Probably, not! (More evidence of sahajiya-vada) ys pd
Saturday, March 31, 2012
Free ISKCON E-books site
http://www.iskconmedia.com/
PADA: Be advised, there are a lot of GBC's books here, and many unknown translations of various Vaishnava's books, however there are also a lot of Srila Prabhupada books here too, ok probably not the originals. There are also many MP3s. Anyway, supposedly its made so you can read them on smart phones and I-pads. Anyone who has tried to download should make a comment so we know how good it works. Any other feed back from users would be appreciated. ys pd
PADA: Be advised, there are a lot of GBC's books here, and many unknown translations of various Vaishnava's books, however there are also a lot of Srila Prabhupada books here too, ok probably not the originals. There are also many MP3s. Anyway, supposedly its made so you can read them on smart phones and I-pads. Anyone who has tried to download should make a comment so we know how good it works. Any other feed back from users would be appreciated. ys pd
Bhavananda account by Dwarkadish prabhu
Dear devotees
Please accept my humble obeisences. All glories to Srila Prabhupada
Most have probably seen the picture of Dwakadish as a child where Srila Prabhupada holds his hand to teach him sanskrit. Srila Prabhupada loved the children, and I am very sad about the abuse many of them had to suffer.Some idiots may say well it was just his karma prabhu .This is just rascaldom.There is simply no good excuses. That his God brothers covered up for Bhavanandas homosexual activities and these past sins is the greatest sin in itself, and to this day, Bhavanada is more welcome in Mayapure than most of us.What has the GBC done to reach out to Dwarakadish Prabhu and try to help him.And the many other children abused in the past? I have also met a Guru kuli boy Acuyta from Nepal in Kakinnada AP, 1986 staying with a devotee family, that was previously in the Gurukula in Mayapura and told me about the sexual molestations of Nitai Chand, Bhavananda and Satadhanya of indian and nepali Gurukulis. The CPO and GBC has not done nothing to remove Bhavananda and Satadhanya from Mayapura and to this day share the support of Jayapataka Swami and Bhakti Caru Swami. Today on this holy appearance day of Lord Ramachandra, I ask justice be served for these past Gurukulis.In the court of Lord Ramachandra such crimes would have been punished severely. your servant Paramananda
=================
Dear Paramanda,
Here the stuff I reported on Bhavs. This is pretty much the stuff I already posted. New York Gurukula 1970 This was my first encounter with Bhavananda. I remember an incident when he took both boys and girls down to the basement at the New York temple and made us take our dhotis and dresses down and paddled us with no clothes on. I can't remember for what reason.
Mayapur, 1975 It was very difficult to live here because of the facilities lacking such as running water and the heat. Bhavs ran a fear campaign. All the Bengali boys used to say, "If you don't work no prasad." Bhavs had it in for me. He loved to pick on me since I was skinny and shy. He would punch me in my arm every time I would walk by him chanting my japa in the temple room. This must have gone on for months. I had black and blue bruises up and down my arms. I told Jagadish das and Hrdayananda M about it when they came to visit and I had no sympathy from them.
Bhavs would love to play the gong at Sundar arotika evening worship. For those of us that he saw spacing out or not chanting would get a nice whack on the head leaving bumps. I must have gotten this treatment repeatedly since I was always so tired.
Your Friend Dwarkadish
Please accept my humble obeisences. All glories to Srila Prabhupada
Most have probably seen the picture of Dwakadish as a child where Srila Prabhupada holds his hand to teach him sanskrit. Srila Prabhupada loved the children, and I am very sad about the abuse many of them had to suffer.Some idiots may say well it was just his karma prabhu .This is just rascaldom.There is simply no good excuses. That his God brothers covered up for Bhavanandas homosexual activities and these past sins is the greatest sin in itself, and to this day, Bhavanada is more welcome in Mayapure than most of us.What has the GBC done to reach out to Dwarakadish Prabhu and try to help him.And the many other children abused in the past? I have also met a Guru kuli boy Acuyta from Nepal in Kakinnada AP, 1986 staying with a devotee family, that was previously in the Gurukula in Mayapura and told me about the sexual molestations of Nitai Chand, Bhavananda and Satadhanya of indian and nepali Gurukulis. The CPO and GBC has not done nothing to remove Bhavananda and Satadhanya from Mayapura and to this day share the support of Jayapataka Swami and Bhakti Caru Swami. Today on this holy appearance day of Lord Ramachandra, I ask justice be served for these past Gurukulis.In the court of Lord Ramachandra such crimes would have been punished severely. your servant Paramananda
=================
Dear Paramanda,
Here the stuff I reported on Bhavs. This is pretty much the stuff I already posted. New York Gurukula 1970 This was my first encounter with Bhavananda. I remember an incident when he took both boys and girls down to the basement at the New York temple and made us take our dhotis and dresses down and paddled us with no clothes on. I can't remember for what reason.
Mayapur, 1975 It was very difficult to live here because of the facilities lacking such as running water and the heat. Bhavs ran a fear campaign. All the Bengali boys used to say, "If you don't work no prasad." Bhavs had it in for me. He loved to pick on me since I was skinny and shy. He would punch me in my arm every time I would walk by him chanting my japa in the temple room. This must have gone on for months. I had black and blue bruises up and down my arms. I told Jagadish das and Hrdayananda M about it when they came to visit and I had no sympathy from them.
Bhavs would love to play the gong at Sundar arotika evening worship. For those of us that he saw spacing out or not chanting would get a nice whack on the head leaving bumps. I must have gotten this treatment repeatedly since I was always so tired.
Your Friend Dwarkadish
======================
Friday, March 30, 2012
Departure of Srimad Bhagavatam dasa
PADA: Apparently our good friend Srimad Bhagavatam dasa has left his body in Los Angeles. He was a huge book distributor in Berkeley, and he was always a great Prabhupadanuga. He will be missed. He was 52 years old and has apparently died from diabetes. ys pd
Rocana joins the ritviks update
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/03-12/editorials8411.htm
PADA: Right, we need to display photos of Srila Prabhupada along with his history and and declare he is the main acharya for ISKCON. Rocana has re-joined the ritviks? ys pd
PADA: Right, we need to display photos of Srila Prabhupada along with his history and and declare he is the main acharya for ISKCON. Rocana has re-joined the ritviks? ys pd
Question for Tripurari swami - Sridhara maharaja folks no.5
5) Yasodananda visits Sridhara Maharaja, March 1978.
First of all the GBC deputed Yasodananda prabhu to make the original contact with Sridhara Maharaja in 1978. When Yasodananda first went to visit Sridhara in Navadvip, Sridhara maharaja was self-evidently very shocked that the GBC wanted to have anything to do with him at all, since SRILA PRABHUPADA had made so many negative comments about him personally; As well as comments about Sridhara's unfortunate concoctions in the Gaudiya Matha; And the Gaudiya Matha's false guru's disasters in general -- as we often find in Srila Prabhupada's conversations, lectures, letters, and even in his books. (Sridhara Maharaja later commented that he was well aware of criticisms of him and the Gaudiya Matha in Srila Prabhupada's works).
And we were personally also surprised to find that Sridhara Maharaja was the new "higher authority" and "shiksha guru" for the GBC since -- in 1970 Himavati dasi came back from Sridhara's matha in Mayapura crying in Srila Prabhupada's room, complaining that the big leaders of Sridhara's math were laughing and joking that Srila Prabhupada was "the guru of the hippies and mlecchas." Srila Prabhupada told us, do not go to his ashram anymore. We never did go after that.
Notice also that in the later part of 1977 (conversation will be added below) Srila Prabhupada was agreeing with Satsvarupa that Sridhara Maharaja was ALL ALONG SINCE 1966 aloof and he WAS NOT associating with Srila Prabhupada. And Sridhara Maharaja was instead associating with the malefic Mayapura God brothers who hated Srila Prabhupada (like Madhava maharaja). We also find a letter from Srila Prabhupada where he had wanted to buy some land from Sridhara Maharaja in Mayapura, but that Sridhara Maharaja was asking for too much money, so ISKCON could not buy the land. Why wasn't Sridhara Maharaja just donating the land instead of bumping up the price?
It makes no sense that Sridhara would be so much aloof all along, indeed Sridhara would be criticized all the way to the end of 1977 for being "aloof" with Srila Prabhupada agreeing, and then all of a sudden Sridhara Maharaja would emerge as the main "next leader" of ISKCON? Also at the end of 1977 Sridhara Maharaja was being DIRECTLY criticized by Srila Prabhupada for being one of the important founders of the homosexual Bagh Bazaar guru party, which Srila Prabhupada said was a deviation and was the "severe offenders" party. Why would we be "taking advice" from the person who was: aloof, who was associating with the envious God brothers like Madhava Maharaja, and who was the founder father of the "severe offender's" party? This makes no sense at all.
Even some of the factual followers of Sridhara Maharaja have agreed with me: Sridhara was not prepared to manage the ISKCON society because he really had not been taking part in the ISKCON society, and thus he did not know how it was functioning. It is still quite common for us to hear things like "Sridhara Maharaja did not know how manipulative the GBC were," and -- he did not know this, he did not know that and so forth. Yes, he was aloof and was not participating. Apparently, Sridhara did not even know that Srila Prabhupada had said that he would not appoint any successors?
And it furthermore makes sense that Sridhara "was not prepared" to deal with the problems in ISKCON, because he had not been "prepared for the task" by Srila Prabhupada, because -- he had never been given that task in the first place? Some of the followers of Sridhara Maharaja have told me for example -- Sridhara did not know that Srila Prabhupada had suspended sannyasa in 1977, so Sridhara thought they were gurus because he did not know Srila Prabhupada had been making negative comments about these leaders? Right, Sridhara did not know because he was aloof and he was not being prepped to be the advisor by Srila Prabhupada.
Certainly Srila Prabhupada would have brought Sridhara Maharaja over for some weeks, months or even years of preparation of how he should interact with the GBC leaders, if Sridhara was intended to be the new "shiksha guru advisor" for ISKCON? Wouldn't Srila Prabhupada have introduced his GBC leadership council to Sridhara Maharaja and said, "Here are the ISKCON GBC leaders, and we'd like you to help them manage the society by using this system, or that system," ... but no such conversations ever took place that we know of? In fact, this made no sense EVEN to Sridhara Maharaja himself. He was totally shocked to hear he was going to be the new "advisor." Why was Sridhara being deputed to be the new advisor for ISKCON, when he had not even been told he was going to be the advisor, or what things he would need to know to help manage the society the way Srila Prabhupada had wanted?
