ISKCON REVIVES THE BANGALORE COURT CASE / Rupa Video Comments 12 02 25

Wants more millions spent on courts

when children in their gurukula complained about

not having proper shoes, soap, and food.

ISKCON REVIVES THE BANGALORE COURT CASE

In May 2025, the Supreme Court of India issued a long-awaited judgment in the decades-long dispute between ISKCON Mumbai—the society legally founded and registered by Srila Prabhupada in 1971—and the breakaway Bengaluru group led by Madhu Pandit Dasa. The case, which originated in 2001, concerned who legally controls the Bangalore temple, a property originally established as a branch of ISKCON India. 

While the Supreme Court’s ruling sided with the Bangalore breakaway group, it dealt only with civil control of the Bengaluru campus and did not address or endorse the theological concept of ritvik initiation. At the time, ISKCON expressed its disappointment in the outcome, it remained committed to pursuing all available legal remedies.

While acknowledging the court’s decision, ISKCON leaders cautioned that the judgment did not alter Srila Prabhupada’s clearly expressed intention that all Indian temples function under the single ISKCON society registered in Mumbai. They also reiterated that the GBC’s long-standing 1990 resolution rejecting the ritvik theory—as incompatible with the disciplic succession taught by Srila Prabhupada—remains fully in force.

When the Bengaluru leadership approached the GBC after the ruling with a proposal for affiliation, it was conditioned on rescinding that resolution, a precondition the GBC unanimously rejected after two special meetings convened to consider the matter.

The legal team, led by Dayaram Das, committed at the time to review the Supreme Court judgment once released in full and continue to act within the law to protect Srila Prabhupada’s instructions, ISKCON’s integrity, and the proper governance of its branches.

In a recent a statement released to ISKCON leaders, Dayaram Das shared the latest development in the ongoing dispute, “As you are aware, our review petition in the Bangalore case had a split verdict in a chamber hearing on 28th October between the senior judge Justice JK Maheshwari who ruled in favor of an open court hearing and Justice George Masih who was against it.

“Since there were divergent orders, the matter was referred to the Chief Justice of India for further action and decision.

“Yesterday, the Supreme Court of India published next week’s cause list. Our matter has been listed for an open court hearing in front of a new three-judge bench of Justice M.M. Sundardesh, Justice Prashant Kumar Mishra, and Justice Satish Chandra Sharma on 3rd December 2025.”

Dayaram Das further appealed to devotees worldwide to offer heartfelt prayers as ISKCON’s legal team prepares to present the merits of its case before the newly assigned bench. 

He encouraged devotees to pray to Lord Sri Chaitanya and Srila Prabhupada to inspire the judges from within, uphold the unity of the ISKCON movement, and allow the truth of the matter to emerge clearly. He further urged the community to continue their sincere prayers and kirtans to their presiding Deities and to Srila Prabhupada during this critical time.

Tag: bangalore , Bangaluru , court , india , iskcon , legal , Supreme-Court

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PADA: Wow, so when the GBC folks said that this Bangalore issue has nothing to do with the ritvik idea, it is "only a property dispute" -- they lied. Now they are saying the whole Bangalore thing is all about the ritvik issue. It never ends with these guys.

Dayaram did tell me they would spend $100,000,000 over the next 100 years taking Bangalore to court. I don't think the GBC quite realizes this, but almost all of the devotees, probably 99%, are living outside ISKCON now and none of them care if ISKCON has one more building or not. Or if they win or lose this new lawsuit.  

The devotees at large are never going to live in any of their buildings, ever, or maybe even -- never visit any of them. ISKCON taking over another building has no meaning to almost all the ISKCON exiled refugees devotees.

And what has happened is that most of their buildings are empty, and they are struggling to find a few helpers and pujaris. They begged the Hindu congregation here for some pujari volunteers, and none of them signed up. The buildings are empty. 

So now they want to empty out another building, that is all this is about. There is a building full of people, and it is not a ghost town, and that is not acceptable. It needs to be empty and a ghost town.

The GBC is only able to function now by using various legal levers and tricks, but they have empty temples because they lost the hearts and minds of ALMOST ALL of the devotees ages ago. Madhu Pandit is a very tolerant guy, but I think it is high time he brings down the boom on these GBC guys, and he starts to forward the child abuse issue. 

Dear Court of India: We don't want Bangalore temple to be managed by a molester messiah's program now do we? He should combine the child abuse case with his case and make that the issue. 

Simply arguing technical legal documents over and over is not a good way to win, when the GBC's enforced child abuse project is already a winning issue. The Supreme Court already has been alerted to the molesting issue, and that should become the real issue. Of course I told Madhu Pandit that same thing in 1998, get a real issue into the court and don't play the GBC's endless technical games.

Meanwhile, the last Bangalore court case already cost ISKCON millions of dollars. Where are they getting all these endless funds for all these court cases? And then they hired the top notch allegedly $20,000 an hour lawyers for their child abuse case, so it looks like they are simply spending more millions on lawyering up -- again, when so many senior devotees are living on a shoe string budget and can barely get any health care. 

Anyway let us see what happens, but Madhu Pandit really needs to finally take the gloves off and go after these guys, or he will not get free of their harassing. When Dayarama said they will spend $100,000,000 over the next 100 years in court, he was not joking. 

ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com   

RJ: India is the most dangerous country in the world for women and children. Sexual and physical abuse are tolerated. Abusers are rarely brought to courts and charged. And they often slip out of the charges even when charged. When it comes to abuse, India is an international disgrace.

Supreme Court Allows Fresh Plea on Alleged Abuse in ISKCON Schools

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SOME COMMENTS ON RUPA MANJARI

krishna1008: Rupa Manjari Dasi // The Golden Body Of Auschwitz 12 01 25

Q: Why is the Mathura Pati / HKC Jaipur program attracted to promoting women beaters and rapers, and rapers of females old enough to be their daughters (de facto pedophile)? And they are against PADA stopping actual children from being beaten and raped? 

And why are they making videos with women beaters and rapers, and exploiters of females old enough to be their daughters, to "defeat PADA"? OK many people are saying, they think alike and promote each other, because they are alike. It is amazing that Krishna Kant says he "defeated PADA," by being in bed with mass child molesting programs. 

Of course they alway quote Krishna Kant, who wanted me to go on vacation in the Caribbean working under Jayapataka. Wait? Same JPS guy who is suing Bangalore over and over. 

LD: The karmis are right. Devotees of the "Golden Body of Auschwitz" are brain washed zombies. They are not devotees of Krishna. An insult to Krishna to say they are. Most people ALL went along with the pedophile guru gang. NNV was one of the exploiters ... of very young people. Old enough to be his daughter!

Another pedophile in their gang. No wonder they are with him. All part of the SAME gang. And when you say they ALL attacked, they ALL did! And the result is on them. 

S D Dasi: It is a pattern. Their Mukunda was a wife beater. NNV was a wife beater. Purujit? Watching porno. The Golden Body? Chock full ... of women and child beaters. Anyone who is against wife beaters? They are against.

Full of similar thinkers. The misogynists, misfits and child abusers.
All sorts of them were around here. And they mis-use Krishna to abuse others. Now the temple is more empty ... we are getting them out slow but sure. We are ruining their business.

Worse than karmis. Karmis do not think their abuse is God's golden body. M Dasi would not trust them to watch her pet dog. She is right. They used that for a long time, the Golden Body of ISKCON, we know that is a pile of manure by now. It does not fly anymore.

M Dasi: Poor Rupa Manjari. That NNV guy was definitely a misogynist, pervert, creep, woman beater, and even woman raper. And since she was like his child in age, almost child beater and raper. And then they defend ... the Golden Body of child mistreating.

NNV is a person to make as their spiritual authority? They seem to find the creepiest pervert people to make as their shiksha gurus. I forget, ISKCON gurus the same thing.

These people are attracted to these misogynist creeps ... by accident? Or attracted because they are birds of the same feather? I personally? Do not think this is accident, great minds think alike. And bad ones think alike too.

