dog manure into the sweet rice, no one will want to take it. And worshiping homosexuals and pedophiles as acharyas is like placing dog manure in the sweet rice. Except, it is WAY worse than putting dog manure into the sweet rice, because it places children into severe danger." 

Yep, also places Sulochana in danger ...

And that is the real reason why the Hrdayananda program had to get rid of Sulochana. And for the record Sulochana was wearing pants when they killed him, because he was not wearing pants or a dhoti while promoting pedophile's worship, like this program has been doing all along since 1978, and still is now.    

ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com

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THE DILUTION OF STANDARDS IN ISKCON: The concerns raised regarding the dilution of standards in ISKCON—including dress code changes, lax temple etiquette, and deviations from established practices—highlight a significant, ongoing tension within the movement.

Many senior devotees and traditionalists share these concerns, arguing that ISKCON is drifting from the strict standards set by its founder-acharya, A.C. Bhaktivedanta Swami Srila Prabhupada. Here is a breakdown of the issues mentioned based on current discussions within the movement:

* Dress Codes (Saris and Western Clothing): While tradition emphasizes saris for women and dhotis for men to maintain a distinct, non-materialistic identity, some temples and devotees have adopted more relaxed approaches, particularly for those living outside the temple ashram. However, official guidelines maintain that saris are "spiritual uniforms" that help maintain focus, and revealing dress is considered taboo.

* Male Devotees with Long Hair/Beards: Srila Prabhupada instructed male devotees to be clean-shaven to distinguish themselves from the hippie culture of the 1960s/70s and to show detachment from bodily beauty. While some argue that keeping hair is not a barrier to internal devotion, the formal rule for residents of ISKCON temple ashrams is to be clean-shaven.

* Temple Etiquette and Behavior:Public displays of affection, such as kissing in a temple room, are generally considered inappropriate by Vaishnava etiquette, which requires the temple room to be a place of focused worship.

* "Mood of Vrindaban" and Program Changes: The "mood of Vrindaban" is sometimes invoked to justify deviations from structured programs. However, Srila Prabhupada emphasized disciplined, structured daily programs (like the Sunday Feast and early morning morning services) as the foundation for practicing bhakti-yoga.

* ISKCON and Hinduism: ISKCON is fundamentally part of the Gaudiya Vaishnava tradition, which worships Krishna as the Supreme Personality of Godhead, not just a "blue boy God" of mythology.

* ISKCON presents itself as a spiritual science intended for all people regardless of birth, rather than a cultural identity restricted to Indian, regional, or caste lines.

* Demographic Shift: While early members were mostly young Western seekers, a significant portion of contemporary support—both in financial terms and temple attendance—now comes from the Indian immigrant community.

* Social Accommodation: As the movement matured, it moved away from its "rugged" fringe status toward becoming a socially accommodated organization for the middle class, resembling a traditional established religion.

* Cultural Integration: Indian devotees often bring their own cultural conditionings and broader religious perspectives, which can sometimes overshadow the specific Gaudiya Vaishnava traditions emphasized by founder Srila Prabhupada.
Debates Within the Movement

The trend toward hinduization is a point of contention among some senior devotees:

* Loss of Mission: Critics worry that focusing on the needs of the existing Hindu community (such as providing ritual services) has come at the expense of "preaching to the locals" and original outreach activities like book distribution.

* The "Hindu" Label: Srila Prabhupada often stated that Krishna Consciousness is a universal spiritual science (sanatana dharma) and not "Hinduism," which he sometimes viewed as a generic and misunderstood term.

* Western Identity: Some argue that ISKCON's primary purpose was to convert Westerners, and they view hinduization as a deviation from that original pioneering edge.

Regarding the desire to maintain the original, high standards, this point echoes the sentiment that the movement should focus on having one pure "moon" (a sincere disciple) rather than many "stars" (numerous, but less dedicated followers).

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MISUSING THE INDEPENDENCE GIVEN AND DISOBEYING THE ORDER OF KRSNA FORCE ONE TO BECOME A VICTIM OF MAYA.

His Divine Grace A.C.Bhaktivedantaswami Prabhupada:

So brahmādayaḥ, Brahma is ādi, ādi-kavi. He was instructed by Kṛṣṇa, tene brahma ādi-kavaye. Lord Kṛṣṇa, He instructed Brahma to spread knowledge, Vedic knowledge, all over the universe. Tene. Tene means broadcasted, expanded. So tene brahma, brahma means śabda-brahma, Vedas. Hṛda, one may question how Brahma was instructed. So that is also stated, hṛda. Hṛda means from within the heart.