Tamal said basically the same thing, if Srila Prabhupada had appointed gurus he would have talked about it at least for 30 days, not merely thirty minutes? And thus the same thing would apply to Sridhara Maharaja. If he was the intented new advisor for ISKCON after 1978, why was the system of taking Sridhara's advice not known to either Sridhara Maharaja himself, nor most of the GBC's leaders, nor apparently any of us rank and file? None of us were ever informed that Sridhara had been appointed as the new advisor for ISKCON either? It seems self-evident that Srila Prabhupada would have spent time setting this up, but he never did because he did not want Sridhara Maharaja to be the advisor.
Of course the GBC later wrote a paper after 1982 called "Purity Is The Force" where they cited quotes from Srila Prabhupada saying, we should not visit Sridhara Maharaja. And since Srila Prabhupada had said "amongst my God brothers, no one is qualified to be acharya," why would he appoint Sridhara Maharaja as the advisor aka "siksha guru acharya," knowing Sridhara was not qualified to act as acharya? And why would Sridhara Maharaja de facto appoint the 11 GBC as gurus knowing that Srila Prabhupada was always saying they are barely fit to be even the most neophyte of devotees at all?
SRILA PRABHUPADA: "Now has the GBC become more than Guru Maharaja? As if simply GBC is meant for looking after pounds, shilling, pence. The GBC does not look after spiritual life. That is the defect. All of our students will have to become guru but they are not qualified. This is the difficulty." (Alanath, 11/10/75)
April 22, 1977 Tamal Krsna is admitting that he and his God brothers are all conditioned souls, that none of them are qualified to be gurus. So how is it that they ALL suddenly became "qualified gurus," all at the SAME TIME, immediately after Srila Prabhupada's disappearance? Srila Prabhupada is saying here in April of 1977 that no one is yet qualified to be guru, not one single person. How can it go from "no one" is qualified in April of 1977, to 11 are "qualified to be gurus" in just a few months?? Its called rubber stamp guru, not bona fide guru!
Prabhupada: What is the use of producing some rascal guru?
Tamala Krsna: Well, I have studied myself and all of your disciples, and it’s clear fact that we are all conditioned souls, so we cannot be guru. Maybe one day it may be possible...
Prabhupada: Hm.
Tamala Krsna: ...but not now.
Prabhupada: Yes. I shall choose some guru. I shall say, “Now you become acarya. You become authorised.” I am waiting for that. You become all acarya. I retire completely. But the training must be complete.
Tamala Krsna: The process of purification must be there.
Prabhupada: Oh, yes, must be there. Caitanya Mahaprabhu wants that. Amara ajnaya guru hana. "You become guru." (laughs) But be qualified. Little thing, strictly follower...
Tamala Krsna: Not rubber stamp.
Prabhupada: Then you'll not be effective. You can cheat, but it will not be effective. Just see our Gaudiya Matha. Everyone wanted to become guru, and a small temple and "guru." What kind of guru?
PADA: Notice, Srila Prabhupada goes back to criticizing Sridhara Maharaja's policy, yes, the Gaudiya Matha's leaders, ok -- like Sridhara Maharaja -- made gurus, but what kind of gurus? OK, bogus gurus. And the result was: "the Gaudiya Matha mission was finished" -- at least according to Srila Prabhupada.
Thursday, March 29, 2012
Bad flourish when good people are silent
Potatoe Pakora says: The time to have stepped up was back in 1977 when the Tamal’s power group was rising. Whats the old saying? Evil men prosper when good men fail to act. The question is where were all the good men in Isckon in 1977? Why did they not stop this crime? That time has long gone, Iskcon is a massive powerful religious institution now, you get in the way of that institution and you will end up dead. I still don’t accept the death of Aindra Das’s as an accidental gas explosion, he had been warned not to publish his book and many more murders have taken place in Mayapur and were setup to look like suicides. Make no mistake this is a serious institution that has more than money, power and wealth it has control of the masses that support it.
Attmempted murders also took place in Australia instigated by Bhavananda and the sick sycophants and cronies that supported him and those sychophants are still with us, they just swap allegiance to whoever holds the power base.
I left Iskcon along time ago and worship my deities in seculsion, I visit India and the holy dhams and I can freely move about associating with Bhakta’s without any regard for institutional boundries because they are all in the family tree of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Iskcon is one little branch on that massive tree.
Attmempted murders also took place in Australia instigated by Bhavananda and the sick sycophants and cronies that supported him and those sychophants are still with us, they just swap allegiance to whoever holds the power base.
I left Iskcon along time ago and worship my deities in seculsion, I visit India and the holy dhams and I can freely move about associating with Bhakta’s without any regard for institutional boundries because they are all in the family tree of Sri Chaitanya Mahaprabhu and Iskcon is one little branch on that massive tree.
=======================================
Wednesday, March 28, 2012
Gurukuli Dictionary by Maddy
[PADA: This is good, it shows that more of the children of ISKCON are waking up to the guru scam and they are making fun of these hokey messiahs. ys pd]
A
* Aparadha (n.) [as in "to commit an aparadha"] to blast, roast, gruel (British usage), chew out, harass, or dis (American usage).
* Aspiring (v.): guru-hunting, guru-flirting, guru-shopping, guru-scoping, and so on.
* Associating (n.) second marriage; not married before the sacrificial fire.
* Austerity (n.) toilet cleaning. See also service.
B
* Bhakta (n.) bottom of the food chain; the people who don’t get maha sweets. Also musical bhakta: a unique 'avadhuta' bhakta who is exported and repeatedly shifted from temple to temple. Also boomerang bhakta: when the above scheme fails and the 'importing' temple stamps "Wrong Address: Return to Sender" on said bhakta. See also austerity. See also TP.
* Bhakta poaching (n.) when one temple does the preaching and the feeding and another one smoothly shaves and bundles him off to their temple. Usually occurs at large gatherings of potential joinees, e.g. Rainbow Gatherings.
* Bhakta leader (n.) he that gets you off the mental platform by administering said beating.
Blasting (v.) explaining the philosophy to a non-devotee; giving the mercy; general fits of impersonating Srila Prabhupada’s accent and heaviness.
* Bloop (v.) to eat chocolate near the temple or watch the in-flight movie with headphones.
* Bogus (adj.) generic abbreviation for "I don’t know the Sanskrit to prove you wrong".
* Boil sprout (n.) the maha thief in India.
* Boomerang bhakta: see bhakta.
* Brahmana (n.) dude with the thread who doesn’t do the service. See also sudra.
* BSP (n.) [abbr. brief samadhi period] sleeping in Srimad-Bhagavatam class.
C
* CID (n.) [abbr. Compulsive Initiation Disorder] cases found exclusively in gurus of the last twenty years.
* CTD (n.) [abbr. Compulsive Traveling Disorder] serious cases found in gurus and sannyasis. May extend to TPs, too.
D
* Determined prabhu (n.) second-time vanaprastha on the sannyasa list, again.
* Devotional singer (n.) he that possesses no ear for music or tone; to have bad vocal chords. Also known as alternate singer.
* Disciple poaching (n.) [archaic since late 1980s guru reforms] initiating into someone else’s zone. See also bhakta poaching.
* DM (n.) [abbr. devotee maintenance] three dollars per month laundry allowance usually spent on chocolate and movies.
E
* Extended pranam (n.) see pranam.
F
* Fall down (n.) refers to the actual offense of shaggery or buggery. See also falling down.
* Falling down (v.) refers to chatting up, flirting with, or checking out matajis. Sometimes referred to as passing the ghee lamp.
* Fringie (n.) guys in bhakta pants and kurta wielding the tiffin at the front of the Sunday Feast line.
G
* Gopi (n.) members of the gopi-bhava club or premature raghanuga-bhakti interns.
* Grhastha (n.) guys in the temple room sporting visible underwear lines; to wear the ‘other’ underwear.
H
* Harinam (n.) see sankirtan.
* Hitting the deck (v.) see pranam.
* Humbles. [from PAMHO or "please accept my humble obeisances"] trendy greeting. See also VKji.
I
* IZB (n.) [abbr. illegal zone breach] [archaic since late 1980s guru reforms] sneaking into someone else’s zone and either making money without giving a cut to said zone’s guru or invading into that zone to carry out illegal disciple farming and harvesting. See also disciple poaching.
J
* Japa (n.) see sankirtan.
* Japa demon (n.) one who monopolizes the sound area with vigorous chanting.
* Japa patrolman (n.) guy who scopes your counter beads, looks you over with measuring eyes, and asks knowingly, "How are you today? Are you chanting your prescribed number of rounds?"
* Jai’s Secret (n.) [from jai meaning victory, hence Victory’s secret] kaupinware made from silk.
K
* Kama (n.) desire; inclination to horniness or randiness; showing much attention to the back of the temple room. See also falling down.
* Kuli (n.) [abbr. gurukuli] non-joiners; inborn members who do drum wailing (see play mrdanga) and have smart philosophical answers for everything.
* Kuli-tag (n.) kuli-wannabes who never join, but hang out and crash the reunions.
L
* Life member (n.) that Indian lady who walks through a boring class and nonchalantly farts on her way out without batting an eye.
M
* Mataji (n.) the gals at the back.
* Maya (adj. n.) general blacklisting label often used to proclaim users ignorance.
* Mental platform (n.) not being sure if the mind needs the shoe or the broom for the morning beating. See also bhakta leader.
* Musical bhakta (n.) see bhakta.
* Modes (n.) [usage "the modes"] state of being all partied out, for example after a gulabjamun-eating contest.
* MG (n.) [abbr. marriage guru] non-married member of the society who arranges short-term marriages.
N
O
* Old school (adj.) disciples of Srila Prabhupada; those that start conversations with, "I remember you when you were only this big…" or "I remember back in ’69 in Berkeley…"
P
* Passing the ghee lamp (v.) see falling down.
* Play mrdanga (v.) to wail on a drum.
* Pranam (v.) to recognize, give much respect, or give much love. Also known as hitting the deck. Also extended pranam: state wherein exhaustion has overcome the devotee and he never gets back off the floor. May be accompanied by snoring.
* Pujaris (n.) chubbier devotees with 24-hour access to the maha-room.
Q
R
* RDMC (n.) [abbr. Russian Database Marriage Candidate] late-blooming forty-plus brahmacari. See also WMF.
S
* Sahasrakoti. [from sahasrakoti dandavats or "one thousand million obeisances"] trendy greeting. See also VKji.
* Sanga (v.) to chill with, hang out, or be tight with.
* Sankirtan (n.) to get down and boogie with the mantra; to "groove with the Krishnas". Also known as harinam when taken to the hood; also known as japa when confined to a bead bag.
* Service (n.) sweeping, vegetable cutup, pot washing, wall painting. See also austerity.
* Siva-puja (n.) to smoke the other kind of incense.
* Sudra (n.) the guys who do the service. See also austerity. See also brahmana.
* Space out (v.) condition referring to devotees in Srimad-Bhagavatam class. See also BSP.
* Squeeker (n.) high-voiced devotee who controls himself with extremely tight kaupinware.