I am praying for Rupa Manjari, holy f**king hell she had to go through, and then they make her attacker their spiritual guide. What is wrong with these people! I have to admit ... they are slick salesmen. They conned people into thinking Auschwitz is spiritual vaikuntha.

Reminds me of the TV show ... they interview the Germans living around Auschwitz. None of them have any idea what was going on there. Just like ISKCON ... no one knows a damn thing. Problem is? We do know.

PADA: Yeah, people ask me that all the time, why are these people coming after PADA, and not the child abusers? And the unfortunate conclusion many have is, they are in bed with them abusers. ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com

Rupa Manjari Dasi // The Golden Body Of Auschwitz 12 01 25

 

Mathura Pati

The Golden Body of Auschwitz for kids?

PADA: Rupa Manjari raises a lot of very interesting points, I think she is worth a listen. She is also correct, Narararayan Visvakarma (NNV) is a psychopath, and his treatment of women is nothing short of diabolical and horrific. And more to the point, many other women were exploited in ISKCON, and sometimes treated with psychological and even physical violence -- similar to her case, or sometimes worse. OK. There has been a pattern of abuse, and Rupa Manjari correctly points to that problem. The abuse was widespread and system wide, and various factors lead to that happening. And NNV was saying this system wide mass abuse program is "The Golden Body of ISKCON."

For starters, there was a number of NNV ilk exploiters or misogynist types infesting ISKCON. I personally had to save a woman who was being beaten up, and I kicked her husband off her and got her to a safe location. Other cases of women being beat up were told to me by a number of victims. And then again mothers who collected sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars were later weeded out when they could not collect as much. They were exploited and then tossed out as "old cows." 

Eventually almost all of the Srila Prabhupada devotees were exploited by being weeded out / kicked out -- using various vicious tricks, after they gave so much to build ISKCON. So this was a sort of criminal smash and grab take over. But many vulnerable women were eventually -- and often -- left out in the cold with nothing, sometimes even with their children, after contributing sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars. So this is simply one -- after another -- forms of the varieties of abuse.  

Was this the intent or instruction of Srila Prabhupada? Nope. He said women and children needed to be protected, as well as cows and brahmanas. He said we have to respect all other living beings as Krishna's personal property, which they in fact are. In other words, there is no indication from his instructions that ANYONE would have a license to mistreat others, and especially women and children. 

Worse, he says that a person who mistreats Vaishnavas has to suffer in hell for a long time. It is forbidden. Many of these GBC guru guys already look like they are in hell. A woman wrote to me -- just now -- to tell me Satvarupa's art is from hell, and she cannot understand why the society promotes this guy, unless they are all in hell together.   

Unfortunately, protecting the citzens -- did not happen. And many times the perps and their enablers were protected instead. OK it looks like many perps get special protection treatment because they are loyalists to "The Golden Body." Never mind the Golden Body has now been reduced to burnt out rubble, an empty ghost town, because -- an evil emperor will burn down his own empire to rule over the ashes.

And at the same time, many children were also exploited in the same way as many women, or even worse ways. When I said that worshiping Jayatirtha is worshiping a predator, and this will spread predator consciousness around the society, I was laughed at by leaders and even many senior devotees. And I was kicked out for protesting worship of an intoxicated predator. 

In short, a culture of "ISKCON abuse worship" was spawned. And it then took a life of its own and was often viciously protected because "we don't want to make ISKCON look bad." "The Golden Body" no less. 

But I said in 1979, ISKCON will end up looking bad if that exploiting culture is allowed and protected. Never mind eventually the victims will abandon the ISKCON religion and we will be left with an empty ISKCON ghost town, which has happened. Never mind the angry victims will likely later on form counter ISKCON attack groups and protesting forums, or perhaps initiate legal attacks on the religion. As is happening.

Sorry, my predictions have proven true. We become what we worship, and predator worship generates more of same. Shortly after they booted me out, the chloroform used on children predators program started in Croome Court, just as we predicted would happen. And it seems no one went to the authorities to "protect the Golden Body of ISKCON."    

NNV was later on the MAIN ring leader of the "stop PADA" gang in 1998, which attacked PADA and eventually became -- the Krishna Kirtan / Pancali / Sanat / Mukunda / Prahlad / HKC Jaipur / Mathura Pati -- and even IRM complainers -- against PADA. And these people often cited NNV's complaints, and NNV was actually part of their original "get rid of PADA" forums groups, and so were NNV's assistants.

Oh oh pilgrims, yep -- NNV -- his disciples like HKC Jaipur -- and various GBC folks -- all claimed that PADA is helping sue "the Golden Body of ISKCON." And this is horrible because, it is saving children from being abused and they are being removed from GBC's schools. Wait? Isn't this the same exact gurukula "Golden Body of ISKCON" -- which various children victims tell me -- has instead been "Auschwitz for kids"? The Golden Body of God is -- Auschwitz?

But why would anyone want to see ANY children -- stay inside and confined in -- Auchwitz for kids, in the first place? Some estimate that several hundred children were taken out of the GBC's school system thanks to our 1998 lawsuit. And these NNV / HKC people, along with many GBC people, were infuriated that we liberated these victims from abuse, self evidently. Rather amazingly, PADA is escorting victims out of Aucshwitz, and these guys are upset and angry -- because why? The victims did not die in their camp? 

So this Golden Body of ISKCON idea has been one of the biggest stumbling blocks to getting any sort of justice. And thus almost anyone who reported abuse was "attacking the Golden Body of ISKCON." OK, the Golden Body folks wanted to make us targets for violent oppression. As happened. Worse, we were at the same time -- saying Srila Prabhupada had complained of poison -- making PADA editor an even bigger bull's eye target. 

Yep! And thus oppressing me as an offender, as a destroyer of the Golden ISKCON, was making me an even bigger bull's eye target for the regime's members. But if Srila Prabhupada was poisoned, then isn't he also a victim of these abusers? I'd say, yes he is. So they said I am attacking the Golden Body of ISKCON, to get me taken out, or repressed -- which would protect -- Auschwitz for kids, and the poisoners, all in one go. And it has, and thus abuse is still going on now according to reliable reports. 

In other words, the abuser regime is helped along on many fronts at once, because whistle blowers are treated badly from many different angles. And so a lot of this abuse is never reported. It is not just the inner circle of ISKCON people who suppress us, it is also some of the so-called independent folks, OK like NNV, IRM, HKC Jaipur, Mathura Pati etc. 

These guys were even making a petition to have PADA removed from the internet, evidently to stop us from saving children from abuse, which made a lot of the members of the GBC's homosexual and pedophile messiah's club very happy. No surprise here, GBC folks began to forward complaints from NNV, HKC Jaipur etc. to me -- to show how bogus PADA is.

NNV was being cited a lot on their petition forum, and some of these folks also made videos with NNV to attack PADA, which were then posted by them -- against PADA. Yep, a serial woman abuser who is claiming PADA is attacking the Golden Body -- of child abuse -- actually Auschwitz -- is their spokesman hero.

Worse! Then the HKC Jaipur / Mathura Pati group began citing Radhanath's cheer leader Bhakta das, as well as NNV, and the writings of Hari Sauri, also against us. OK NNV is a serial woman abuser, and should not be cited as an authority on abuse of women or children. Hello!

For his part HKC Jaipur hero Bhakta das says that PADA is always talking about "stinky stools" -- when we are actually advocating for little children. And then these guys like HKC Jaipur and Mathura Pati start citing Bhakta das, OK ISKCON's children are merely stinky stools. Well yeah, for these type guys ISKCON's children are just disposable stinky stools -- or none of this would have been allowed in the first place. But the Golden Body of Auschwitz for kids program is not expendable, we need to protect and save it, and getting rid of PADA is thus the main priority. 

Srila Prabhupada says when a guru has sex with a follower, it is the same as a father having sex with his daughter. And Rupa Manjari was actually old enough to be NNV's daughter. NNV saw a vulnerable "newbie" person who was "ripe for the picking" as they say, but who should ACTUALLY be treated as his daughter. But he took advantage of her instead. And yeah, destroyed her life in so many ways. And many gurukula children had their lives destroyed, ok this is a pattern.