So, therefore, Kṛṣṇa is also caitya-guru, a guru, spiritual master, within the heart. Sarvasya cāhaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭhaḥ. In the Bhagavad-gītā, Kṛṣṇa says that "I am situated in everyone's heart." Sarvasya ca ahaṁ hṛdi sanniviṣṭaḥ. Sarvasya cāham hṛdi sanniviṣṭo mattaḥ smṛtir jñānam apohanaṁ ca (BG 15.15). "From Me one can remember, one can forget." How is that? Kṛṣṇa helps one to remember and one helps..., He helps one to forget.

That is also replied in the Bhagavad-gītā, ye yathā māṁ prapadyante tāṁs tathaiva bhajāmy aham (BG 4.11). If you want to forget Kṛṣṇa, Kṛṣṇa will give you facilities to forget Him forever. And if you want to remember Kṛṣṇa, He will give you facilities to remember Him.

That means Kṛṣṇa has given us little independence. Independence, because we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, and Kṛṣṇa is fully independent, sva-rāṭ. Janmādy asya yataḥ anvayād itarataś ca artheṣu abhijñaḥ svarāṭ (SB 1.1.1). He is fully independent.

But we are, because we are part and parcel of Kṛṣṇa, we have got also little independence. That quality is there. Kṛṣṇa does not touch that independence quality. You can utilize it. You can use it properly, you can misuse it also. That is independence. Kṛṣṇa does not force that "You must do this." He can give you instruction.

Just like Kṛṣṇa gives instruction, sarva-dharmān parityajya mām ekaṁ śaraṇaṁ vraja (BG 18.66). Now it is my independence, I can give up everything, all other engagements, and I can simply surrender to Kṛṣṇa. And I cannot also, I may not. If I don't like, Kṛṣṇa does not interfere. Kṛṣṇa says, "Whatever you like, you do." Yathecchasi tathā kuru (BG 18.63). That is, Kṛṣṇa says to Arjuna, "Now whatever you like you do." So this independence is always there.

Now when we misuse this independence... Our relationship with Kṛṣṇa (is) to serve. Jīvera svarūpa haya nitya kṛṣṇa-dāsa (Cc. Madhya 20.108-109). Therefore Kṛṣṇa orders, "You surrender!" Just like we sometimes order our servants or subordinates, sons, disciples, "You do this! Don't talk!" So Kṛṣṇa can order that because He is the Supreme. 

Any superior personality can order like that. But unfortunately, we misuse. We don't carry out the order of the superior.

That is misuse. So any subordinate who does not carry the order of the master, he is dangerous. He is dangerous. That is spoken by Canakya Pandita, bhṛtyaś cottara-dāyakaḥ. Bhṛtyaś cottara-dāyakaḥ. Bhṛtyaḥ, subordinate, servant, if he is giving reply. Cānakya Paṇḍita, you know Cāṇakya-śloka, he is a great politician as well as moral instructor. So he has said duṣṭā bhāryā, his wife is duṣṭa, polluted. Wife becomes polluted if she is attracted by somebody else more than her husband, she is called polluted. Duṣṭā bhāryā ṣaṭhaṁ mitram, and friend playing duplicity.

Duṣṭā bhāryā śaṭhaṁ mitraṁ bhṛtyaś cottara-dāyakaḥ, and servant replying to the order. Master says, "You do this first!" "Sir, we have got so many business, this and that, we shall do it." Oh, that is a dangerous thing.

duṣṭā-bhāryā śaṭhaṁ mitraṁ
bhṛtyaś ca uttara-dāyakaḥ
sa-sarpe ca gṛhe vāso
mṛtyur eva na saṁśayaḥ

So these four things, unfaithful wife, a dupli..., a cheating friend, and servant disobeying order, and a snake within the room, all these things are causes or the..., will cause death at any time. At any time, they can do anything. There are many instances.

So these moral instructions are very nice given by Cānakya Paṇḍita. So all living entities who have disobeyed the order of Kṛṣṇa, sarva-dharmān parityajya (BG 18.66), that is the principle. Every living entity must be obedient to Kṛṣṇa. But by misuse of his little independence, if he does not obey the orders of Kṛṣṇa, he immediately becomes arrested by māyā.

[Excerpt from Lecture on SB 7.9.8 -- Calcutta, March 5, 1972]

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OH OH PILGRIMS!