* Stool (n.) generic all-purpose ISKCON criticism of anything and everything.
T
* TP (n.) [abbr. temple president] the guy near the top the food chain who gets all the maha. See also bhakta.
U
* Utsahan (n.) waking up at 1:00 AM and doing your rounds and reading.
V
* VG (n.) [abbr. virtual guru] gurus who recruit, cultivate, and carry out relationships with disciples electronically through e-mail or by ‘snail’ mail.
* VKji [abbr. vancha kalpa] trendy greeting. See also sahasrakoti and humbles.
W
* Wipers (n.) karmis; those dirty toilet toilet-paper-smearing non-squatters.
* WMF (n.) [abbr. Will Marry for Food] the lustier bhaktins. (You know the ones I’m talking about.) See also RDMC.
X
Y
Z
Being afraid of ISKCON leaders by Payonidhi dasa
PAMHO AGTSP
I see -- again and again -- how some devotees are scared of ISKCON leaders. I have never feared anyone of them, though they have tried so many times to intimidate me. They have always just wanted my money, and hard labor. If a woman so-called Mataji has chased me in the temple, I have been falsly accused. I have been lied too, I have been threatened with violence. So many false accusations. I have worked with ISKCON leaders that where having illicit sex, and being too lazy to do Harinama and book distribution. They just want to sit in the temple and think they are as good as Lord Visnu, with a lotus growing from their navel, and that we are their Brahma sitting in darkness, waiting for them to say "Do Tapa" go and collect money for them.
Every day I talk to devotees that have a sad story to tell but simply are too scared to come forward. Mostly they are all about money and sex, and abuse and scandals, some Guru grappling a female disciples breasts or buying the female disciple lingerie's. When will it end ? When do I not have to hear these things?
They will not step up to the plate, because they are scared, is this vaisnava aparadha if the Guru touched my breasts? Such foolishness and brainwashing and indoctrination.This is making ISKCON into a cult. Absolute power corrupts. ISKCON is all about absolute power, not about spreading KC. It is that simple. Use the KC philosophy for a comfortable living and not preach KC.
I told this one devotee either step up to the plate or are you spreading false rumors? Things often get denied in ISKCON. Institutional politics and all. I just worry about my own KC and stay aloof from the madness. But there is a sense of fear that if I expose anything wrong in ISKCON, even when it is supremely wrong, I will be the next Monkey on the stick.
I will never forget when Niranjana Swami did not chastise a couple that was having illicit sex in the temple, and his female disciple got pregnant right there in the Boston temple. And then he is such a rascal he came to me and pressured me to get married, because he did not want anyone to expose this couple. Such dirty things goes on in ISKCON. (Boston temple has a history of illicit sex in the past anyway one after the other).
I have been to hundreds of temples in ISKCON where grhastha "grhamedhis" engage in illicit sex and do not preach and use the temple simply for making money. Doing hindu pujas, car pujas, Satya Narayana pujas, wedding of non devotees. Well if "Monkey on the stick" not for real, think again, ISKCON leaders make an example of you if you expose their nonsense.
They chew you up and spit you out. Sulocana was killed when he exposed Kirtananda....I say bulldoze all ISKCON Samadhis except Srila Prabhupadas and make Sulocana Prabhus memory stick out, here lies the devotee who was made a Monkey on a stick. Some call me so many names, sensationalist etc. No these are facts. I preach pure KC and so many persons thinks I am their enemy because they do not like fasting from grains on Janmastami, they do not like to follow 4 regs and chant even minimum 16 rounds. They refuse to distribute Srila Prabhupadas books, doing their Visnu meditation, tat tvam asmi.
I know what my solution is to become a pure devotee of Krsna and Srila Prabhupada. I have no fears of any ISKCON leader that act in a bogus way. Govinda Datta asked me why I was so heavy with Ramabhadra, even calling him names, because he has offended so many vaisnavas with his improper behavior (including Puru Prabhu and Locanananda Prabhu), and allowing even the Brooklyn temple's Bingo hall and gambling and meat-eating, and so many crazy things always goes on in ISKCON Brooklyn. I used to chastise him; Why he is always chasing women in the temple, then he had one lusty bhaktin chase me, even all the way to LA, this is raksasa style. He can not be trusted because he is a demon. Not sure what is worse, the temple or the Zoo? To me when Ramabhadra organizes Ratha yatra it becomes Raksasa yatra because he is just doing it to make money and because he has too.... to uphold his false prestige.
I see -- again and again -- how some devotees are scared of ISKCON leaders. I have never feared anyone of them, though they have tried so many times to intimidate me. They have always just wanted my money, and hard labor. If a woman so-called Mataji has chased me in the temple, I have been falsly accused. I have been lied too, I have been threatened with violence. So many false accusations. I have worked with ISKCON leaders that where having illicit sex, and being too lazy to do Harinama and book distribution. They just want to sit in the temple and think they are as good as Lord Visnu, with a lotus growing from their navel, and that we are their Brahma sitting in darkness, waiting for them to say "Do Tapa" go and collect money for them.
Every day I talk to devotees that have a sad story to tell but simply are too scared to come forward. Mostly they are all about money and sex, and abuse and scandals, some Guru grappling a female disciples breasts or buying the female disciple lingerie's. When will it end ? When do I not have to hear these things?
They will not step up to the plate, because they are scared, is this vaisnava aparadha if the Guru touched my breasts? Such foolishness and brainwashing and indoctrination.This is making ISKCON into a cult. Absolute power corrupts. ISKCON is all about absolute power, not about spreading KC. It is that simple. Use the KC philosophy for a comfortable living and not preach KC.
I told this one devotee either step up to the plate or are you spreading false rumors? Things often get denied in ISKCON. Institutional politics and all. I just worry about my own KC and stay aloof from the madness. But there is a sense of fear that if I expose anything wrong in ISKCON, even when it is supremely wrong, I will be the next Monkey on the stick.
I will never forget when Niranjana Swami did not chastise a couple that was having illicit sex in the temple, and his female disciple got pregnant right there in the Boston temple. And then he is such a rascal he came to me and pressured me to get married, because he did not want anyone to expose this couple. Such dirty things goes on in ISKCON. (Boston temple has a history of illicit sex in the past anyway one after the other).
I have been to hundreds of temples in ISKCON where grhastha "grhamedhis" engage in illicit sex and do not preach and use the temple simply for making money. Doing hindu pujas, car pujas, Satya Narayana pujas, wedding of non devotees. Well if "Monkey on the stick" not for real, think again, ISKCON leaders make an example of you if you expose their nonsense.
They chew you up and spit you out. Sulocana was killed when he exposed Kirtananda....I say bulldoze all ISKCON Samadhis except Srila Prabhupadas and make Sulocana Prabhus memory stick out, here lies the devotee who was made a Monkey on a stick. Some call me so many names, sensationalist etc. No these are facts. I preach pure KC and so many persons thinks I am their enemy because they do not like fasting from grains on Janmastami, they do not like to follow 4 regs and chant even minimum 16 rounds. They refuse to distribute Srila Prabhupadas books, doing their Visnu meditation, tat tvam asmi.
I know what my solution is to become a pure devotee of Krsna and Srila Prabhupada. I have no fears of any ISKCON leader that act in a bogus way. Govinda Datta asked me why I was so heavy with Ramabhadra, even calling him names, because he has offended so many vaisnavas with his improper behavior (including Puru Prabhu and Locanananda Prabhu), and allowing even the Brooklyn temple's Bingo hall and gambling and meat-eating, and so many crazy things always goes on in ISKCON Brooklyn. I used to chastise him; Why he is always chasing women in the temple, then he had one lusty bhaktin chase me, even all the way to LA, this is raksasa style. He can not be trusted because he is a demon. Not sure what is worse, the temple or the Zoo? To me when Ramabhadra organizes Ratha yatra it becomes Raksasa yatra because he is just doing it to make money and because he has too.... to uphold his false prestige.
Isvaro aham bhogi siddhavan balavan sukhi.....
YS
Paramananda das
YS
Paramananda das
Tuesday, March 27, 2012
Why the secrecy over GBC minutes?
http://prabhupadavision.com/2012/03/gbc-minutes/#comment-17221
PADA: No doubt the GBC’s minutes are: Censored; Re-written several times to edit out what might make them look bad; Made more palatable for the masses; And most of what goes on remains private since there is no doubt a lot of political strategy sessions for holding onto power at all costs. They self-evidently really did not care if tens of thousands of people leave, they only wanted the money and the property all along and that is still all they care about. Its sad to say this, but they are apparently corrupt to the bone, by all evidence and appearances, by their devious actions, and by their lack of concern for ISKCON and its citizens. Trivrikrama swami said to me at Rathayatra, the most shocking thing to him was — that I was still alive after writing the way I do, in other words, he was sad that no one had bumped me off by now and got rid of their worst case squeaky wheel problem. Trivrikrama’s main concern was, why are the people who expose us still alive (read: can’t we fix that somehow)? Hee hee, well Krishna kept us alive anyway, it seems Krishna does not take orders from them so He kept us alive. Basically, they are like school yard bullies, and when you run from the school yard bullies, they take your lunch money the next day too, either you fight back, or you get bullied the next day as well. Personally, I’d rather fight and maybe get beat to death, than to not fight and have to hand over my lunch money every day. Live free or die, yes, I’d rather die. ys pd
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Monday, March 26, 2012
Child abusers living in ISKCON
Dear Prabhus, My name is Bhagavat Das. I am twice initiated by Srila Prabhupada and I have been around since 1970. My wife Radha and I were licensed foster parents for 9 years. We took care of close to 70 children in our home during that time, many of them physically and sexually abused. My experience with these children as protector, counselor, and guide has put me in a position of understanding to some extent the plight of the Gurukulis. I deeply sympathize with their dissatisfaction with the way ISKCON has handled their situation. If the leaders of ISKCON would follow the first example Srila Prabhupada set for them in dealing with child molesters they would, at the very least, make an important statement to the children that they did not tolerate child abuse.
I was in Allahabad in January 1977 when Srila Prabhupada was at the Kumbha Mela. During that time one of the first known child molesters was caught in Vrndavana and brought to Allahabad to be judged by Srila Prabhupada. Srila Prabhupada curled his lips in disgust and shook his head in great disbelief as he was told how this disciple of his sexually molested practically every child in the Gurukula. Srila Prabhupada was so disgusted that he told the GBC and others who were in the room that this boy, on his order should never for any reason be allowed in any of our temples ever again.
I was in Allahabad in January 1977 when Srila Prabhupada was at the Kumbha Mela. During that time one of the first known child molesters was caught in Vrndavana and brought to Allahabad to be judged by Srila Prabhupada. Srila Prabhupada curled his lips in disgust and shook his head in great disbelief as he was told how this disciple of his sexually molested practically every child in the Gurukula. Srila Prabhupada was so disgusted that he told the GBC and others who were in the room that this boy, on his order should never for any reason be allowed in any of our temples ever again.