Now some folks have chastised me that ISKCON kids / Rupa Manjari types got what they deserved. It is their karma. I do not think so. When an old woman who was my neighbor asked me to drive her somewhere, I asked her -- what happened to your newly purchased car? Well it turns out her recently purchased used car did not have 70,000 miles on it, it had 370,000 and it was a used taxi. 

So she was cheated, and I had to help her go to the Business Bureau and try to get her money back. Eventually, the car dealer had to refund her money, but it was a giant hassle. So yeah, she is partly responsible, but more so -- is the used car dealer. Rupa Manjari was cheated, and so were thousands of other women who got into the ISKCON abuse system. And I would say -- the abusers are more responsible than the abused. This "karma" idea is simply an excuse not to challenge the abuse infrastructure.   

At this stage, it looks they are losing the battle, because PADA's issues were not stopped by them, despite their defense of the Auschwitz for kids process. The abuser's club, including these defenders, failed to halt our efforts, and thus the Delhi court has opened the child abuse issue there right now. Sorry, Auschwitz for kids has to be exposed and checked, and so do the cheer leaders, defenders and apologists of that process.

Yep, PADA is helping liberate hundreds of kids from ISKCON's molester messiah's schools (the parents were taking their kids out en masse after the 1998 lawsuit was filed), and this is stopping children from potentially being starved, beaten and raped. That is very bad! Umm, well yeah it is very bad for the abusers regime. But it is good news for those children.

OK! According to NNV and his sisya followers like the HKC Jaipur team -- PADA is "destroying the Golden Body of ISKCON" aka "Auschwitz for kids." Wait, what? Sorry! The children are telling me they experienced "Auchwitz for kids," which is supposedly simultaneously -- the Golden Body of ISKCON, or Golden Body of God. WTF? 

Someone told me that NNV borrowed his "Golden Body of ISKCON" idea from the Golden Calf Idol that was made in the Bible. As we recall, Moses melted it down and ground it into dust, and that is why they do not like PADA, we did what Moses did! Hee hee! 

Worse, the HKC Jaipur / Mathura Pati guys have been citing Hari Sauri saying me and Sulochana are drunks and sahajiyas, which means, only us drunks and sahajiyas know that Auschwitz for kids is not the Golden Idol Body of God. Sheesh! 

But yeah, actually even the real drunks here on Market Street know that Auschwitz for kids is not the Golden Body of God. Duh! The good news is, Mathura Pati admits to a mutual friend -- the reason he has to promote the cheer leaders of his homosexual and pedophile messiah program's "Saint Radhanath," and Hari Sauri writings, and in sum the Auschwitz for kids program's cheer leader defenders is, they oppose PADA. Yep, they oppose saving children from being abused and liberated from Auschwitz. And that is how this culture pervaded the society. They ALL opposed PADA. 

In other words -- they CONJOINTLY oppose PADA, which mean they oppose the people who save children from abuse, or even being raped. And even from committing suicide, which happened to a number of victims. Then someone recently asked me, is there any connection to these Mathura Pati type guys having sympathy for Hitler, and their sympathy for Saint Radhanath's defenders and evidently also the Auschwitz for kids program?  

Rupa Manjari is right, Naranarayan is a psychopath -- and an abuser. And he and many others were (and still are) inciting others to help the abuser agenda. And that is why the abuse has been so widespread and in fact, pervasive. 

When Kirtanananda would say, women can be mistreated, the New Vrndavana people would clap, laugh, cheer -- and essentially agree. No one stood up and said, NO!!!! Srila Prabhupada would never allow mistreating women. So there was a sort of culture of abuse being promoted, if not cheered on, but it was sort of subtle and went unnoticed -- until it all exploded later. By then it was too late, too many victims were now too far damaged, and the damage was not easy to repair at this stage.    

And that is why NNV opposed those of us exposing these abusing programs, because perps and their defenders are part of the whole process. And NNV is one of the abusers himself. And evidently, that is why the HKC Jaipur clan is promoting NNV's propaganda against us, as Sulochana said, birds of a feather flop together. But yeah, ask any town drunk, is Auschwitz for kids the Golden Body of God? Nopey!

No wonder people like Rupa Manjari say there are some who believe this is a Satanic child sacrifice cult, because, well pilgrims -- it seems like it is? "Auschwitz for kids" would be "The Golden Body of God" -- but for whom? Only -- for evil people in an evil Satanic cult. 

That is what many people tell PADA, because that is the growing consensus. They painted abuse as God's program, but it is Satan's. Anyway, Rupa Manjari is a rare case, she is a survivor who still has faith in Krishna, and we wish her all the best going forward. Unfortunately, many other victims of the regime lost faith, and we cannot actually blame them. 

But we as a society are collectively responsible for what happens to our citizens, and we collectively protected the Satanic exploiter program, to the peril of the victims, and to our own peril, because we all will be held accountable for what happens in our society. 

In short, many women were abused, many children were abused, many brahmanas were vilified and kicked out, and many people, if not most people -- objected to me complaining about it. And some of them wanted to kill me to defend their Golden Idol worship project. Thus many hands were involved in the conspiracy of making these events transpire. 

This did not happen in a vacuum. And the poisoning of Prabhupada is the root of this poison tree, which sprouted the Golden Idol worship. And the people who took the fruits of that tree were afflicted. And many still are. And that explains why so many people in the past kept confusing the Golden Body of God with Auschwitz, and many still do, they have been afflicted. The good news is, more people are agreeing with us, this is a Satanic influence and not God's.   

ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com  

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PADA: Yes prabhu. The pattern is -- whistle blowers are oppressed, and victimizers and predators are protected. Satsvarupa said me and Sulochana are p*ison pens when we complained about the child mistreatment. He intentionally wanted to make us targets, and we were. Sulochana said "SDG has painted a bulls eye on our backs." 

I was saved because the FEDS were tapping their phones and they busted the three New Vrndavana enforcers who came to get me. SDG wanted us whistle blowers on child mistreatment eliminated, and a predator like Kirtanananda worshiped. In sum, he wanted me six feet in the grave and Kirtanananda on a big seat being worshiped as good as God. 

And we all know as a result, the children suffered. SDG was one of the foxes guarding the hen house, and the hens kept being mistreated -- and badly -- under his watch. No wonder he avoids being interviewed. Of course SDG victimized his own female disciple after breaking up her marriage, and causing her children to be unprotected and thus mistreated as well, he is a predator himself. But yeah, the former teacher from SDG school told me "every single kid in the SDG school was mistreated by SDG's predator pals." ys pd

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WRITE HERE IF YOU WANT TO HELP OR JOIN THE LAWSUIT:

Founder & Chief Trustee – Radhey Krishna Legal Aid Foundation

ISKCON Malaysia / Yadubara / Delhi case / HK Project / Jiva Institute ETC. 11 29 25

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ISKCON MALAYSIA CORRUPTION 

DKS: While I was used to being in ISKCON management, I received many criticisms for being strong in exposing wrongdoing of the leaders in Malaysia. One temple president was removed and banned for close contact with an underage kid. 

One senior brahmachari was exposed for watching porno in the ashram. One national secretary was removed for abuse of funds. One national asst secretary removed for supporting the child abusing temple president. 

When I complained to my guru who is also a GBC on this matter, no action was taken, and further he asked me to just follow the national secretary. I'm furious and went public to complain -- plus I rejected my diksha guru for not following the guru, sadhu and sastra. 

I sent a strong message to the GBC and ISKCON management before resigned from management after all this experience. Many devotees out there did not indulge in the deep study of sastra and simply followed the hypes of these GBC gurus. This must be stopped. Sastra caksusa are the key for exposing the real guru.

MK: I think you're being much too generous in suggesting this. Time has proven the facts: they either just don't care, or are compelled to cover up for the perpetrators for their own benefit. 

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From: Yadubara Das <yadubara.das@gmail.com>

To: M.R. 

Subject: your unsolicited emails

Hare Krishna. Jaya Srila Prabhupada.

I have known the two named devotees for 50 years and do not question their sincere service to Srila Prabhupada. Taking sides in a dispute between two Vaishnavas has severe spiritual consequences as stated in the Caitanya Caritamrita and the Caitanya Bhagavat. I have personally witnessed the unfortunate result numerous times over the last 50 years.

Generally, Vaishnavas shun all controversies and focus on their own spiritual progress—unless they are invited by senior Vaishnavas to discuss controversial issues in an intelligent and respectful manner. Don't make the grave mistake of continuing your propaganda. If you do, you and those with your opinion are only inviting their spiritual demise.

Your servant,
Yadubara das
www.harekrishnathefilm.com

PADA: Yep, for many years these Yadubara GBC guys have been promoting their homosexual and pedophile messiah's project, which bans, beats, molests, sues and kills Vaishnavas left, right and center. 

Why are they doing that? Evidently! So they can purge and cleanse the ISKCON properties of those nasty Srila Prabhupada devotees -- and make a Hindu cultural hall out of Srila Prabhupada's buildings. OK like they have made at Bhaktivedanta Manor. And then get into the UK ISKCON salaried leaders project. 

As the FBI say says, if you want to know how a crime took place, follow the money. Yadubara was one of the people giving me stink eye when we were having his molester messiah's program sued for $400,000,000. He never asked me about the situation with the children, but they knew I was collating testimony for the court case. 

OK they didn't care. 

Generally devotees focus on their own spiritual progress, and have their society's children worshiping homosexuals and pedophiles as their messiahs? While the children report being in Auschwitz for kids? No, generally most moral and religion minded people try to protect their society's children from worshiping deviants as their messiahs. 

Yeah concentrate on your own spiritual life, so we can have all of the Prabhupada devotees banned, beat, molested, sued and killed, and we can become the new leaders of our Hindu-ized church, which is a Hindu business. ys pd

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DELHI COURT CASE

M Dasi: Let me briefly explain who "they" are. The "they" who have taken this matter to the Supreme Court of India now, are some of the same people who were made aware of the child abuse issues in 1994, at an NA GBC meeting here in Alachua. 

Immediately thereafter, the Children of Krsna organization was started (Krsna Avatar aka Keith Domingo was the first director and you know Jahnavi was also on the Board), to attempt to address some of the cases. The ISKCON Foundation (CEO, Naveen Krishna das) provided seed money to start this group as well as (with some others), funding for providing financial and emotional support for the victims.

The Office of Child Protection was then "officially" created with Dhira Govinda Prabhu, (David Wolf) as its first director; he filled that position for many years. He can write (and I think he has in the past) about the shocking number and horrendous nature of the cases of child abuse that he attempted to deal with in his time as the director. Ultimately he left that position due to frustration in trying to deal with these matters "internally", within ISKCON. 

Since his resignation, of course, other directors filled those duties, until the GBC recently disbanded the CPO as it was, and "taken over the reins in the way that they'd like to see it operate"!

Most recently, the Justice for Srila Prabhupada Foundation was created, less than 2 years ago, with my husband, Naveen Krishna das, as the CEO and Dhira Govinda Prabhu as one of the Founding Directors. The initial purpose of this Foundation was to thoroughly and professionally investigate the suspicions that Srila Prabhupada was poisoned by some of his "leading men". 

Relationships were made with some very well-reputed personalities in India, including lawyers, suspecting the unfortunate possibility of having to litigate on this issue.

The issue of child abuse became a concern once again, fueled by the fire of more recent allegations and revelations of NEGLECT on the part of ISKCON management (eg. BVP "swami"). And, once again, understanding the vast nature of the abuse that went on "under his care", as well as in Vrndavana, our ire was raised; personally knowing some of those persons who were on the receiving end of some of that abuse, also gave us personal purpose.

The rest is, perhaps, "Krsna's arrangement". Our lawyers were already retained; victims were ready to speak, and "Commisions of Child Rights" had been set up by the national and local government in 2012, to deal with these issues there. Since the GBC seemed to be unresponsive, neglectful or perhaps even complicit in some of these affairs, our ire was once again raised!

As the complaint said, our lawyers had submitted complaints to the local COP's, but had not received any response. That's when they went to the Supreme Court. The SC has now mandated that these lower bodies address the complaints appropriately, so that is a "victory" in that sense.

I don't know why you're assuming that there is some "political motivation behind this". And ISKCON has "made itself look bad" by the abusive actions and its neglect of the victims, and cover-ups of the crimes; that the public will now understand the extent of the problem is a good thing! We're supposed to be a "saintly organization"; people need to know the truth so we can actually step up to that designation.

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HARE KRISHNA PROJECT UPDATE

“Speaking out against the sexual abuse of women in ISKCON”

PODCAST: Episode 196 – Sunday 30th November 2025
WATCH ON:

- Facebook at www.facebook.com/TheHareKrishnaProject

- YouTube at www.youtube.com/@NaradaDasUK

We’re pleased to welcome Elizabeth Heather Mark (Sri Rupa Manjari dasi) as our guest on this week’s podcast.

Born in Los Angeles, California, to Jewish parents who were followers of Transcendental Meditation (TM) she grew up in the Church of Christ, Scientist – a Christian sect founded by Mary Baker Eddy in the 19th century.

A spiritual seeker and enthusiast for ‘finding the truth’ she later joined the Hare Krishna movement in her early 20’s whilst at university.

Her experiences have been mixed though. Whist falling in love with bhakti yoga she was subject to years of abuse and torture at the hands of her husband – Nara Narayan das (a senior Hare Krishna leader in the USA).

In her first sit-down interview, Elizabeth talks with Narada Prabhu about:

- Her abusive marriage
- Her thoughts on the role and status of women in ISKCON
- The extent of the abuse of women, still going on today, in ISKCON
- What ISKCON needs to do to create a ‘safe space’ for women

We also talk briefly about her new project ‘Sri Laksmi’ – which seeks to provide women with ethically sourced and high-end clothing. For more details visit 

www.srilaksmi.com

This week’s podcast is not to be missed!

For more details about The Hare Krishna Project check out our website www.theharekrishnaproject.org.uk
#Podcast #TheHareKrishnaProject #BhaktiYoga #ISKCON #SexualAbuse #Women #WomensRights #WomenMatter #SpeakingOut #Abuse #NoLongerSilenced

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SRI KANTA (Walford) 

OK Sri Kanta is against us worshiping what he claims is the posthumous, post samadhi, post mortem person named Srila Prabhupada. They always say the same thing, no one should ever worship the posthumous, post samadhi, post mortem -- dead person. The ritviks are like the bogus Christians! OK who else should we worship then? They never tell us, just do not worship Srila Prabhupada, the post mortem guru. We cannot worship Srila Prabhupada, who else should be worshiped then? Nobody knows!    

Those people are upset we told our kids, and many others, to worship Srila Prabhupada, which saved them from getting a living fool to worship. My kids thank me all the time we did that, because they know many other Krishna kids friends who suffered badly when they did not get Srila Prabhupada as their guru. Suffered -- both materially and spiritually. 

Where does Srila Prabhupada say he should be the guru ongoing? Which is like asking the Sun planet -- why is it not writing us to let us know it is the source of sunshine. If we do not know where the sunshine comes from, that is our problem. 

But the people who we get to worship Prabhupada are very happy we did that, and that is why we are getting 5,000 -- 15,000 hits per day on our sites with many nice questions. But yeah, they always thought Srila Prabhupada was post mortem, and now ISKCON is post mortem thanks to these thinkers. 

Sorry, my kids and others do not need a letter from the Sun planet to know where the sunshine comes from. Srila Prabhupada told us Jesus is still taking sins from his sincere worshipers now even though 2,000 years has passed, these guys could not take sins from a flea. They have no potency and that is self evident. 

The people who worship Prabhupada are also the only people printing the original books and making more Prabhupada devotees now etc., these critic people have no guru to even offer new people, so they cannot do anything of substance, and they never will. God and guru are post mortem, Srila Prabhupada told us all about these folks, we know in advance what is their agenda. 

Yeah Sri Kanta says he is for original books, but he is against the people making original books. OK he is not really in favor of making anything, he wants to stop any progress. And his type preaching has stopped things. And he is proud he made ISKCON into a post mortem mess.   

ys pd

======

HARINAMA DISAPPEARING?