When questioned about the severity of the sentence Srila Prabhupada said on occasion the boy could come to a temple for the Sunday feast and eat prasadam. Unfortunately, after Srila Prabhupada left this child molester found his way back into ISKCON’S temples. I would always complain whenever I saw him somewhere but usually to no avail. “He is doing service prabhu” is what I was told as the authorities disregarded the words of Srila Prabhupada. I finally told some grown up Gurukulis the story in Alachua and the next time he came around he was warned to leave ISKCON and never return or else. I heard recently he is in ISKCON temples in India, some things never change.
You will notice that Srila Prabhupada acting as head of the institution of ISKCON gave an order to protect the members of the institution. Acting in his capacity as the guru for the disciple in question he made a slight revision in order to demonstrate the principle of Lord Nityananda’s mercy that no one is beyond redemption, even this child molester. However that mercy is between the guru and the disciple and is in one sense separate from the relationship that Srila Prabhupada has with ISKCON as the head of the institution where he must enforce restrictions for the benefit and protection of the members of the institution.
Based on Srila Prabhupada’s personal handling of the situation I feel that if the leaders of ISKCON are serious about protecting its members in the same manner that Srila Prabhupada did, than the leaders of ISKCON have no other recourse than to institute the following policy: If a person is caught as a child molester in or out of an ISKCON temple; 1) that person should be reported to the proper authorities; 2) that person should never for any reason be allowed in any ISKCON temple ever again except on occasion for a Sunday feast. At that time he may take darshan and prasadam only, no lecture no kirtan or any leadership activity whatsoever. That was Srila Prabhupada’s instruction and it should be followed without change or hesitation. If the person happens to be a pot washer or an ex-guru the punishment should be the same. Since the child who has been molested will feel the same scars no matter what the position of the perpetrator is or was.
Now if the perpetrator in question wants to be a sannyasi or guru independent of ISKCON he can certainly do so and pursue following the instructions of his guru and try to obtain his guru’s mercy by opening his own temples or preaching centers and writing and distributing books. The guru disciple relationship is not terminated by the faults of the disciple. The guru is always ready to give his mercy to someone who is trying to rectify his behavior because no one is beyond redemption. However, he cannot do so within ISKCON the institution because Srila Prabhupada forbade it in order to protect ISKCON’S members.
You will notice that Srila Prabhupada acting as head of the institution of ISKCON gave an order to protect the members of the institution. Acting in his capacity as the guru for the disciple in question he made a slight revision in order to demonstrate the principle of Lord Nityananda’s mercy that no one is beyond redemption, even this child molester. However that mercy is between the guru and the disciple and is in one sense separate from the relationship that Srila Prabhupada has with ISKCON as the head of the institution where he must enforce restrictions for the benefit and protection of the members of the institution.
Based on Srila Prabhupada’s personal handling of the situation I feel that if the leaders of ISKCON are serious about protecting its members in the same manner that Srila Prabhupada did, than the leaders of ISKCON have no other recourse than to institute the following policy: If a person is caught as a child molester in or out of an ISKCON temple; 1) that person should be reported to the proper authorities; 2) that person should never for any reason be allowed in any ISKCON temple ever again except on occasion for a Sunday feast. At that time he may take darshan and prasadam only, no lecture no kirtan or any leadership activity whatsoever. That was Srila Prabhupada’s instruction and it should be followed without change or hesitation. If the person happens to be a pot washer or an ex-guru the punishment should be the same. Since the child who has been molested will feel the same scars no matter what the position of the perpetrator is or was.
Now if the perpetrator in question wants to be a sannyasi or guru independent of ISKCON he can certainly do so and pursue following the instructions of his guru and try to obtain his guru’s mercy by opening his own temples or preaching centers and writing and distributing books. The guru disciple relationship is not terminated by the faults of the disciple. The guru is always ready to give his mercy to someone who is trying to rectify his behavior because no one is beyond redemption. However, he cannot do so within ISKCON the institution because Srila Prabhupada forbade it in order to protect ISKCON’S members.
I hope this teaching of Srila Prabhupada has shed some light on the proper way to handle some of the apparent controversial situations that have arisen lately.
"Another guru line" imbroglio
PADA: The July 9th letter is a continuation of the May 28th tape conversation where he said that he was going to appoint ritviks to conduct initiations for after his departure. The July 9th letter simply verifies what was already discussed, there would be ritivks after his departure. Evil Das is now saying that we have to go to another line because there are many lines, ok none of that was mentioned or discussed. Nor has he identified what line is authorized in his opinion. Another line is like saying there is a pot of gold in a dumpster in Los Angeles, but I am not going to tell you which one? You can spend you whole life looking, and that is what Evil Dasa wants people to do, he has no intention of telling them where the gold is, because there is none, he is bluffing. That is all we get from these people for the past 35 years, there is a real guru somewhere, but who knows where and we are not going to tell you, in other words, they do not want Prabhupada to be worshipped, they would rather you worship no one than him, they just hate to see him being offered the pooja. ys pd
Sunday, March 25, 2012
Rooms for rent for Prabhupadanugas near Los Angeles
Mahatma dasa: Rooms for rent are available at a ritvik Prabhupadanugas home in the Antelope Valley, 60 miles Northeast of down town Los Angeles. Nice area with no smog and more relaxed people than in larger cities. The rooms range from $400.00 to $500.00 per a month. Rent includes all utilities, Internet access and cable. Call., 718-879-0846 for more information.
Saturday, March 24, 2012
Bombay leaders involved in money laundering
http://www.iskcontimes.com/iskcon-mumbai-leaders-involved-in-money-laundering
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Hollywood actresses dress as Bollywood
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/tvshowbiz/article-2095173/Uma-Thurman-Debra-Messing-sparkle-Indian-dress-film-scenes-Smash.html
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The living guru program's lack of siddhanta
PADA: Srila Prabhupada says there are often gaps in the parampara, how can we challenge what he says? And for example Visvanatha accepted Narottama as his guru, but they were not on the planet at the same time? (The GBC has edited these Visvanatha statements in the Chaitanya Charitamrta). And Vyasadeva is always living, fine, but he is not always being worshipped as the current acharya? Without having special powers, no one can even see Vyasadeva at all? Sorry, there are not only gaps but Krishna Himself says the guru line is often lost altogether, i.e. people eventually even stop the worship of the last link, so He has to appear Yuge Yuge to re-establish the chain. That means there are huge gaps ALL THE TIME, so He has to appear YUGE YUGE, because there are often NO current and living acharyas. Krishna thus has to RE-appear to start the chain again because there are huge time gaps, and Krishna says this occurs all the time, perpetually, Yuge Yuge. I am not sure how we can assert that Krishna does not know what He is talking about? As for the July 9th letter, it merely confirmed the May 28th conversation, Srila Prabhupada said he would name some people to conduct initiations as ritviks in the future when he was no longer here, i.e. after his departure. The July 9th letter simply names the people who were going to initiate as ritviks as was discussed previously. Then again the living guru exponents have so far made a lineage of debauchees and fools, ok they are living, not sure they are qualified to be the successors to God? And so far we are not even being given the name of the person who is the living successor by persons like Evil das, so this argument is dead on arrival anyway since it has no practical application. ys pd
Friday, March 23, 2012
Questions to Tripurari swami and the Sridhara Maharaja folks pt.2
SEE PART 1 HERE:
http://krishna1008.blogspot.com/2012/03/questions-to-tripurari-swami-and.html
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Questions PT.2
5) CULTURE OF THREATS AND VIOLENCE POST-1936
6) CULTURE OF THREATS AND VIOLENCE POST-1977
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5) CULTURE OF THREATS AND VIOLENCE POST-1936
Srila Prabhupada told us in India (in 1971) that after 1936 some of the disciples of Srila Saraswati Thakura had "dissented" from promoting Sridhara Maharaja and his new messiah "the successor acharya of the Gaudiya Matha -- Ananta Vasudeva." Some of these dissenters began to investigate the behavior of Ananta Vasudeva and they intercepted some "love letters" that Ananta Vasudeva was writing to a lover (a woman who was actually a prostitute).
Then, some of these post-1936 "dissenters" (ritviks?) began to publicly expose that Ananta Vasudeva was a false guru. After these dissenters began to expose the fact that the Bagh Bazaar and the "Sridhara and Ananta Vasudeva guru program" was bogus, a number of these "dissenters" were subsequently: beaten, had their faces pushed into dog stools, some had their skulls cracked with bricks, and some died from being beaten severely. This was the result of Sridhara Maharaja's promoting a false guru after 1936, i.e. Sridhara's program created a violent "personality cult" mood in the Gaudiya Matha. Perhaps this is why Srila Saraswati said "When our men will become sahajiya (imitation of the post of pure devotee), they will become more dangerous." And posing as an artificial acharya is the epitome of sahajiya-vada. And the danger is clear, innocent people can be murdered.
The violent atmosphere post-1936 was confirmed to me by Sudhir Krishna Maharaja (a Sridhara Maharaja follower) who told me that Sridhara Maharaja was once confronted by a guest about the Gaudiya Matha's beatings and murders problem, because that problem was being exposed in India's newspapers media. And according to Sudhir Krishna, Sridhara Maharaja responded to the guest by saying in effect -- do not be so surprised, killing goes on amongst devotees, just look at the Bhagavat Gita, there was a war.
In short, Sridhara Maharaja tried to justify his creating a bogus guru cult, which resulted in the vicious beatings and killings of the devotees of Krishna. This beating and killing of the vaishnavas program is justified by the Bhagavat Gita? It's all "approved" by Krishna? Does Krishna think its a good program to have His devotees beaten and killed because this is the whole idea of the Gita? Sorry, Sridhara Maharaja has not EVER had the authority to promote false gurus which results in the beatings and murders of Krishna's bhaktas and devotees. Which is why Srila Prabhupada says "Sridhara Maharaja acted without authority."
Lets not forget that in the Vedas the people who orchestrate having devotees beaten and killed are not seen as devotees themselves, they are seen as deviated from the Vedic path. The Bhagavad Gita is basically a story about the bona fide devotees (the Pandavas) who were being oppressed by non-devotees (the Kauravas). Krishna took the side of His devotees, the Pandavas, and He had the Kauravas killed for their offense of attacking His devotees.
The BHAGAVAD GITA is therefore not really a story about devotees v. devotees. Its a story about the usurpers of the property of the innocent devotees being killed by Krishna for that offense. Again, who authorized Sridhara Maharaja to have the property of the Gaudiya Matha usurped from the devotees so there would be a war with dead victims? Yes we agree, there was a war, but didn't Sridhara Maharaja start this war by empowering the usurpers? Srila Prabhupada says the false 1936 gurus were usurpers, and he says the Kauravas were ALSO usurpers, who authorized Sridhara to start this war by backing the usurpers?