PADA: No one can hardly find any Hare Krishnas doing Harinama anymore. Berkeley used to have 120 people chanting on telegraph every week, with many mothers pushing their baby strollers etc., now we might find three or four folks straggling along, if we are lucky. The GBC got rid of almost all the Harinama devotees as their first rattle out of the box in 1978. Unfortunately, "clubbing" is the new main venue for chanting these days. My friend went to a temple for the Sunday program, and none of the Hindus there knew the prayers or how to play the instruments etc. It was a wipeout, but the GBC holds the keys to the collection box, that is all they ever wanted. ys pd

====

JIVA INSTITUTE UPDATE

PADA: Thanks Jaya@jiva.org for your attention (again). Is anyone even awake over there? I sent you folks several messages and you keep recycling back your original message, which I addressed several times.

The updated versions agree that Satya Vani cannot be identified clearly, except he preaches the same basic Babaji stuff and it is odd that he is using the Satya name, but this does not prove anything, true. I have made some clarifications here:

krishna1008: Radha Kunda Babajis and Siddha Pranali 11 28 25

Meanwhile you forgot to address other questions -- for example if the Jiva program is acting as shiksha guru for Narayan Maharaja's leader Premprayojana, when we all know NM was in Texas boosting Tamal when I was in Texas suing Tamal. 

If you want me to clarify things, I will try to help, but you also need to assist. You are still recycling old news about the previous version of the post which has now been corrected and updated. If you are not paying any attention to our conversation, we cannot make any progress. 

ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com

 

=================

IRAN WATER CRISIS

PADA: Yep, a former Iranian now in the USA says in school they had to chant "Death to the USA" and "Death to Israel" every day. Meanwhile they are running out of water, being pre-occupied with the USA and Israel and spending billions and billions arming their opponents, which means, death to themselves. 

They are having a water crisis -- while they have spent hundreds of billions fighting the so-called enemy of the people, when their own government is the main enemy of their own people and they made no concrete provisions for water supplies for -- their own citizens. Yes, this former citizen says, the Iran government is failing for the citizens.   

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TLC 12

TLC 12 SRILA PRABHUPADA: "There is no essential difference between a fully surrendered soul and a person in the renounced order of life. The only difference is that a fully surrendered soul is completely dependent upon Kṛṣṇa. There are six basic guidelines for surrender. The first is that one should accept everything that is favorable for the discharge of devotional service, and one should be determined to accept the process. 

The second is that one should give up everything that is unfavorable to the discharge of devotional service, and one should be determined to give it all up. Thirdly, one should be convinced that only Kṛṣṇa can protect him and should have full faith that the Lord will give that protection. 

An impersonalist thinks that his actual identity is in being one with Kṛṣṇa, but a devotee does not destroy his identity in this way. He lives with full faith that Kṛṣṇa will kindly protect him in all respects. Fourthly, a devotee should always accept Kṛṣṇa as his maintainer. Those who are interested in the fruits of activities generally expect protection from the demigods, but a devotee of Kṛṣṇa does not look to any demigod for protection. 

He is fully convinced that Kṛṣṇa will protect him from all unfavorable circumstances. Fifth, a devotee is always conscious that his desires are not independent; unless Kṛṣṇa fulfills them, they cannot be fulfilled. Lastly, one should always think of himself as the most fallen among souls so that Kṛṣṇa will take care of him.

Such a surrendered soul should take shelter of a holy place like Vṛndāvana, Mathurā, Dvārakā, Māyāpur, etc., and should surrender himself unto the Lord, saying, "My Lord, from today I am Yours. You can protect me or kill me as You like." A pure devotee takes shelter of Kṛṣṇa in such a way, and Kṛṣṇa is so grateful that He accepts him and gives him all kinds of protection. 

This is confirmed in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam (11.29.34) where it is said that if a person who is about to die takes full shelter of the Supreme Lord and places himself fully under His care, he actually attains immortality and becomes eligible to associate with the Supreme Lord and enjoy transcendental bliss.

The Lord then explained to Sanātana Gosvāmī the various types and symptoms of practical devotional service. When devotional service is performed with our present senses, it is called practical devotional service. Actually devotional service is the eternal life of the living entity and is lying dormant in everyone's heart. 

The practice which invokes that dormant devotional service is called practical devotional service. The purport is that the living entity is constitutionally part and parcel of the Supreme Lord; the Lord can be compared to the sun, and the living entities can be compared to molecules of sunshine. Under the spell of illusory energy, the spiritual spark is almost extinguished, but by practical devotional service one can revive his natural constitutional position. 

When one practices devotional service, it should be understood that he is returning to his original and normal liberated position. Devotional service can be practiced with one's senses under the direction of a bona fide spiritual master.

One begins spiritual activities for advancement in Kṛṣṇa consciousness by hearing. Hearing is the most important method for advancement, and one should be very eager to hear favorably about Kṛṣṇa. 

Giving up all speculation and fruitive activity, one should simply worship and desire to attain to love of God. That love of God is eternally existing within everyone; it simply has to be evoked by the process of hearing. Hearing and chanting are the principal methods of devotional service.

Devotional service may be regulative or affectionate. One who has not developed transcendental affection for Kṛṣṇa should conduct his life according to the directions and regulations of the scriptures and the spiritual master. In Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam (2.1.5) Śukadeva Gosvāmī advises Mahārāja Parīkṣit:

tasmād bhārata sarvātmā

bhagavān īśvaro hariḥ

śrotavyaḥ kīrtitavyaś ca

smartavyaś cecchatābhayam

"O best of the Bhāratas, it is the prime duty of persons who want to become fearless to hear about the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Hari, and to chant about Him and always remember Him. Lord Viṣṇu is always to be remembered; indeed, He is not to be forgotten for even a moment. He is the sum and substance of all regulative principles." 

The conclusion is that when all the rules, regulations, recommended and prohibited activities revealed in scriptures are taken together, the remembrance of the Supreme Lord is invariably the essence of everything. Remembrance of the Supreme Personality of Godhead within one's heart is the goal of devotional service. When devotional service is performed purely and affectionately, there is no question of regulative principles. There are no do's and don't's.

However, one should generally accept the following principles to properly execute devotional service: (1) take shelter of a bona fide spiritual master, (2) receive initiation from the spiritual master, (3) serve the spiritual master, (4) inquire and learn love from the spiritual master, (5) follow in the footsteps of holy persons devoted to the transcendental loving service of the Lord, (6) prepare to give up all kinds of enjoyment and miseries for the satisfaction of Kṛṣṇa, (7) live in a place where Kṛṣṇa had His pastimes, (8) be satisfied by whatever is sent by Kṛṣṇa for the maintenance of the body and hanker for no more, (9) observe fasting on Ekādaśī day (this occurs on the eleventh day after the full moon and the eleventh day after the new moon. 

On such days no grains, cereals or beans are eaten; simply vegetables and milk are moderately taken, and chanting Hare Kṛṣṇa and reading scriptures are increased.), (10) show respect to devotees, cows and sacred trees like the banyan tree.

------------------------------------------

DHAMAGHOSHA DASA: Some Conclusions - So for some these words by Prabhupada may seem like a list of do's and donts but as he says above, until we come to the stage of actual affection for God-Krsna these things are mandatory for the practicing devotee. And if we want to get to that stage (which is already within us)  then we cannot just chant mechanically, it has to be done with feeling or love or devotion, whatever you want to call it.

So the next question would be how do we get that stage of  feeling or affection just by  following rules or regulations?

Jan 11 1974 LA conversations

Candanācārya: Śrīla Prabhupāda?

Prabhupāda: Huh?

Candanācārya: Also this morning you said that we should try to only love Kṛṣṇa.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Candanācārya: And nothing else.

Prabhupāda: Yes.

Candanācārya: But if we love our godbrothers, is that also loving Kṛṣṇa?

Prabhupāda: Oh yes. Because they are of, of Kṛṣṇa. What are your godbrothers? They are Kṛṣṇa's servant. So if you do not love your godbrothers, that means you reject your part of Kṛṣṇa.

-----------------------------------------------------------

June 23 1976 New Vrndavana

Devotee (4): The difficulty is that we cannot understand, we cannot feel what pleases Kṛṣṇa now, yet we can feel what pleases us, and that is the difficulty?

Prabhupāda: You have no feeling, that everyone knows. Therefore you have to carry out the order of spiritual master, that's all.

Devotee (1) : If we try to please Kṛṣṇa with all of our service and activities, that automatically brings pleasure to the self?

Prabhupāda: You cannot please Kṛṣṇa directly. You please your spiritual master, Kṛṣṇa will be pleased. If you want to please directly Kṛṣṇa, that is not possible. That is concoction You cannot please. Yasya prasādād bhagavat-prasādaḥ **. You have to please your spiritual master, then Kṛṣṇa will be pleased. Don't jump. Guru-mukha-padma-vākya, cittete koriyā aikya **. What is that song you daily sing? What is that?

Pradyumna: By the words of the spiritual master our mind becomes conclusive from...

Prabhupāda: Āra nā koriha mane āśā. Don't concoct. Don't you sing daily? Āra nā koriha mane āśā. Don't manufacture ideas. That is dangerous. Caitanya Mahāprabhu teaches by His example. Guru more mūrkha dekhi' karilā śāsana [Cc. Ādi 7.71]. Caitanya Mahāprabhu said to Prakāśānanda Sarasvatī that "My spiritual master saw Me fool number one, so he has chastised Me, that 'Don't try to read Vedānta; chant Hare Kṛṣṇa.' So I'm doing." (motorcycle in background) Just hear. He has come to this turn. This sound is purposefully created? (motorbike going back and forth through much of the tape)

--------------------------------------

SB 3.16.8 purport--The conclusion is that if one can feed a brāhmaṇa or Vaiṣṇava, it is better than performing hundreds of thousands of sacrifices. In this age, therefore, it is recommended that harer nāma [Adi 17.21]—chanting the holy name of God—and pleasing the Vaiṣṇava are the only means to elevate oneself to spiritual life.

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What do you do to make your mind fresh ? pic.twitter.com/kmCdTuHek5

— Krishna Connect (@krishnaconnect8) November 29, 2025

Radha Kunda Babajis and Siddha Pranali 11 28 25

PADA: It looks to me like there is a sort of joining forces with these Babajis and some ISKCON and Gaudiya Matha folks. For example, Narayan Maharaja was famously giving "rasika classes to the GBC" but he forgot to find out if they were qualified for rasika. Never mind Narayan Maharaja said his own guru ordered him to avoid the Babajis.   

Which is how we got Satsvarupa citing Narayan Maharaja on -- the colors of the gopis saris, and in the same book, SDG discusses his enemas and constipation. Which is why BV Puri said this book is worse than any sahajiysa, the gopis and passing stools in the same book! Needless to say this is all premature, and no small amount of offensive, to juxtapose the gopis and enemas.  

As far as the Jiva Institute folks, it looks evidently like they have some connections to the (sahajiya?) Narayan Maharaja program's leader Premprayojana. At least someone mentioned them both in the Satya Vani forum.

Of course NM was in Texas yelling and shouting at my associates when I was in Texas having NM's "dear Tamal tree of Radha" sued for $400,000,000 for mass child abuse. 

It looks like all of these forces are combining together, and how did you guess, they all oppose PADA. Narayan Maharaja then said I was making major offenses with the poison issue and etc. because evidently he was trying to defend the Tamal cabal.

We already have Jiva Institute leader Jagadananda is on record (from CHAT GPT) -- first taking Sannyasa in 1979 under Bhavananda Swami, receiving the name Hiranyagarbha Swami. Then he went to Lalit Prasad Thakur later in 1979. Jagadananda told me he felt bad for not addressing the child abuse problem in ISKCON, and he never really did make much public expose, rather he told me to do all that. 

He approached Lalit Prasad Thakur, son of Bhaktivinoda Thakur, and received the diksa of siddha-pranali, and babaji veṣa from him. At that time, he was renamed Jagadananda Das Babaji. Jagadananda told me he never renounced his connection to Lailt Prasad and siddha pranali, and then he went to the Jiva Institute. OK and they are reputed to have the same types of mis-conceptions as Lalit Prasad.

Now the Jiva Institute guys are very sharp to find when we might make a mistake indentifying this Satya Vani person, which we may have done by mistake, but it is not easy to discover who this person is, except, he sounds a lot like them. Satya Vani almost sounds close to Satyanarayana as well? OK various people assumed Satya Vani was Satyanaryana dasa, but we cannot confirm that.

Anyway Satya Vani, whoever he is, has a number of books on Amazon with almost no reviews, except one negative one. And the reviewer is not happy with their writings. I don't think they are making a lot of progress with their propaganda. 

In any case, I think all of these folks are simply envious that others are preaching and making progress and they -- pretty much -- are not. And this has gone on for decades. If someone knows the actual identy of Satya Vani, let us know. 

Srila Prabhupada ALREADY describes the process of us Jeeva souls attaining our spiritual identity and bodies, and the siddha pranali diksha is not part of it. It was premature for the peacock, for Jagadananda, and others, to get involved with all this. Here are some quotes on these issues:

ys pd angel108b@yahoo.com    

 

Radha Kunda Babajis and Siddha Pranali

* Srila Prabhupada: The siddha-pranali process is followed by a class of men who are not very authorized and who have manufactured their own way of devotional service. They imagine they have become associates of the Lord simply by thinking of themselves like that.

* This external behavior is not at all according to the regulative principles. The so-called siddha-pranali process is followed by the prakrita-sahajiya, a pseudosect of so-called Vaishnavas. In the opinion of Rupa Gosvami, such activities are simply disturbances to the standard way of devotional service. Sri Rupa Gosvami says that learned acharyas recommend that we follow the regulative principles even after the development of spontaneous love for Krishna. — Nectar of Devotion 16

* To speculate on what your eternal position with Krishna is, or to have some one tell you what it is, is a sign of a prakrta-sahajiya. You will know when you get to that platform. It is irrelevant in the practice of bhakti yoga to speculate on this. Srila Prabhupada says, “That will be revealed when you are liberated. Why you are bothering now?” (Morning Walk, 6-7-76, LA)

* According to the Vedanta Sutra (4.4.1) and Sri Sanatana Goswami (Brhadbagavatamrtam, 2.2), a soul never gets given a spiritual body at any time. The spiritual body is an eternal and inseparable facet of the individual soul, the jiva-atma. The spiritual form of the self is eternally and inseparably connected to the individual self. 

* My spiritual body is inseparable from me and, though dormant, my spiritual body has been with me for all of eternity. When a soul desires to render service to the Lord in his spiritual form then the dormant spiritual body becomes fully manifest. This is clearly stated to be the case in the Vedanta Sutra and in more recent texts such as Sri Sanatana Goswami’s book Brhadbhagavatamrtam. It is utterly wrong to think that a soul can be given a spiritual body.
Srila Prabhupada Conversations, Morning Walk, 6-7-76, LA

PADA: Yes, that was my understanding from Srila Prabhupada all along. We have already got our spiritual identity -- or rasa with Krishna -- that is currently covered, but our identity is already established. Of course it is is possible for a jeeva to change rasas, but that is very rare under special conditions. 

When Lalit Prasada told some of our devotee what their spiritual form was, and one of them was a peacock, the peacock later fell down and was not very steady. OK it was premature to tell this person he is a peacock.   

Prabhupada: In this sahajiya party, then preaching will be finished. Siddha-pranali. Then everything will be finished. Preaching will be finished.

Tamala Krsna: What does that mean, Srila Prabhupada, siddha-pranali?

Prabhupada: Siddha-pranali is nonsense. They have manufactured a siddha-pranali.

Ramesvara: [break] …the initiation that you are given your siddhas, your eternal position.

Prabhupada: They have learned it from these Radha-kunda babajis.

Tamala Krsna: From Radha-kunda babajis?