And isn't it wrong to use the Bhagavad Gita to cover up for our own mistakes? If we promote a false guru cult and vaishnavas are killed, why bring in Krishna's good name to protect and defend our own self-created mess? The devil made me do it? Krishna made me do it? No, Sridhara Maharaja created this environment and he has no authority to do so. That was Srila Prabhupada's point all along.
The Gaudiya Matha's "dissenters" were apparently merely ordinary rank and file devotees just like us, they did not want to promote the worship of these deviants and they merely had wanted to continue the worship of their guru Srila Saraswati. Srila Prabhupada says Sridhara Maharaja "insisted on it" (promoting Ananta Vasudeva). The result was that dissenters were banned, beaten and killed for their "offense" of the desire -- to simply worship an actual pure devotee -- and not join Sridhara's bogus guru cult.
Even Srila Prabhupada himself told us in 1971 to post a guard at his door in Mayapura since his "envious God brothers" might try to have him killed. Who started this war? It was not Srila Prabhupada? The God brothers attacked him, that is plain and simple. Srila Prabhupada was another person who objected to their bogus gurus, so they wanted to kill him as well. And when we too objected to the same bogus guru process, we too could be killed by our bogus guru God brothers for challenging them?
The good news is that at least we are on the same page as Srila Prabhupada on this issue, all these bogus gurus do not like us, and all of these bogus gurus oppose our idea of continuing the worship of Srila Prabhupada. And after 1936 some of the rank and file dissented, and after 1977 some of us dissented, because there are some of us folks who want to worship the pure devotees and we were not going to compromise.
Why was Sridhara Maharaja on the side of these deviants? Srila Prabhupada said Sridhara was good friends with Madhvava maharaja (one of the worst offenders in the Gaudiya Matha bunch, who in 1971 came to Mayapura to poke his finger in Srila Prabhupada's face and order him to quit using the title of Prabhupada). Meanwhile Sridhara was simultaneously "aloof" from associating with Srila Prabhupada. Why was Sridhara Maharaja pals with the blasphemers of Srila Prabhupada (they said he could not use the name of "Prabhupada"?), and Sridhara was not associating with Prabhupada instead? (see this conversation which we will post later, where Srila Prabhupada agrees Sridhara is associated with the bad elements of the Gaudiya Matha and he is "aloof" -- and not associated with -- Srila Prabhupada himself).
Why was Sridhara Maharaja friends with these false gurus of the Gaudiya Matha who viciously attacked Srila Prabhupada for: Allowing women in the temples; For allowing "mlecchas" to do deity worship; For using the title of Prabhupada etc. and whom Srila Prabhupada thought "might try to kill me"? And then later, Sridhara was friends with the 11 false GBC gurus of ISKCON while stepping down on us dissenters who -- just wanted to worship Srila Prabhupada?
I have never, ever, EVER seen any good explanation for why the Sridhara Maharaja's program was ever authorized to orchestrate all of this? Rather we find that Srila Prahbupada says Sridhara Maharaja "acted without authority" and his Bagh Bazaar program was "the severe offender" program. When are the followers of Sridhara Maharaja going to acknowledge that Sridhara's plan to make false gurus is not only bogus, it proved deadly for the innocent rank and file members of the Gaudiya Matha who were banned, beaten and some were assassinated? And even the guru Sridhara promoted committed suicide, so Sridhara is responsible for that problem as well since Ananta Vasudeva was coerced by Sridhara to take the post of acharya?
And the entire mission was basically ruined as a result of all these plans made by people like Sridhara Maharaja? Even Sridhara said his God brothers complained he was "a form breaker" -- because he broke down the Gaudiya mission. Why would we want that same policy for ISKCON?
6) CULTURE OF THREATS AND VIOLENCE POST-1977
Then after 1977, Sridhara Maharaja once again promoted the same identical false gurus deviation of 1936 by promoting the GBC and their 11 self-appointed gurus. Here is the main problem we see with the Sridhara Maharaja process of support for false gurus after 1977; Sridhara already knew that by his promoting false gurus this leads to contrived banning, beatings, violence and even murders. He knew this directly from his experience in the post-1936 Gaudiya Matha. Sridhara Maharaja knew this better than any of us ever could have known, because he was there during the whole "oppression and murders of the Gaudiya Matha's dissenters" era. Or was he asleep at the switch the whole time? Or did he not care that dissenters were treated severely? Or what?
Thus by 1977 Sridhara knew perhaps better than anyone else on the planet, that by this program of promoting unqualified persons as gurus the result could be, and probably would be, violence. Of course we all know about this process of violence stemming from false prophets, pure devotees, gurus and messiahs. Just look at the false messiah cults of Jim Jones, David Koresh, Charles Manson and countless others who promoted themselves as messiahs when they were not qualified, and the result was often beatings of dissenters if not worse. Why would Sridhara Maharaja continue promoting the false guru's process even after he knew full well that the results could be, and probably would be, indeed almost inevitably would be, violence for the dissenters?
I have no idea why Sridhara Maharaja or his followers have considered themselves as authorized to foment these types of conditions where people like us will be targets of violence for opposing? As for the wonderful pure devotee ISKCON leaders that Sridhara Maharaja was promoting as gurus after 1977, did he not know Srila Prabhupada had been saying his leaders are "The Great Sinister Movement within my movement," "a great conspiracy," and "once before you wanted to do something centralizing with your G.B.C. meeting, and, if I did not interfere, the whole thing (ISKCON) would have been killed" -- ad infinitum?
Srila Prabhupada made these types of complaints against the leaders all the time. And he said things like: his failing sannyasas are breaking his heart, so suspend sannyasa. He said his leaders were mostly not chanting and following, and he said at least one of them is waiting for him to die so he could take his guru seat, and he said -- I cannot sleep at night because Tamal is ruining my ISKCON, lets send Tamal to China because he is destroying my ISKCON. Why would these types of people be considered as acharyas by Sridhara Maharaja? The very same people who wanted Srila Prabhupada's guru seat, the people who are destroying his mission, the people he said are fighting like cats and dogs, the people he said are not fit for sannyasa, the people he said are "plotting and scheming" (against him?) -- are gurus?
In sum, Srila Prabhupada felt that his leaders are not very trustworthy, what to speak of their being gurus? And why would he "centralize the whole thing" in the hands of the 1978 11 member "acharya board" -- after just saying this centralizing process is going to kill his whole movement (as it has)? See http://tattvasanga.com/ for some quotes on Srila Prabhupada's doubts over these leaders. How could "the great sinister movement" become "Krishna's successor acharyas" all of a sudden? Does this make any sense?
Then, when we expressed the same doubts Srila Prabhupada had expressed over these same leaders, Sridhara Maharaja was saying "none should protest," i.e. we need to promote and back-up these leaders as acharyas? Didn't he know that our protesting these false acharyas would be dangerous for us since that is what happened after 1936 -- with his previous false guru program? And sure enough, the Sridhara Maharaja people and the GBC program he was supporting started to call us vile names such as: aparadhis, attackers of ISKCON, cheaters, envious, demons, deviants, offenders, poison pens, ritvik poison, snakes, serpents with jewelled heads, and so on, ... giving us the feeling we could be targets of violence due to this rhetoric? We did not want to support the 11, so were were "offending the pure devotee Sridhara Maharaja who supports them." No, we did not want to promote the 11, that is all.
Is this odious rhetoric problem not exactly what occurred to those who disagreed with the Sridhara guru program after 1936? Why would Sridhara duplicate the process of suppressing dissenters that he orchestrated after 1936? And by his support of the 11, now we are being chased with baseball bats after dissenters after 1936 had been chased with bricks? It seems we dissenters never get any mercy here? Did he not know this would cause of great distress to us dissenters, or even worse? Did he not care? Or what? Why is this never explained?
Sure enough, we did become targets for violence. Worse, even recently a Sridhara Maharaja web site has been calling us aparadhis, dangerous, deviants and so on, the same style of rhetoric used by the GBC's gurus project, the same rhetoric we have heard being used by the Narayana Maharaja people against us, the same style rhetoric we get from the Gaura Govinda maharaja people etc. -- don't they know that demonizing others can get them killed? Don't they know this can rain down threats and maybe violence on us because we have been squalking about it since the murder of Sulochana in 1986, yet they continued that rhetoric until recently? Who authorized them to use this rhetoric, knowing from 1936 until the present time, this can get devotees beaten and killed? Or don't they pay any attention to how devotees get treated with this rhetoric? Or don't they care? Or what?
Hence, since the 1980s we have got direct threats of violence from the followers of both the GBC and Sridhara Maharaja folks due to this rhetoric. Who authorized Sridhara Maharaja and / or his dedicated followers to foment this aggressive mood against other vaishnavas? Why are they demonizing the worshippers of Srila Prabhupada as evil deviants (who can be killed)? Of course the followers of the GBC, Sridhara, Narayana maharaja process have also called us insane, mad, fools, and so on, therefore when we complained about things like child molesting, their discrediting us helped the problems along. Are we ever going to get an apology for all this? Again this raises the main question, (a) weren't we authorized to challenge these false gurus of 1977 -- which resulted in molesting and murder, or (b) was Sridhara authorized to promote them, and discredit and squash our protest, to the peril of us and the victims we were trying to save?
How the GBC was abolished
http://tattvasanga.com/
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PADA DOES NOT ENDORSE THIS FELLOW, BUT HE IS CORRECT THAT THE GBC WAS ABOLISHED. ys pd
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PADA DOES NOT ENDORSE THIS FELLOW, BUT HE IS CORRECT THAT THE GBC WAS ABOLISHED. ys pd
Thursday, March 22, 2012
Questions to Tripurari swami and the Sridhara Maharaja folks pt.1
1) ORIGNAL AUTHORTY by Sridhara Maharaja TO PROMOTE FALSE GURUS?
2) FOLLOWERS OF SRILA PRABHUPDA SUPERIOR TO FOLLOWERS OF FALSE GURUS.
3) IS SRILA PRABHUPADA A CONDITIONED SOUL?
4) NOT FIT FOR SANNYASA:
Thanks very much for offering to moderate a discussion between me and Tripurari swami Alberto prabhu. These questions have never been answered 35 years and are at the root of all the "troubles" we have had. I think we should perhaps call this: Tripurari swami v Puranjana Q and A. Without further ado, here are the (first set of) questions:
1) Dear Tripurari swami. Thanks for your writing us in an attempt to resolve our mutual negative issues against one another. I'd like to start by saying, I do appreciate that you feel that we have not been fair with you, and I'd like to rectify that since we probably have not been fair. At the same time, I hope you can appreciate we feel that your program has also not been fair with us.