Prabhupada: Babajis, yes. After all, they’re fool, rascals, so whatever they say. Let them say all nonsense. They are disqualified. Sahajiya babajis, that’s all.

Ramesvara: Srila Prabhupada, when the devotee is in the original relationship with Krsna, his siddha-deha, why is it that he sometimes changes his original rasa with Krsna?

Prabhupada: Hm?

Ramesvara: Each one of us has an original relationship with Krsna, some as plant, some as tree, some as cow, some as cowherd boy. So if that is re-established, why should the devotee desire to change it?

Prabhupada: Well, that is spiritual kingdom. You can change if you like.

Tamala Krsna: It is not static, Prabhupada once explained. Love is not static.

Prabhupada: Generally, it is not changed. Just like mother Yasoda, she’s mother all the time, eternally.

Tamala Krsna: The question came in Bombay two or three years ago. Prabhupada said that it is not static. You can have (inaudible).

Hari-sauri: I always understood before that the rasa was fixed, but that within that rasa one may take different…, one may take a different line.

Prabhupada: That will be revealed when you are liberated. Why you are bothering now?

Prabhupada: A patient is thinking, “How shall I dance when I become healthy?” First of all, rascal, become healthy, then talk of all this. The rascals are thinking like that. You are patient; first of all cure your disease, material disease. Then talk of all this. Utopian. “When I will get rich, how I shall treat…. I shall…. Then my wife is disobedient and I shall kick her like this,” (laughter)

Ramesvara: That’s the point.

“A bhakta will naturally be attracted towards a specific bhava and mood of service. It is inherent within the bhakta. Everyone is different.” 

That is the whole point.

To speculate on what your eternal position with Krishna is, or to have some one tell you what it is, is a sign of a prakrta-sahajiya. You will know when you get to that platform. It is irrelevant in the practice of bhakti yoga to speculate on this. 

Srila Prabhupada says: “That will be revealed when you are liberated. Why you are bothering now?”

PADA: Preaching finished, yep, these siddha pranali people are famous for sitting in a solitary place and not preaching. 

The Spiritual Form of the Self

by Sriman Muralidhar das

Following is a critique of the philosophy of the Radha Kunda babajis who teach that when a disciple comes to a guru he should be “given” a spiritual body of a manjari. In this article, the author carefully presents the teachings of Prabhupada Srila Bhakti Siddhanta Saraswati Thakur who taught that this “siddha pranali” system of worship is a concoction and a deviation from the ways of devotion taught by Sri Rupa-Sanatana.

A significant aspect of the siddha-pranali doctrine as it is generally practiced nowadays is the proposition that a guru will assign a spiritual body to their disciple. Followers of this doctrine think the spiritual form of a liberated person is given by their guru to a devotee.

For example, in a book about manjari swarup written by Kunjabihari das Babaji he wrote:

“In the Lord’s abode, there are an unlimited number of forms, all suitable for rendering service to him. Every one of those forms is non-different from him, being expanded from his effulgence; each one is eternal, full of consciousness and bliss. They are the crowning, central jewels of the spiritual world – its very life. 

These unlimited spiritual bodies are the perfected forms of the liberated souls which are awarded to an individual, according to his taste, when he reaches the state of absolute liberation. This state is called attainment of the spiritual body. All these spiritual bodies are eternal for they exist even before the liberated souls enter them and will continue to exist ever afterward. However, prior to the entry of the liberated soul they are in an inactive state.”

As all of the unlimited souls are servants of the Lord, each one of them has a spiritual body in the Lord’s abode just suitable for rendering service to the Lord. When an individual becomes qualified for direct service to the Lord by the grace of the Goddess of Devotion, then the Supreme Lord awards him that spiritual body.

According to this school of belief, a devotee must be “awarded” or “given” a spiritual body (siddha-deha) by their guru so they can practice the meditation that they are assisting Sri Radha in the divine pastimes of the spiritual world. If some disciple has not been given a spiritual body by their guru then how can the disciple engage in the practice of raganuga bhakti?

Yet it must be pointed out that according to the Vedanta Sutra (4.4.1) and Sri Sanatana Goswami (Brhadbagavatamrtam, 2.2), a soul never gets given a spiritual body at any time. The spiritual body is an eternal and inseparable facet of the individual soul, the jiva-atma. The spiritual form of the self is eternally and inseparably connected to the individual self. My spiritual body is inseparable from me and, though dormant, my spiritual body has been with me for all of eternity. 

When a soul desires to render service to the Lord in his spiritual form then the dormant spiritual body becomes fully manifest. This is clearly stated to be the case in the Vedanta Sutra and in more recent texts such as Sri Sanatana Goswami’s book Brhadbhagavatamrtam. It is utterly wrong to think that a soul can be given a spiritual body. In the commentary by Srila Baladeva Vidyabhusana to verse 4.4.1 (sampadyavirbhavah svena sabdat) of the Vedanta Sutra, Baladeva has written the following:

“The individual soul who, by means of devotional service accompanied with knowledge and renunciation, attains the effulgent Supreme, becomes free from the bondage of karma and attains a body endowed with eight virtues. This body is said to be the soul’s original form. Why is that? The sutra explains, “svena-sabdat” (because of the word “svena”). The word “svena” here means, “in his own original form”. For this reason it cannot be said that this passage means, “the soul arrives there and then accepts a form which is an external imposition”. In that way it is proved that the form here is the original form of the soul.”

In this section of Vedanta Sutra, the topic being discussed is: “When a soul attains liberation does the soul attain a body that is different from himself, as the bodies of demigods are different from their inner self, or does the soul manifest his original identity which is not different from himself?” In Baladeva’s commentary, he emphatically declares that in his sutras Vyasa himself is saying that when a soul becomes liberated they realize their inner identity and see they are a purely spiritual self with an eternal body of full of spiritual consciousness and bliss (sat-chitananda).

Baladeva quotes the Chandogya Upanishad:

“Thus does that serene being, arising from this body, appear in its own form, as soon as it has approached the highest light, the knowledge of Self. He, in that state, is the highest person (uttama purusha). He moves about there laughing or eating, playing, and rejoicing in his mind, be it with women, carriages, or relatives, never minding that body into which he was born.”
Chandogya Upanishad 8.12.3.


Baladev Vidyabhusan then quotes from the Padma Purana:

anur nityo vyapti-silas cid-anandatmakas tatha
aham artho ‘vyayah saksi bhinna-rupah sanatanah

“The soul is atomic, eternal, is present by consciousness everywhere in the material body, is by nature full of spiritual bliss and knowledge, has a sense of individual identity, is unchanging, is a witness within the body, and is different from the Supreme.”

Srila Baladev Vidyabhusan states that the spiritual form of bliss the liberated being attains is the original form of the soul that lay dormant within when the soul was in illusion. The Vedanta Sutra tells us that the spiritual body of the liberated being is the soul’s original form. This form is a form of eternity, knowledge and bliss, as is mentioned in the verse above (cid-ananda-atma). It is not that the soul attains liberation and enters into a spiritual body or a form of existence which is an external imposition, an external state of being different from the self itsef. Not at all. The liberated soul realizes the spiritual nature of one’s own inner being.

Srila Sanatan Gosvami has also presented the same conclusion. In his commentary to verse 2.2186 of Sri Brhadbhagavatamrtam, Srila Sanatan Gosvami quotes Shankaracarya’s verse, “mukta api lilaya vigraham kritva bhagavantam bhajanta”, which he translated as “Even the liberated assume a form and worship the Lord in his pastimes”. Srila Sanatan Gosvami then quotes Srimad Bhagavatam 6.14.5 “muktanam api siddhanam narayana parayana”, that is, “The liberated and perfected souls are engaged in Narayan’s service.” Then Srila Sanatan Gosvami asks himself: “If liberated souls didn’t have forms then how could they engage in the Lord’s service?” The answer: “Bhagavati layam praptasyapi nri dehasya mahamuneh punar narayana rupena pradurbhavah”. Even those who have merged into the Lord have dormant human forms.

The statement of Srila Sanatan Goswami is clear and unambiguous. Even those souls who have never known Krishna and are merged in the formless light of Brahman have dormant human forms.