In an attempt to resolve some of these issue between us, we are going to write some questions to you and allow you to respond however you like, in as much detail as you like, and taking as much time as you like. We will eventually print your final replies with no editing. Its our attempt to present some of our views and have you try to see some of our complaints from perhaps a new angle. Your response will allow us to see things more from your angle. Hopefully this will help us both appreciate each others respective positions.
ORIGNAL AUTHORTY by Sridhara Maharaja TO PROMOTE FALSE GURUS?
First of all, the followers of Sridhara Maharaja (as well as the GBC and Narayana et al.) keep saying for the past 35 years that "the ritvik idea is bogus." The "ritvik idea" can be summed up thus: Some of us follwers of Srila Prabhupada are chosing NOT to act as his "guru successors," rather we want to act as his representatives, agents or proxies -- which might also be called "layman preachers." At best, we might come up to the standard of being a brahmana priest, which in sanskrit is called "a ritvik."
Of course Tamal is the person who branded us as "the ritviks." In the early 1980s we originally called ourselves "the Prabhupadanugas" and would appreciate if you would use the title we used for ourselves and not the title Tamal used for our group. He is not our leader or representative, and the title he used for us is not the title we wanted or used originally.
Anyway, if some of us disciples and followers of Srila Prabhupada are choosing to act as his agents, at best priests, what is the harm of that? The GBC in 1979 offered to make me their guru of Ireland, I did not accept that role because I did not think either myself nor the 11 "gurus" were qualified to do so. And time has shown that I was factually correct, most of my "guru" God brothers have not only proven unqualified for that role, their dramatic fall-downs have made ISKCON into a public media scandal, and the GBC leaders officially have now declared the entire ISKCON society as fiscally bankrupt. And in case you have not noticed there has been all kinds of negative public media about these gurus.
This is the result of avoiding Srila Prabhupada's constant warnings about his followers artificially posing as gurus, and avoiding my reminding these leaders about this false guru issue after 1977 as well. And Sridhara maharaja backed the false gurus instead of us, to our peril. So it seems he aided and abetted the downfall of ISKCON, as he similarly aided and abetted the downfall of the Gaudiya Matha by promoting such false gurus. Now this poses the question, was it "fair" for Sridhara Maharaja to back the GBC's 11 gurus and for him to say "none (of us) should protest"? Sridhara's policy of suppressing us dissenters made me a "marked man" in ISKCON and caused my being excommunicated in 1979 and so forth. Was it fair for Sridhara Maharaja to back the people who were creating this mass exodus, and these "gurus" were saying things like (as Jayatirtha told me in 1979) "watch your back" (you could be treated with violence)?
And if we cannot act as our own guru's layman representatives, and we do not wish to act as his successors, what are we supposed to do intead? It seems we are being forced into a corner by the Sridhara Maharaja -- GBC -- Narayana Maharaja allied policy and ideology, they all say our idea of operating as layman agents is wrong (ritvik idea). And worse, that we are not allowed to protest the worship of our God brothers as gurus since "none should protest." So the result of this policy is: thousands of us were and still are being forced away from ISKCON, which is what has happened and still is occuring. Right now for example the GBC is spending $12 million dollars suing us to drive even more of us out. Why was this policy inaugurated by Sridhara Maharaja in the first place?
I was essentially excommunicated in 1979, as were thousands of my other brothers and sisters. This is also what Sridhara maharaja orchestrated after 1936 in India, he made a false guru project there, and the people who rejected his false guru's project were banned, beaten and driven out, some dissenters were killed, and the temples became empty. Why is this considered as the bona fide path?
In ISKCON the results of producing these narrow options are the same as what Sridhara Maharaja created after 1936, most devotees simply quit the Krishna religion altogether just like most of the Gaudiya Matha temples became empty shells. At this point, most of my rank and file "layman" God brothers have left the society altogether, and they are never coming back because (a) they are being checked from acting as preachers or representatives of Srila Prabhupada (the ritvik idea), and (b) they do not want to pose as successors and, (c) nor do they want to support the GBC's unauthorized guru successors project. They are thus personna non grata. Hence the temples are empty, due to the same policy of making false gurus that Sridhara introduced in 1936 and which also emptied out their temples.
Me and these thousands of my brothers and sisters thus have no standing in the society, and so all of us are basically being forced to leave. As was I. Why is this mass exodus process after 1936 and 1978 authorized? Is this what Krishna wants, no samkirtana, no poojaris, no one to clean the temple, no one to sew for the deity etc.? I do not think that is what He wanted? This is why Srila Prabhupada says, Sridhara Maharaja acted witout authority, he has no authority to create this mass exodus of the citizens of the Gaudiya Matha (and now: ISKCON) by his policy of promoting false gurus.
Is that also what Srila Prabhupada wanted, to force most of the devotees out, and to have them stop acting as preachers, giving them the only options of being a successor or promoting another (perhaps deviant) God brother as a successor, and thus force them to leave and empty out the temples of manpower and bankrupt the society (as has occured)? Why shouldn't we worship our guru if we choose to? And why shouldn't our children worship Srila Prabhupada if they choose to?
And why should not our children's children worship him if they desire to? Why the vociferous opposition? And what is the actual plan then? If we are not supposed to worship Srila Prabhupada and promote same, what program are we supposed to promote instead? Why is worship of my guru a deviation, in his own society? And never mind for a moment the GBC, Sridhara Maharaja or anyone else, if I am your God brother why should you assist those who are having me forcibly ejected from my master's house and trying to force me to promote the worship someone else, i.e. those who are usually deviants? And why join these hi-jackers by calling me an offender and basically helping them drive me out of my father's house? By what authority are all of you orchestrating driving me out of my master's house? And in the process, by demonizing our idea of continued worship of our master, this is making our lives similar to an animal being hunted as "an offender." Why is our process not authorized and this process is authorized?
2) FOLLOWERS OF SRILA PRABHUPDA SUPERIOR TO FOLLOWERS OF FALSE GURUS.
Most of the ritviks (i.e. Prabhupadanugas) for example from the Bangalore program, have a much higher spiritual standard than most of the over 100 gurus promoted by the GBC and apparently, some of the bogus messiahs of the post-1936 Gaudiya Matha. Indeed Jayadvaita swami wrote a paper a few years back admitting that many of the GBC's gurus have been falling into -- illicit sex with men, women and children. Actually most of the GBC's post-1978 gurus are now gone, since they have been falling into some sort of odious scandals such as -- illicit sex, drugs, criminal deviations etc.
Meanwhile, most of our even newer devotees in the Prabhupadanuga group do not have any of these problems such as illicit sex with men, women and children. Indeed, our newer devotees in Bangalore and other programs have no known problems of illicit sex with men, women and children, and we think this is since -- they worship an actual paramahamsa Srila Prabhupada. Our new devotees in Sunnyvale are also not experiencing these extreme fall down troubles either, so why should they worship the Sridhara process which tends to have people devolve to a lower standard, a standard that is way less advanced than our folks are?
Why would we want to take the lesser advanced path? Our path is freeing people from illicit sex with men, women and children etc, while the GBC's guru's seem to be having an epidemic of such failures. Why should we take the path that Sridhara maharaja helped launch in 1978, which leads to mostly failures, since most of the GBC gurus have fallen? Our devotees are making good progress by dint of worship of the bona fide acharya, whereas the failures among these gurus is something like an epidemic? Why is our program the deviation, when the failure is mainly in the guru camp that Sridhara maharaja promoted? Our failure rate is way below their failure rate, why should we choose the path of mostly failures? And in sum, who is right? (A) Was Sridhara Maharaja right to promote these false gurus, leading to the whole illicit sex with men, women and children bogus messiah's debacle, or (B) were we right to promote Srila Prabhupada instead, resulting in our producing first class brahmana types of devotees?
3) IS SRILA PRABHUPADA A CONDITIONED SOUL?
The next issue is: if Srila Prabhupada had "appointed" 11 conditioned souls to be his and Krishna's guru successors, that would make him a conditioned soul himself -- for making such a serious mistake. The idea that he had appointed the 11 as successors is what we called "the big lie" which has been repeated in the media in thousands of books, newspapers articles, TV expose shows etc. Of course this is the same problem Sridhara Maharaja created in 1936, he implied that Ananta Vasudeva was the appointed guru, and this made it look like Srila Saraswati had no discrimination -- so he too had appointed the wrong person as his successor.
Incidently, Tamal said in December of 1980 there is no evidence on tape or in writing that these 11 gurus had been appointed. BV Puri agreed and he said that Srila Prabhupada PERSONALLY had told him there are only going to be ritviks (this is on a video which we have posted to our blog). Ramesvara resigned in June 1980 saying the leaders did not have the qualifications to be guru. Hansadutta has admitted that there was no guru appointment and so on, yet we see no clarification from the Sridhara Maharaja camp that there had been no guru appointment and the 11 had only been named as priests, actually at best priests?
And despite seeing these 11 kept falling into troubles even as early as 1979, Sridhara maharaja kept insisting that the 11 had been appointed by Srila Prabhupada as GURUS. And some Sridhara sites still say that (as we see in the conversations SM had with the GBC which are posted on the Gosai web site). Thus it seems the Sridhara Maharaja idea is that Srila Prabhupada did not understand that his followers are not fit for the post of acharya -- so he appointed them as acharyas anyway.
Our idea makes a lot more sense, the leaders had only been appointed as some sort of lesser level administrators, at best proxy priests (ritviks) and not as full-blown acharyas, because Srila Prabhupada could not have so badly mistaken as to think his leaders were fit to be acharyas. This issue has never been resolved, we would like this cleared up since we still see posting on various Sridhara sites including Gosai's repeating Sridhara Maharaja's idea -- that Srila Prabhupada had appointed the 11 as gurus. We still see recently you posting that the ritvik idea (that the 11 had not been appointed as gurus but only as agents) is a deviation. Where is the evidence the 11 had been appointed as gurus? Lets look at this discussion below:
Satsvarupa dasa Goswami: Then our next question concerns, uh, initiations in the future, ah, particularly at that time when you are no longer with us. We want to know how a, a first and second initiation would be conducted.
Srila Prabhupada: Yes. I shall recommend some of you. After this is settled up I shall recommend some of you to act as officiating acarya.
Tamal Krishna Goswami: Is that called ritvik acarya?
Srila Prabhupada: Ritvik. Yes.
So here we find that there are going to be some officiating acharyas to conduct initiations AFTER he departs, called ritviks. We also find on this same tape that when these ritviks deviate (meaning some of them will) they will have to be replaced. How can we say that the 11 are acharyas, and at the same time they will deviate and have to be replaced? Why are people saying acharyas deviate and have to be replaced at all? Sridhara maharaja says the guru line is a living thing of accepting and rejecting, he said acharyas will have to be added and eliminated (when they deviate). Where in the parampara do we find that acharyas are being "added and eliminated" when they fall into illicit affairs? Incidentally, you mentioned on your site that Sridhara Maharaja was the person who suggested to the GBC the idea of "adding" more people as acharyas at their annual Mayapura meeting, which they are doing now. How can people who are deviating vote in another wave of acharyas?
Why would Srila Prabhupada say simultaneously: (a) After I depart I will name some officiating acharyas aka ritviks to conduct initiations on my behalf, (b) And these officiators will only be lower level kanistha priests, but also, they will be self-standing Vishnupada acharyas and have their own disciples, and (c) and despite their being acharyas -- they will be prone to deviate and fall down, and have to be replaced? None of this makes any sense? What makes sense is: that he had only appointed them as representatives, agents and proxies, to conduct the ceremonies on his behalf.
This is verified in the July 9th letter, they will act as his representatives "henceforward." Therefore, "when they deviate and have to be replaced," this only refers to the post of priest, the priest may be deviating and is then being replaced -- and not the acharyas? Yet the Sridhara Maharaja idea is: that it is the acharyas who are deviating and being replaced. Srila Prabhupada says it is a severe mad elephant idea to say acharyas are deviating?
This has not only never been resolved, saying that the ritvik idea is a deviation continues to create the illusion that the 11 were not appointed only as fallible priests, but as gurus. What we Prabhupadanugas are saying is: that is mis-representing Srila Prabhupada -- saying he did not appoint only temporary proxy priests -- aka ritviks, and he had been so much in illusion he had appointed them as gurus, that this is an attack on the character of Srila Prabhupada. It almost like saying Jesus appointed the Borgias dynasty to be his successors?
Of course Sridhara maharaja did the same thing in 1936, he implied that Ananta Vasudeva had been appointed as the successor and this discredited Srila Saraswati and his whole mission. This would also be like saying the brain surgeon had appointed the hospital janitor to be his successor, it makes no sense? It means the brain surgeon has no discrimination. This problem is not being cleared up by the Sridhara or GBC folks, it is making it look like the acharyas make mistakes and are prone to mundane defects.
If the 11 had only been appointed as temporary and replaceable agents, then they also would have been much easier to control and not so much mayhem would have occured. After the GBC and Sridhara maharaja declared that the 11 were acharyas, Dr. J. Stilson Judah told me this in person, then the -- "antinomianism" set in (lawlessness in the name of religion). And Sridhara Maharaja fueled that by saying "no law can challenge the (11) acharyas," in other words, nobody is allowed to challenge their evil doings. This created a violent cult atmosphere in the Gaudiya Matha and later in ISKCON. This cult atmosphere continues to this day, people are using aliases on Krishnacandra's web site in fear of reprisals for for speaking out. And the person who set this in motion, saying people should not criticize these gurus, is Sridhara Maharaja.
In any case, there is no evidence the 11 were appointed to be anything more than ritviks, and to say that appointing them in a lesser capacity than guru is "a deviation" makes it look like Srila Prabhupada committed the worst deviation of all, he appointed severely conditioned souls as acharyas. Can this issue be cleard up by your writing a paper explaining that it would have been impossible to have these 11 appointed as gurus, they must have been only appointed as administrators -- at best -- priests? And that Sridhara Maharaja was wrong to assist them in creating the illusion the 11 were gurus?
4) NOT FIT FOR SANNYASA:
In January of 1977 Srila Prabhupada said his followers are not fit for sannyasa, they are making a laughing stock of sannyasa, and they should get married. So therefore, suspend making more sannyasas. According to the GBC - Sridhara Maharaja - Narayana Maharaja idea, a few months later, these same unfit for sannyasa people were appointed as gurus (May 28th 1977). Does this make any sense, they are not fit for sannyasa -- so a few months later they are fit to be acharya messiahs? And in January of 1977 Sridhara Maharaja was saying they are gurus and acharyas. How can they be unfit for sannyasa in January of 1977, and fit to be acharyas exactly one year later? Why has this never been clarified?
Spiritual Master must be bona fide
“Therefore having a bona fide spiritual master and serving him and pleasing him and getting his mercy is essential. Otherwise there can be no advancement in Krishna consciousness. And unless the spiritual master is a pure devotee of Krishna then he has no potency to give you Krishna. He is simply a cheating rascal. So in fact, above all the rules and regulations and offenses I have mentioned the most important thing, the essential thing, which is required if you want to come to the stage of purely chanting the Hare Krishna mantra is you must have a bona fide spiritual master who is a pure devotee of Krishna. Without having a bona fide spiritual master you can chant Hare Krishna forever but you will not be able to advance because Krishna does not reveal Himself in this way. He only reveals Himself to those devotees who surrender to and serve and please His pure devotees.”-Srila Prabhupada Letter to his London Disciples, July, 1969
Tuesday, March 20, 2012
India Court wants peace proposal
http://www.harekrsna.com/sun/editorials/03-12/editorials8376.htm
PEACE PROPOSAL BY ISKCON-BANGALORE
PLACED BEFORE THE OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE
DATED MARCH 14TH, 2012
(THIS PEACE PROPOSAL IS OFFERED WITHOUT PREJUDICE TO THE RIGHTS AND CONTENTIONS OF ISKCON-BANGALORE SOCIETY MADE BEFORE VARIOUS COURTS AND IN THE SLP BEFORE THE HONOURABLE SUPREME COURT OF INDIA)
The dispute between ISKCON-Bangalore and ISKCON-Mumbai concerns:
I Theological issue: Who is the Acharya of ISKCON who will give diksha (initiation) to all the devotees of ISKCON?
ISKCON-Bangalore’s Position: Srila Prabhupada shall remain the Acharya of ISKCON and continue to give diksha and guide all devotees in ISKCON to the abode of Lord Sri Krishna.
ISKCON-Mumbai’s Position: Since Srila Prabhupada is no more physically present, one should take diksha from one of the present ISKCON gurus.
II Who owns the Sri Radha Krishna Temple property on Hare Krishna Hill in Bangalore? Is it ISKCON-Bangalore society or ISKCON-Mumbai society?
III Who shall manage Sri Radha Krishna Temple property on Hare Krishna Hill in Bangalore? Is it ISKCON-Bangalore society or ISKCON-Mumbai society?
The suit schedule property, Sri Radha Krishna Temple on Hare Krishna Hill, Rajajinagar, Bangalore, being a public temple and a immovable property which cannot be sold or mortgaged or encumbered in any manner in the process of managing the same, the real issue is to determine the permanent structure of management of this Sri Radha Krishna Temple property, on Hare Krishna Hill, Rajajinagar, Bangalore, hereinafter referred to as the Temple.
ISKCON-Bangalore wishes to propose the following:
1. System of initiation (diksha): the irrevocable and only system of initiation practiced and preached in the Temple shall be as per July 9th 1977 directive of Srila Prabhupada. According to this, Srila Prabhupada is the Acharya and all devotees of ISKCON shall be disciples of Srila Prabhupada.
2. There shall be a two tier system for managing the Temple:
Governing Council: this council will govern the Temple by defining broad policies as per the objectives of ISKCON and directions of temple management as given by Srila Prabhupada. A CHARTER FOR GOVERNENCE will more elaborately describe the scope and powers of the Governing Council.
Executive Council: this council will be responsible for the day-to-day affairs of the Temple. A CHARTER FOR EXECUTIVE MANAGEMENT will more elaborately describe the scope and powers of the Executive Council.
3. The Governing Council will consist of
a) three members nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society
b) three members nominated by ISKCON-Mumbai society
c) one retired High court or Supreme court judge nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society.
d) one retired High court or Supreme court judge nominated by ISKCON-Mumbai society.
4. The Executive Council will consist entirely of missionaries who are members of and nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society consisting of Temple President, assisted by Senior Vice President and several Vice Presidents, as it is now managed.
5. There shall be a CODE OF CONDUCT which will define how the devotees of both societies should conduct themselves at the Temple keeping in mind the system of initiation as per point no.1 above.
6. On the broad acceptance of this proposal, a Joint Draft Committee will be formed and charged with the task of drafting the following documents:
i) CHARTER FOR GOVERNENCE
ii) CHARTER FOR EXECUTIVE MANAGEMENT
iii) CODE OF CONDUCT
These three will constitute the TEMPLE CONSITITUTION DOCUMENTS.
PEACE PROPOSAL BY ISKCON-BANGALORE
PLACED BEFORE THE OVERSIGHT COMMITTEE
DATED MARCH 14TH, 2012
(THIS PEACE PROPOSAL IS OFFERED WITHOUT PREJUDICE TO THE RIGHTS AND CONTENTIONS OF ISKCON-BANGALORE SOCIETY MADE BEFORE VARIOUS COURTS AND IN THE SLP BEFORE THE HONOURABLE SUPREME COURT OF INDIA)
The dispute between ISKCON-Bangalore and ISKCON-Mumbai concerns:
I Theological issue: Who is the Acharya of ISKCON who will give diksha (initiation) to all the devotees of ISKCON?
ISKCON-Bangalore’s Position: Srila Prabhupada shall remain the Acharya of ISKCON and continue to give diksha and guide all devotees in ISKCON to the abode of Lord Sri Krishna.
ISKCON-Mumbai’s Position: Since Srila Prabhupada is no more physically present, one should take diksha from one of the present ISKCON gurus.
II Who owns the Sri Radha Krishna Temple property on Hare Krishna Hill in Bangalore? Is it ISKCON-Bangalore society or ISKCON-Mumbai society?
III Who shall manage Sri Radha Krishna Temple property on Hare Krishna Hill in Bangalore? Is it ISKCON-Bangalore society or ISKCON-Mumbai society?
The suit schedule property, Sri Radha Krishna Temple on Hare Krishna Hill, Rajajinagar, Bangalore, being a public temple and a immovable property which cannot be sold or mortgaged or encumbered in any manner in the process of managing the same, the real issue is to determine the permanent structure of management of this Sri Radha Krishna Temple property, on Hare Krishna Hill, Rajajinagar, Bangalore, hereinafter referred to as the Temple.
ISKCON-Bangalore wishes to propose the following:
1. System of initiation (diksha): the irrevocable and only system of initiation practiced and preached in the Temple shall be as per July 9th 1977 directive of Srila Prabhupada. According to this, Srila Prabhupada is the Acharya and all devotees of ISKCON shall be disciples of Srila Prabhupada.
2. There shall be a two tier system for managing the Temple:
Governing Council: this council will govern the Temple by defining broad policies as per the objectives of ISKCON and directions of temple management as given by Srila Prabhupada. A CHARTER FOR GOVERNENCE will more elaborately describe the scope and powers of the Governing Council.
Executive Council: this council will be responsible for the day-to-day affairs of the Temple. A CHARTER FOR EXECUTIVE MANAGEMENT will more elaborately describe the scope and powers of the Executive Council.