In another part of Brhad Bhagatamrtam, the commentary to verse 2.2.207, Sri Sanatana Goswami also wrote:

“O great sage, among many millions who are liberated and perfect in knowledge of liberation, one may be a devotee of Lord Narayana, or Krishna. Such devotees, who are fully peaceful, are extremely rare. Impersonalists generally imagine themselves perfect and liberated, and among them a very few may actually attain impersonal liberation. But those rare souls, like all others, are eternal servants of Hari, the all attractive Lord. 

Out of millions of such rare liberated impersonalists, one very fortunate soul may realize this natural fact. Since intelligence is dormant in the “merged” soul, it can be reawakened. Even the liberated souls who have merged into the formless divine light of the spiritual sky retain their eternal spiritual bodies, complete with spiritual mind and senses. Nothing, not even liberation, can ever deprive a jiva of these assets. 

Thus when a liberated soul gains the favour of the Supreme Lord’s personal energy, his spiritual body and senses are reawakened for hearing and chanting the glories of Lord Hari and acting in other ways for the Lord’s pleasure.”

The spiritual body and senses are reawakened, so that the soul returns to his original state of pure siddha perfection. This soul in its pure state, still merged in Brahman, can develop a mood of submission to the Absolute and begin moving towards the gates of the spiritual world. Or, awakening with a false sense of ego, the soul may descend into the world of duality, birth and death. Again and again the jiva may attain Brahman and then fall again, developing an “exploiting” mentality that drags the soul back into samsara. However the soul who enters the kingdom of Narayana attains real immortality.

Elsewhere in Brhad Bhagatamrtam, Srila Sanatan Goswami gives a beautiful description of souls entering the spiritual world of Vaikuntha. The form of one’s self that someone contemplates during one’s life of devotional practice, the stage of sadhana bhakti, is the form you will have in your state of perfection. And that state of being of a soul is capable of further transformation and development.
Srila Sanatan Goswami describes souls entering the spiritual world:

“Some came with associates, some with paraphernalia, and some with both associates and paraphernalia. Some merged their associates and paraphernalia in their own selves and became like penniless solitary sages plunged in the nectar of meditation. Some moment by moment manifested different wonderful and charming forms, each opulent with different and wonderful ornaments, features and pastimes. 

Some were humans, some monkeys, some demigods, some demons, and some sages. Others carried the marks of being initiated in the orders of varna and ashrama. Some were like Indra, Chandra or the other gods. Some had three eyes, some four heads, and some four arms, some eight arms, and some a thousand faces. 

I will tell you the reason for this great wonder: How can they who taste the nectar of devotion to Lord Krishna not be handsome? The glories of Vaikuntha’s residents, who are all beyond the material world of five elements, the glories of Vaikunthaloka and of Vaikuntha’s hero, Narayana, cannot be described with the examples drawn from the world of five elements. ”
(Brhad Bhagatamrtam 2.4.35-41)

Forum Discussions

The teaching of Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati on raganuga-bhakti is, that ajata ruci (without taste) raganuga sadhakas (practitioners) should adopt the methods of raganuga sadhana that they are qualified to adopt in proportion to their development of sacred greed (lobhamayi sraddha), while following the angas (limbs) of vaidhi bhakti (regulated devotional service).

This follows Sri Jiva Goswami’s Bhakti-sandarbha 311
ajata-tadrsa-rucina tu sad-visesa adaramatradrta
raganugapi vaidhi-samvalitaivanus heya/
tatha loka-sangrahartam pratis hitena jata-tadrsa-rucina ca/
atra misratve ca tyatha-yogyam raganugayaikikrtyaiva vaidhi kartavya.

“One in whom this taste (ruci) has not arisen but who has come to appreciate raganuga-bhakti only on account of appreciation for a particular saint or scripture (sat), may still practice raganuga-bhakti but with an admixture of vaidhi-bhakti. In the same way, for the sake of preaching (loka-sangrahartaham) one who is advanced and in whom taste has manifested should also practice raganuga with an admixture of vaidhi. Such mixing of the two kinds of bhakti means that one practices vaidhi-bhakti by uniting it with whatever raganuga practices one is capable of.”

In the opinion of Sri Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati, such mixing of the two kinds of bhakti means that one embrace the angas of vaidhi-bhakti with a view to attain greater eligibility for raganuga-bhakti and its sadhya (goal) by uniting them with whatever raganuga practices one is eligible for (yatah-yogyam). In his opinion this did not include an emphasis on meditating on the pastimes of Radha-Krsna from the vantage point of one’s siddha deha for those who had not attained the stage of nistha, based on the reasoning that dhyana (meditation) requires a pure heart, whereas kirtanam (chanting) does not. He reasoned, as has Sri Sanatana Goswami in Brhad-bhagavatamrta, that smaranam (remembering) arises naturally out of kirtanam. 

Thus he emphasized nama smaranam for beginners, stressing inoffensive chanting that would lead naturally to meditation on Krsna’s form (rupa samaranam), qualities (guna smaranam), and pastimes (lila smaranam). (lila-smaranam, the remembrance of one’s lila in Krishna’s pastimes)

Of course he also emphasized mantra dhyana of Gopala mantra, kama gayatri, etc., and these mantras were given to sadhakas only after they had attained a degree of steadiness in nama smaranam (japa).

Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati was reacting to what he perceived as ‘a sleight of hand’ in the name of giving, or in some cases making a business out of and selling siddha pranali. Thus his position was that sadhakas while aspiring for Vraja bhakti should do kirtanam and that as this kirtanam qualified them they should combine it with smaranam. Furthermore he maintained that one’s svarupa would be glimpsed in the stages of ruci and asakti, at which time effective and meaningful lila smaranam from the vantage point of one’s svarupa could take place propelling the sadhaka into bhava bhakti.

I don’t see people engaged in astakaliya lila-smaran from day one. The idea that nama-kirtan is required to bring about purity of heart, which gives a solid basis for smaran, is there in Jiva’s Bhakti-sandarbha, too. Smaran and kirtan supplement each other.

I discussed the matter of lila-smaranam with Baba last time I was at Radha Kund. He told me to not worry of it, that it would eventually come, and when it would naturally come, I could commence with astakaliya-lila. Until then, I was to engage in nama-japa, diksa-mantra-smaran and Giridhari-seva, and also manasik yogapitha-seva to become better acquainted with the basic scenario and personalities in the lila, including myself.

No objection there, either — it’s just that we hear of our svarupa prior to attaining our first glimpses of it as ruci and asakti arise. This hearing provides us with incentive to yearn for the attainment, just as hearing of Krishna’s qualities and pastimes gives rise to eagerness for direct darshan.

A bhakta will naturally be attracted towards a specific bhava and mood of service. It is inherent within the bhakta. Everyone is different.

One’s siddha-deha is not something manufactured in the mind of a conditioned soul, nor is it artificially assigned, nor is it something to dangle before disciples of the lineage of Bhaktisiddhanta Saraswati to say, “You cannot attain siddha-deha (Vraja bhakti) without coming to our lineage.”

The siddha-deha is gradually revealed to the sadhakas realization, qualification and progress in devotional service. There is no need to artificially designate or assign a siddha-deha. It lies already dormant within the self and will fully manifest, when the bhakta develops real love or prema bhakti.

Instead of onself or the guru concocting an imaginary spiritual identity, simply meditating upon Krishnas name will reveal everything in due course of time. It is therefore not necessary for the guru to artificially give siddha-pranali to the disciple. This view is held by all bonafide vaishnava goswamis.

Srila Prabhupada Letter to Rupanuga — Los Angeles 8 August, 1969

My Dear Rupanuga, please accept my blessings. I beg to thank you very much for your letter of August 3rd, 1969, and I have noted the contents carefully. In further reference to your question about the form of the spirit soul of the conditioned living entity, there is a spiritual form always, but it develops fully only when the living entity goes back to Vaikuntha.

This form develops according to the desire of the living entity. Until this perfectional stage is reached, the form is lying dormant like the form of the tree is lying dormant in the seed.