3. The Governing Council will consist of
a) three members nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society
b) three members nominated by ISKCON-Mumbai society
c) one retired High court or Supreme court judge nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society.
d) one retired High court or Supreme court judge nominated by ISKCON-Mumbai society.
4. The Executive Council will consist entirely of missionaries who are members of and nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society consisting of Temple President, assisted by Senior Vice President and several Vice Presidents, as it is now managed.
5. There shall be a CODE OF CONDUCT which will define how the devotees of both societies should conduct themselves at the Temple keeping in mind the system of initiation as per point no.1 above.
6. On the broad acceptance of this proposal, a Joint Draft Committee will be formed and charged with the task of drafting the following documents:
i) CHARTER FOR GOVERNENCE
ii) CHARTER FOR EXECUTIVE MANAGEMENT
iii) CODE OF CONDUCT
These three will constitute the TEMPLE CONSITITUTION DOCUMENTS.
7. The Joint Draft Committee will consist of
a. three members nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society
b. three members nominated by ISKCON Mumbai society
c. the Oversight Committee
8. In future, the TEMPLE CONSTITUTION DOCUMENTS can be amended only by ¾ majority of the Governing Council. Such amendments are possible only in a Council with a quorum of 6 members present and at least one retired HC or SC judge will be one of the 6 members. More details of such special meetings will be part of the charter.
9. After the TEMPLE CONSTITUTION DOCUMENTS are drafted, the PEACE PROPOSAL will be finalized and put in place under the supervision of the Oversight Committee.
a. three members nominated by ISKCON-Bangalore society
b. three members nominated by ISKCON Mumbai society
c. the Oversight Committee
8. In future, the TEMPLE CONSTITUTION DOCUMENTS can be amended only by ¾ majority of the Governing Council. Such amendments are possible only in a Council with a quorum of 6 members present and at least one retired HC or SC judge will be one of the 6 members. More details of such special meetings will be part of the charter.
9. After the TEMPLE CONSTITUTION DOCUMENTS are drafted, the PEACE PROPOSAL will be finalized and put in place under the supervision of the Oversight Committee.
Srutakirti diary
Sruta kirti dasa: "The mood was very sombre and intense. I've already described how he asked his disciples not to touch his feet saying, 'By their touching my feet I have to suffer. They may not be trying to achieve some goal by touching my feet, still the spiritual master has to suffer by accepting their sinful reactions.' Now Srila PRabhupada said things to me that I did not comprehend. It was very disturbing. The words cut through my heart. He mentioned it to me on two separate occasions during his illness saying, 'One of my disciples is simply waiting -- when will the old man die so that I can become guru.' I could not believe what I was hearing. I never imagined that day that Srila Prabhupada would not be with us. I was young and naive and thought Srila Prabhupada would be with us until he was 100 years old. Thoughts of his being gone and others giving initiation had never been a subject of conversation. He sat up in his bed and looking at me said, "This illness is because eighty percent of the leaders are not following the ..." (p.188)
Sunday, March 18, 2012
Another no name guru problem?
Dear Evil das, Srila Prabhupada says anyone who does not give the name of their guru is a mayavadi. That means you. Please tell us who your alleged current living guru is in your opinion, otherwise you are all fluff and bluff. And if you do not name him, you argument is irrelevant. We are jumping over your guru, who is, you forget maharaja? He does not exist, or cannot be proven to exist? That means we are jumping over, no one and nobody, since you have named no one and nobody. This is clearly mayavada. ys pd
Srila Prabhupada quotes on the Gaudiya Matha
http://www.iskcontimes.com/was-sridhara-maharaja-bona-fide-guru
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Occupy ISKCON gaining membership
http://www.causes.com/causes/648595-occupy-iskcon
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Occupy ISKCON BY: DWARKADISHA DASA Mar 17, 2012 — USA INDIA (SUN) — It has been several months since Mahapurusha dasa published his revolutionary article, "#Occupyiskcon". Since then, other devotees have also written different position papers in regard to the Occupy ISKCON Movement. The main theme of these articles is that a lack of checks and balances of power in ISKCON has plunged our devotional society into chaos and corruption. The leaders in our movement have had too much power and the resulting product is a leadership culture pervading with entitlement and elitism. These qualities, of course, are totally contrary to the general culture of Krishna Consciousness, which emphasizes spiritual equality and servitorship. There are several main social websites dedicated to the Occupy ISKCON Movement that are actively discussing these issues: Occupy Iskcon Twitter Occupy Iskcon Causes Occupy Iskcon Facebook I think these discussions are extremely healthy for our devotional community. The Occupy Movement around the world is something I never would have believed I would see in this life: people coming together to protest the exploitation, corruption, greed and materialism of society. I, and many other devotees believe that this is being inspired by Krishna and is an incredible opportunity for His Sankirtan Movement. The corruption and dis-empowerment of ISKCON is something that we need to deal with because we have to be ready to deliver our message of servitorship to the general masses. If our movement is plagued by corruption and entitlement, how can we teach others the culture of servitorship. Devotees everywhere should be inspired by the Occupy ISKCON Movement. It is the first time in a long time that I felt inspired that real change might begin within ISKCON. We have to address our own corruption and instill a working level of spiritual democracy. This is necessary if we are to push on the Sankirtan Movement and fight the general corruption, materialism and entitlement of society. Devotees everywhere, therefore, should feel inspired to write their own Occupy ISKCON position papers and add philosophically to this movement of servitorship and equality. Your Servant, Dwarkadisha dasa | |
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Devotees fearful to use real names
http://prabhupadavision.com/2012/03/aliases/#comment-16767
[PADA: This proves our point: That there is still TODAY a mood of fear and repression going on in the vaishnava community, and so -- the mass of rank and file devotees are basically afraid of reprisals from these "gurus" or their dedicated followers. Hence the mass of rank and file often use anonymous aliases since they do not want their real names to be known. Srila Prabhupada said something along similar lines, my God brothers are giving me depression, repression, oppression. ys pd]
[PADA: This proves our point: That there is still TODAY a mood of fear and repression going on in the vaishnava community, and so -- the mass of rank and file devotees are basically afraid of reprisals from these "gurus" or their dedicated followers. Hence the mass of rank and file often use anonymous aliases since they do not want their real names to be known. Srila Prabhupada said something along similar lines, my God brothers are giving me depression, repression, oppression. ys pd]
Saturday, March 17, 2012
Letter from Tripurari swami to PADA
Tripurari swami Dear Puranjana,
Although I do not philosophically agree with the ritvikism, I agree with the fact that ritviks have the civil right to practice ritvikism. Furthermore, practicing ritivikism in itself does not make one an aparadhi, but publicizing false and defamatory statements about Vaishnavas (including myself) does. If anything I have ever said has caused threats against you, I apologize. I do not want to continue personal attacks against each other, but instead want to move forward in a away that allows us to practice and, when need be, defend our respective philosophies in a non-threatening manner. If I have published anything that threatens your safety, please let me know and I will be happy to address it.
Sincerely, swami bv tripurari
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[PADA: Thanks very much prabhu. Yes, all our camps of vaishnavas should all be able to preach our respective ideas without feeling coerced or threatened. And we should develop more respect amongst all the various vaishnava groups since its very hard to convince the regular mundane citizens we have the better idea, if we are ourselves unable to get along. This in-fighting hurts the preaching of all our camps simultaneously. As the devotees and brothers are fighting, the conditioned souls are not being helped, this was the lamentation of Srila Prabhupada all the time, he was worried that the preaching work might be stopped due to infighting among his followers. He said that all the time, this was his greatest anxiety.
I would very much like to bury the hatchet between us, especially on the issue of personal attacks towards each other, and deal only with philosophical issues. That would be great. We should be very concerned that Srila Prabhupada's wish -- that we should not fight among ourselves -- and thus stop the preaching work of Lord Gauranga -- as occurred in the Gaudiya Matha mission -- has evolved in his ISKCON anyway despite his warning us. Srila Prabhupada was practically crying to us about this all the time, "do not let it come to this" (fighting among the God brothers like the Gaudiya Matha did).
Anyway, hopefully we can all enter a new era of more productive relationships where we are using our valuable time to preach to the conditioned souls and not so much preaching against one another. I feel a lot of relief after getting your letter and hope we can work more together on preaching the message of Lord Gauranga rather than wasting time fighting between the brothers. So I welcome your letter and hereby offer to reciprocate by helping resolve issues that are coming from our camp that you think we need to address. Anyway thanks again for the offer to help resolve things cooperatively, this is a great leap of forward progress. If there is any cause you feel needs to be addressed, you can also call me at 707-477-4102. your eternal servant, puranjana dasa]
How the Prabhupadanugas will win
The rtiviks are winning this whole dispute anyway. Look at the first living guru maniac on the block, Tamal Krishna Goswami. Does anyone worship him now? Hardly no one does. OK maybe a few people do. Does anyone even discuss him now? Hardly ever, except to say he is the founder father of the homosexual meassiahs program. Has anyone hardly even heard Tamal's name lately? Nope. He is irrelevant, personna non grata. Nobody now cares for him because he preached that you need a living person, so when he died, people abandoned his program an went elsewhere. His program fizzled.
Gaura Govinda maharaha? I saw e-mails from his group recently, he has maybe fifty followers there, who were calling each other names and complaining their group is "small and always fighting." Does anyone care about him anymore? Nope. Discuss him anymore etc.? Nope. And how many worship him now? Hardly nobody. Look at most of these other gurus like Harikesha, Ramesvara, Bhagavan, Satsvarupa, Ravindra swarupa, Prithu, Rohini Kumar, Trivrikrama and so many others, do they have any substantial following? Hardly any.
Do they have a large following? No way Jose! Look at the empty USA temples, there is hardly anyone there. Berkeley has maybe ten people for the past 15 years, its a ghost town. San Francisco has no temple at all. Los Angeles has some imported people from Latin America the former Soviet Union, even then -- there is not many folks there either. Westerners from the USA are not joining in any numbers, maybey they get a few here and there. OK its dead as a doornail. New York has to run a Bingo hall to collect money, there is not enough devotees there to collect funds (ok book distribution is down to a trickle).
Satsvarupa was living atop a shop in a small apartment with a few people who were writing that "no one is donating funds to the Satsvarupa maintenence program." Duh. Nobody cares for him either. Who wants to donate money to print books like "Sanitorium, how me and my therapist became sexual lovers." Nobody cares. Boston temple has reportly got rats in the basement and not enough money to clean the place up. New Vrndavana is falling aprt, Gita Nagari looks like a trash heap, and one farm sold their cows for slaughter because there was no one left. Their program is dying. Our program is growing because we do not worhip one temporary person for a few years, we worship the eternal pure devotee Srila Prabhupada. So we will continue to grow, they will continue to die, and when their leaders die look at what happen, their program fizzles, so its just a question of time and we win. ys pd